RE: Nissan Z - the next gen
Tuesday 17th September 2013
Nissan is preparing to go radical with its next Z-car and not in the direction that many of us many us would have predicted or, perhaps, wanted.
Take the traditional Z format...Right now the brawny six-cylinder 370Z lags behind the lighter, nimbler, younger flat-four Toyota GT86, but if you think Nissan will be taking the fight to that or the forthcoming Mazda/Alfa MX-5, you'd be wrong, or so we hear.
...sprinkle in a bit of yoof friendly ZEOD...Nissan will also want to address falling sales of the Z cars. As much we have a soft spot for the coupe and roadster, the truth is we're not buying them in significant quantities. In the whole of Europe to the end of July, Nissan sold just 469 of the 370Z. That's a wet Monday morning's worth of sales for the Qashqai and a big reason why Nissan in the UK slashed the price by £3,000 back in May.
...and bid farewell to all this!There'll be plenty to attract traditional Nissan Z-buyers, he reckons. "It'll be smaller, lighter [than the current Z] but not less powerful. There'll always be a high-powered Nismo edition too."
Nissan Z - the next gen
With a concept due at Tokyo PH talks to Nissan about the replacement for the 370Z
Take the traditional Z format...
At the Frankfurt motor show the company's vice president, Brit Andy Palmer, said the new car needs a broader appeal, and that means electric powertrains.
"To me the GT86 and that traditional sleek sports car is very nice but that's not the way I'd like to address the next generation of sports car drivers," he said. The way he tells it, Nissan is looking at alarm at the falling numbers of youngsters taking their driving test and wants to reverse that.
"We need to energise those kids and to me that's where the EV powertrain will rule," he said.
...sprinkle in a bit of yoof friendly ZEOD...
The 370Z isn't even that old - it was only launched back in 2009. For a company that prides itself on innovation and successfully reinventing niches that's got to hurt. Hence the rethink and one that we're going to see the results of at the end of November during the Tokyo motor show. It's a concept, but one that Palmer has driven so it's obviously not just a flight-of-fancy studio queen. He describes as "engaging, a real sports car."
...and bid farewell to all this!
Whether or not it'll be purely electric is another question, but with Nissan spending a big chunk of its marketing budget by going into Le Mans next year with an experimentalelectric racer it'd be hard to bet against another roll of the EV dice.
Discussion
I think I'm beginning to care less about whether or not it's a hybrid or range extender or whatever, and more about the overall package and handling of the car.
Maybe it's the accumulated trickle down effect the 918/P1/LaFerrari in action but I don't really mind if the car has an electric motor or two on board or if it has some form of KERS or regenerative braking and whatnot.
It would be nice if they did choose to make it ultra light weight and went with a lithe conventional combustion engine. Problem is, if in 5 years time we're in the middle of WW3 and the only thing available is an intermittent supply of electricity, these plug in cars will be a God send! We should start thinking more like 'preppers' and keep the apocalypse in mind when buying cars.
Maybe it's the accumulated trickle down effect the 918/P1/LaFerrari in action but I don't really mind if the car has an electric motor or two on board or if it has some form of KERS or regenerative braking and whatnot.
It would be nice if they did choose to make it ultra light weight and went with a lithe conventional combustion engine. Problem is, if in 5 years time we're in the middle of WW3 and the only thing available is an intermittent supply of electricity, these plug in cars will be a God send! We should start thinking more like 'preppers' and keep the apocalypse in mind when buying cars.
I can just see young people clammering for and EV. Not!
WTF has electric power got to do with young people buying cars? They aren't not buying them because they have engines. I'd make a GT86 rival next but with more power. Hybrid/electric cars are still a long way from being acceptable alternatives for most wanting sports cars.
WTF has electric power got to do with young people buying cars? They aren't not buying them because they have engines. I'd make a GT86 rival next but with more power. Hybrid/electric cars are still a long way from being acceptable alternatives for most wanting sports cars.
