Blown Turbo ????
Discussion
Has anyone here suffered from blown turbo's on their M12? My car has only down 11k miles so i'm somewhat surprised that apparently my rear turbo has gone south. It's off to Turbo Technics for an overhaul but after 11k?
This bill will now get added to the LSD I've just had to have fitted 'cos the original diff failed.
This is going to be an expensive month
>> Edited by Siban on Wednesday 12th October 21:03
This bill will now get added to the LSD I've just had to have fitted 'cos the original diff failed.
This is going to be an expensive month
>> Edited by Siban on Wednesday 12th October 21:03
MATT!!! Usualy the front bank turbo fails due to insufficent cool down time, the front bank turbo runs considerably hotter than the rear and as such oil can carbonise on the bearings leading to rapid wear if sufficent idle time isn't employed before switching off.
However the rear bank turbo has considerable air space around it compared to the front bank turbo and tends to last twice as long as a result. I'm very surprised you have a rear bank turbo failiure as its not something we see very often at all.
A basic rebuild with new seals and bearings + re-balance is around £375 + VAT. Rear bank turbo change is 1 to 2 hours + cost of gaskets and washers (circa £30).
Best Regards
Matt
>> Edited by matt_fp on Wednesday 12th October 13:07
However the rear bank turbo has considerable air space around it compared to the front bank turbo and tends to last twice as long as a result. I'm very surprised you have a rear bank turbo failiure as its not something we see very often at all.
A basic rebuild with new seals and bearings + re-balance is around £375 + VAT. Rear bank turbo change is 1 to 2 hours + cost of gaskets and washers (circa £30).
Best Regards
Matt
>> Edited by matt_fp on Wednesday 12th October 13:07
Mine mysteriously went after only 4200 miles and cost £600 plus VAT, fortunately covered under the extended warranty i have.
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=159271&f=26&h=0&hw=adparker
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=159271&f=26&h=0&hw=adparker
matt fp said:
Usualy the front bank turbo fails due to insufficent cool down time, the front bank turbo runs considerably hotter than the rear and as such oil can carbonise on the bearings leading to rapid wear if sufficent idle time isn't employed before switching off.
Matt - how long is sufficient? Just so it's not 'as a piece of string' a few scenarios below to consider. Thx.
1. Normal street-legal run round the roads
2. Thrash round the roads
3. 15 mins on track + cool down lap
4. 25 mins on track + cool down lap
robp said:
Matt - how long is sufficient? Just so it's not 'as a piece of string' a few scenarios below to consider. Thx.
1. Normal street-legal run round the roads
2. Thrash round the roads
3. 15 mins on track + cool down lap
4. 25 mins on track + cool down lap
All in my humble opinion/experience
1. 30 seconds
2. 60 seconds
3. When the front bank turbo turbine housing stops glowing + 60 seconds
4. As Above
Even when driving on the road its a good idea to do a "cool down" lap i.e. keep it off boost for the last half mile of your journey.
Also to ensure happy long lived turbo's we recommend an oil change every 4K miles for road cars and 3K miles for tracked road cars.
Hope this helps.
Best Regards
Matt
matt_fp said:
Also to ensure happy long lived turbo's we recommend an oil change every 4K miles for road cars and 3K miles for tracked road cars.
Best Regards
Matt
Matt, perhaps silly question but are the turbos lubricated from the sump oil supply or do they have their own seperate supply?
amg merc said:
Matt, perhaps silly question but are the turbos lubricated from the sump oil supply or do they have their own seperate supply?
They are lubricated by sump oil/the same oil as the engine.
In simple terms pressurised oil from the engine feeds the turbo CHRA before returning (under lower pressure) to the sump via the oil returns.
Best Regards
Matt
This is why I swear by the oil temp gauge in the Noble. I sometimes do two cooldown laps if I have to - I want the gauge down to about 100 and I often let the car sit with the clam open for a good 5 mins in the pits to get it cool enough to turn off. No probs with turbos after about 15000 track miles on a 2.5L and 3.0L engine.
brianJ said:
Curious then that Noble don't give you such sensble advice?
They do. If you search on here you will find advice from Micknall that is essentially the same as Matts, and certainly my supplying dealer gave me similar advice when I picked up car number 26.
It's also a bit of "business as usual" for turbo based cars. Turbos glowing red hot aren't going to survive very long if you don't let them dissipate that heat. I distinctly remember the manual on the old MG Turbo that my teacher had having a warning about allowing 5 minutes of idling before turning off the ignition.
Also, all turbo's aren't built "equal" due to the massive forces involved. I've had turbos last 30,000 and 2,000 miles in the Ur and not changed the driving characteristics.
Simon, if you think that the failure is "unreasonable" then speak to the supplying dealer. Regardless of warranty offered, all goods must be supplied to a "reasonable" standard. Unfortunatly "reasonable" can only be determined by a court of law, but clearly normal common sense and business plays into account if things fail when they really shouldn't have given the treatment (clearly if a car has had hard track use then turbo life will be shorter than a car that had only been 'driven around town', but I'm sure you'll get the idea).
J
>> Edited by joust on Wednesday 12th October 20:38
Need to be a little careful what I say here, but having spoken to a certain Turbo expert on this forum as well as the factory today, there is a common view that this is a very rare thing to happen. The fact is that the Turbo's appeared fine before they were removed as part of the engine removal to fit the new diff.
Was there a hidden problem with the bearing/seals prior to removal? Can't tell but given my car is low mileage, it's the rear turbo, and all appeared fine prior to removal, it certainly raises some questions.
A tough one.
Was there a hidden problem with the bearing/seals prior to removal? Can't tell but given my car is low mileage, it's the rear turbo, and all appeared fine prior to removal, it certainly raises some questions.
A tough one.
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