Surely "the kids" are just snapping up all the lovely 350z's on the second hand market? You can get some real bargins out there on a beautiful piece of car. I'm not sure why they'd want to excplictly target new younger drivers with a performance car thats going to be sold for £40K? and no doubt the EV train pushes that up higher. The reason nobody is buying 370's is they dont offer enough over the 350's, styling wise I prefer the 350's, yes the 370 has a slicker interior, but it doesn't quite have the looks or the sound so whats the real reason to switch?
I'll say this again, just in case Nissan are listening. It's time to revive the S platform and bring back the 200SX. It would be a direct rival to the GT86/BRZ and so long as it was priced well, would sell in bucketloads. The Z/ZX and the SX could co-exist, there's no reason why both can't have exclusive target markets.
Frimley111R said:
WTF has electric power got to do with young people buying cars? They aren't not buying them because they have engines. I'd make a GT86 rival next but with more power. Hybrid/electric cars are still a long way from being acceptable alternatives for most wanting sports cars.
Agree. I guess the reason people aren't taking their test is that driving and getting a licence is just too much. Driving lessons are expensive. Insurance is crazy. Petrol is crippling. If I was 17 now I'd probably still take my test, but then I love cars, I very much doubt I'd have ended up with a car.Frimley111R said:
I can just see young people clammering for and EV. Not!
Half the people the car manufacturers are going for in the Asian markets have never owned a car before. They've probably never seen a 240Z or a big Healey. They do, however, have an iPhone.I don't think anybody - a few green zealots aside - is clammering for an EV specifically. A lot of 'Generation Y' types will want something with cutting-edge technology, though. If they deem that to be electric propulsion they'll buy it.
Easy to say with hindsight, but a big-engined, 2 seater, powerful coupe from a non-German manufacturer was always going to struggle unless it offered something sufficiently different or was noticeably cheaper than the competition. I think the Z failed on both counts.
Don't get me wrong, I like the car and admire Nissan for producing it, but - dare I say it - it was a relic before it was even released. Thirsty, big-engined cars from non-premium manufacturers are not going to be a sales success in the modern european marketplace.
Shame. Probably would have sold more with a diesel engine. :|
Don't get me wrong, I like the car and admire Nissan for producing it, but - dare I say it - it was a relic before it was even released. Thirsty, big-engined cars from non-premium manufacturers are not going to be a sales success in the modern european marketplace.
Shame. Probably would have sold more with a diesel engine. :|
Already launched and for sale on Ebay....
http://www.ebay.co.uk/bhp/scalextric-nissan
In all seriousness it's a stupid idea, I can't see "kids" rushing out to spend their hard earned on an electric car when there are so many used bargains around with old fashioned low maintenance petrol burning engines. Much cooler too IMO
http://www.ebay.co.uk/bhp/scalextric-nissan
In all seriousness it's a stupid idea, I can't see "kids" rushing out to spend their hard earned on an electric car when there are so many used bargains around with old fashioned low maintenance petrol burning engines. Much cooler too IMO
IMHO it doesn't matter what Nissan does with the next Z, it will struggle in Europe regardless, even if it is the best drivers car in class, best sounding, with the best quality interior while being the most efficient.
The general public cares more about image and will simply buy a car from a so-called cooler brand. Unfortunately 'Nissan' isn't seen as cool in the UK or Europe from what I can see, the Audi TT by comparison is seen more as an aspirational car by joe public... even if it ends up being s
tter by all the above measures.
That's the unfortunate state of affairs in Europe. Doesn't seem to be an issue in the US though.
Must say I have always had a soft spot for the Z...
The general public cares more about image and will simply buy a car from a so-called cooler brand. Unfortunately 'Nissan' isn't seen as cool in the UK or Europe from what I can see, the Audi TT by comparison is seen more as an aspirational car by joe public... even if it ends up being s
tter by all the above measures.That's the unfortunate state of affairs in Europe. Doesn't seem to be an issue in the US though.
Must say I have always had a soft spot for the Z...
Once fossil fule cars become banned in city centres then people including the young will be all over EV cars. Given the fanatic following the GT-R has had for so many years it seems odd that Nissan cannot use that in anyway. I just thought the 370Z looked dull Audi TT dull. The old Datsun 240Z was a great looking (if not a car that stolm cues from other iconic cars) it was also well loved. Renault are breathing life back into the their range.
Come on Nissan.
Come on Nissan.
if there was somehow a way to make hybrids sound and feel truly sporty (which appears to be the aspiration of the new Z) then i'm all up for it, 'tis progress after all 
at the end of the day for me, the determinant is largely based on the visceral feel/experience of the car... if it happens to be a hybrid, who cares!
Respect to Nissan for continuing to pursue with the Z, especially after experiencing the effects of a similar commercial environment back in the 90s, i.e., when Nissan bailed on the z/zx during the z32/z33 hiatus before ghosn decided to revive the Z.
at the end of the day for me, the determinant is largely based on the visceral feel/experience of the car... if it happens to be a hybrid, who cares!
Respect to Nissan for continuing to pursue with the Z, especially after experiencing the effects of a similar commercial environment back in the 90s, i.e., when Nissan bailed on the z/zx during the z32/z33 hiatus before ghosn decided to revive the Z.
The reason the 370 hasn't sold very well is nothing to do with it not being a step up from the 350. As an owner of both a 350 which I traded for a 370 I can safely say it was a step up, far more refined interior, better power output, better styling. It's an evolution. The reason it hasn't sold is because in the real world MPG of low 20s and high tax, coupled with Nissan dealerships that feel like you're walking in to a shop for the elderly is a complete turn off. It's also been overshadowded by it's big brother, the GTR.
RIP Z Brand.
RIP Z Brand.
There are other markets apart from Europe, probably far larger too, Japan, America etc etc Sometimes we dont even see cars that have been released in Japan and other markets, its not all about sales in just Europe
I bought a 350z this year and there were numerous reasons why i choose that over the 370z, however much of a better all around package the 370z may be. To the comparison people have made to german marques, a M3 was well within budget and although again it may be a better package i was not inspired, not everyone wants German, which is probably why you will find the 350z was relatively successful, i just dont see the 370z was enough of a step forward to take buyers away from the 2nd hand market of the 370z, it needed to be more, perhaps in a lot of ways like each generation of M3.
Maybe this was like the days of the 240z compared to the 270z?? The 240z was far more desirable, not necessarily better.
Be sad to see the Z badge reduced to electric though, maybe people are right in a Nissan should focus on a GT86 beater, they are more than capable.
I bought a 350z this year and there were numerous reasons why i choose that over the 370z, however much of a better all around package the 370z may be. To the comparison people have made to german marques, a M3 was well within budget and although again it may be a better package i was not inspired, not everyone wants German, which is probably why you will find the 350z was relatively successful, i just dont see the 370z was enough of a step forward to take buyers away from the 2nd hand market of the 370z, it needed to be more, perhaps in a lot of ways like each generation of M3.
Maybe this was like the days of the 240z compared to the 270z?? The 240z was far more desirable, not necessarily better.
Be sad to see the Z badge reduced to electric though, maybe people are right in a Nissan should focus on a GT86 beater, they are more than capable.
Kids want EV? Right..
The 370Z isn't selling because the 'fun' doesn't tally with the cost of ownership.
Tax/fuel/tyres; it's all expensive but it's a GT pretending to be a sports car and they don't have the image to compete with the 911 or the Jag XK etc.
Keep the styling and the image, but downsize the whole package.. it's a 2-seater, it doesn't need to weigh 1600kg and have 320bhp. Putting batteries in it will make it just make it more expensive and handle worse than it does, which is the opposite of what is required.
The 370Z isn't selling because the 'fun' doesn't tally with the cost of ownership.
Tax/fuel/tyres; it's all expensive but it's a GT pretending to be a sports car and they don't have the image to compete with the 911 or the Jag XK etc.
Keep the styling and the image, but downsize the whole package.. it's a 2-seater, it doesn't need to weigh 1600kg and have 320bhp. Putting batteries in it will make it just make it more expensive and handle worse than it does, which is the opposite of what is required.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff