Insurance moving camper to their yard after crash
Discussion
My brother crashed his t5 camper into a round about 3 weeks ago. Not 100% how it happened possible black out at wheel. Luckly on him involved.
Vehicle was recovered to local yard by police contractor. We tried to view the van and try to recover personal item (camping gear, dogs bed etc) as the van had door cut off and side windows smashed and the weathers been terrible for the last few weeks. We were not aloud to enter the yard to view the van. Even when my brother made it out of hospital a week later he was not allowed.
The van has now been shipped from Fife to Liverpool without us being told. The insurrance company have said they will package and send up contents of the van.
Our worries is what might go missing. And also if we could get the chance to buy back the van.
Has anyone had this before and where do we stand if we bought the van back would the insurance transport it back up the road for us?
Van was insured as a camper converted from new amd on an agreed value policy.
Vehicle was recovered to local yard by police contractor. We tried to view the van and try to recover personal item (camping gear, dogs bed etc) as the van had door cut off and side windows smashed and the weathers been terrible for the last few weeks. We were not aloud to enter the yard to view the van. Even when my brother made it out of hospital a week later he was not allowed.
The van has now been shipped from Fife to Liverpool without us being told. The insurrance company have said they will package and send up contents of the van.
Our worries is what might go missing. And also if we could get the chance to buy back the van.
Has anyone had this before and where do we stand if we bought the van back would the insurance transport it back up the road for us?
Van was insured as a camper converted from new amd on an agreed value policy.
It's his property. He should not have been denied access to it and should have called the police when he was. And it should not have been moved hundreds of miles away without his permission. He needs to get on to his insurers and raise an official complaint. Also give them a comprehensive list of all the property he wanted to remove from the van and hold them fully responsible for the safe return of everything.
No proof yet about medical side of things.
That was polices first thought. But he did have clutch, flywheel and brakes done 3 days before.
He did say he can only remember going through a set of lights and then in the ambulance. But lights were 3/4 mile away in a small village with cars parked either side.
But i supose a hard knock to head with black eye and broken jaw might do that. Not to mention broken lower back.
That was polices first thought. But he did have clutch, flywheel and brakes done 3 days before.
He did say he can only remember going through a set of lights and then in the ambulance. But lights were 3/4 mile away in a small village with cars parked either side.
But i supose a hard knock to head with black eye and broken jaw might do that. Not to mention broken lower back.
vw_99 said:
No proof yet about medical side of things.
That was polices first thought. But he did have clutch, flywheel and brakes done 3 days before.
He did say he can only remember going through a set of lights and then in the ambulance. But lights were 3/4 mile away in a small village with cars parked either side.
But i supose a hard knock to head with black eye and broken jaw might do that. Not to mention broken lower back.
Poor old thing. All needs to be disclosed
That was polices first thought. But he did have clutch, flywheel and brakes done 3 days before.
He did say he can only remember going through a set of lights and then in the ambulance. But lights were 3/4 mile away in a small village with cars parked either side.
But i supose a hard knock to head with black eye and broken jaw might do that. Not to mention broken lower back.
Poor old thing. All needs to be disclosed
vw_99 said:
No proof yet about medical side of things.
That was polices first thought. But he did have clutch, flywheel and brakes done 3 days before.
He did say he can only remember going through a set of lights and then in the ambulance. But lights were 3/4 mile away in a small village with cars parked either side.
But i supose a hard knock to head with black eye and broken jaw might do that. Not to mention broken lower back.
To he fair the police will do that anyway to the insurance company and DVLA if there is any suggestion that he has suffered a medical episode that caused the collision. That was polices first thought. But he did have clutch, flywheel and brakes done 3 days before.
He did say he can only remember going through a set of lights and then in the ambulance. But lights were 3/4 mile away in a small village with cars parked either side.
But i supose a hard knock to head with black eye and broken jaw might do that. Not to mention broken lower back.
vw_99 said:
My brother crashed his t5 camper into a round about 3 weeks ago. Not 100% how it happened possible black out at wheel. Luckly on him involved.
Vehicle was recovered to local yard by police contractor. We tried to view the van and try to recover personal item (camping gear, dogs bed etc) as the van had door cut off and side windows smashed and the weathers been terrible for the last few weeks. We were not aloud to enter the yard to view the van. Even when my brother made it out of hospital a week later he was not allowed.
The van has now been shipped from Fife to Liverpool without us being told. The insurrance company have said they will package and send up contents of the van.
Our worries is what might go missing. And also if we could get the chance to buy back the van.
Has anyone had this before and where do we stand if we bought the van back would the insurance transport it back up the road for us?
Van was insured as a camper converted from new amd on an agreed value policy.
I suspect the police will want to investigate the incident to some extent, which means the vehicle gets treated as something of a crime scene.Vehicle was recovered to local yard by police contractor. We tried to view the van and try to recover personal item (camping gear, dogs bed etc) as the van had door cut off and side windows smashed and the weathers been terrible for the last few weeks. We were not aloud to enter the yard to view the van. Even when my brother made it out of hospital a week later he was not allowed.
The van has now been shipped from Fife to Liverpool without us being told. The insurrance company have said they will package and send up contents of the van.
Our worries is what might go missing. And also if we could get the chance to buy back the van.
Has anyone had this before and where do we stand if we bought the van back would the insurance transport it back up the road for us?
Van was insured as a camper converted from new amd on an agreed value policy.
Some of those police 'facilities' are very much not open to the public.
The vehicle may be categorised as never to go back on the road.
Small print of insurance policy may say it's in the insurance company's hands now.
If it's had doors ripped off, you should not want it back.
It was just a van, your brother's health is the thing which matters.
After my crash in December I was allowed access to toiling company compound the next day to get tools etc out of works van.
It was in a secure compound with strict access demands (forms to be filled in with photo ID etc) and cctv everywhere and warnings about photos etc of mine or other vehicles in there as they were all judged to be crime scenes.
Luckily enough it was only 5 mile from my house.
It was in a secure compound with strict access demands (forms to be filled in with photo ID etc) and cctv everywhere and warnings about photos etc of mine or other vehicles in there as they were all judged to be crime scenes.
Luckily enough it was only 5 mile from my house.
OutInTheShed said:
I suspect the police will want to investigate the incident to some extent, which means the vehicle gets treated as something of a crime scene.
Some of those police 'facilities' are very much not open to the public.
The vehicle may be categorised as never to go back on the road.
Small print of insurance policy may say it's in the insurance company's hands now.
If it's had doors ripped off, you should not want it back.
It was just a van, your brother's health is the thing which matters.
The facility may not be open to the public, and the vehicle may be a crime scene. But after that, the OP should have the option of getting it back or looking at it, as it's his. The stuff in it is his. Suppose he only had tp insurance. No insurance co would be involved, and the van is his. Some of those police 'facilities' are very much not open to the public.
The vehicle may be categorised as never to go back on the road.
Small print of insurance policy may say it's in the insurance company's hands now.
If it's had doors ripped off, you should not want it back.
It was just a van, your brother's health is the thing which matters.
The vehicle maybe can't go back on the road. maybe the OP doesn't want it to go back on the road. Maybe he wants to turn is into a piece of modern art. It's no one's f
king business, as it's his property. There is no small print in insurance policies, just normal sized print people are too lazy to read. But there is nothing that would allow an insurance company to take their customers property without consent. You cannot legalise theft by contract. Suppose he wakes up tomorrow and decides to withdraw the claim? Can't he do that? Until he's been offered a figure for it, agreed the figure and got paid out, the van is his, and should not be moved across the country without his say so.
I agree he should not want the van back, but what you or I think someone else should do with their own property isn't really important.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
The facility may not be open to the public, and the vehicle may be a crime scene. But after that, the OP should have the option of getting it back or looking at it, as it's his. The stuff in it is his. Suppose he only had tp insurance. No insurance co would be involved, and the van is his.
The vehicle maybe can't go back on the road. maybe the OP doesn't want it to go back on the road. Maybe he wants to turn is into a piece of modern art. It's no one's fking business, as it's his property.
There is no small print in insurance policies, just normal sized print people are too lazy to read. But there is nothing that would allow an insurance company to take their customers property without consent. You cannot legalise theft by contract. Suppose he wakes up tomorrow and decides to withdraw the claim? Can't he do that? Until he's been offered a figure for it, agreed the figure and got paid out, the van is his, and should not be moved across the country without his say so.
I agree he should not want the van back, but what you or I think someone else should do with their own property isn't really important.
AIUI, insurance companies are legally obliged to take CAT A and CAT B cars out of circulation.The vehicle maybe can't go back on the road. maybe the OP doesn't want it to go back on the road. Maybe he wants to turn is into a piece of modern art. It's no one's f
king business, as it's his property. There is no small print in insurance policies, just normal sized print people are too lazy to read. But there is nothing that would allow an insurance company to take their customers property without consent. You cannot legalise theft by contract. Suppose he wakes up tomorrow and decides to withdraw the claim? Can't he do that? Until he's been offered a figure for it, agreed the figure and got paid out, the van is his, and should not be moved across the country without his say so.
I agree he should not want the van back, but what you or I think someone else should do with their own property isn't really important.
Possibly it's actually been sent to a breaker's by the police rather than the insurance company.
Once some vehicles have been in some crashes, they are not available to their 'owner'.
A chap I was in touch with on a bike forum had his bike written off, he wanted it back just for engine internals. He didn't get it.
Cat A vehicle, particularly in a serious injury accident, all you can argue about is the payout, and if you're insured TPO, too bad.
There's a well known breakers' yard near Southampton which frequently gets vehicles delivered by police trucks, straight to the secure area, a few personal effects might get put in a cardboard box before the car gets cubed. The only other things they remove are fluids like fuel and oil, the battery and other recycleable stuff.
I suspect one forfeits certain property when it's smashed up on the highway in the hands of the Police and Fire Services.
I dunno exactly what law that's framed in, but I think that's pretty much the rules of the game.
Also if you look round the back of the fire station, you'll see car's they've been practising on.
" careful chaps, someone might want to repair this!' is not in their phrasebook.
The OP's brother needs to talk to the insurer.
OutInTheShed said:
AIUI, insurance companies are legally obliged to take CAT A and CAT B cars out of circulation.
Only if they deal with the claim. But the vehicle is your property until such point as you agree a settlement and get paid. The insurers can refuse to let you have the salvage as part of their conditions of settling the claim, but you can choose to withdraw the claim or not claim in the first place. If he had tpo cover, or no insurance, who would be taking the vehicle out of circulation then?? There would be no insurance company. And what about the stuff in the vehicle. What right does anyone have to move your atlas, sunglasses, purse full of loose change for parking, stuff in the back, hundreds of miles across the country without your permission?
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Only if they deal with the claim. But the vehicle is your property until such point as you agree a settlement and get paid. The insurers can refuse to let you have the salvage as part of their conditions of settling the claim, but you can choose to withdraw the claim or not claim in the first place. If he had tpo cover, or no insurance, who would be taking the vehicle out of circulation then?? There would be no insurance company.
And what about the stuff in the vehicle. What right does anyone have to move your atlas, sunglasses, purse full of loose change for parking, stuff in the back, hundreds of miles across the country without your permission?
it's not about freeman of the land 'you can't take my chattels!, give me back my sunglasses and road atlas!' stuff.And what about the stuff in the vehicle. What right does anyone have to move your atlas, sunglasses, purse full of loose change for parking, stuff in the back, hundreds of miles across the country without your permission?
I suspect it's the police taking these vehicles out of circulation in some cases.
In others, the owner has agreed in the terms and conditions to allow the insurance company to do what they do in the circumstances.
You might, theoretically, have the right to cancel your agreement with the insurer and not make a claim, but that might have serious consequences when the authorities start sending out bills.
I'm not sure exactly what law enables the Cat A/Cat B system, or the details of the mechanics of it, but the essence of it is someone decides those vehicles get crushed and the owner doesn't have much say in that.
I know of people who've tried to fight it and got nowhere.
As for theorising about cars with no insurance, tens of thousands of those have been crushed without being Cat Anything, I guess they're Cat A now.
With the drivers door being removed or cut to get him out id assume its going to be written off. We are not looking to put the van back on the road.
But we would like to be able to go and remove anything we wanted rather than relying on someone else to do it. For example to 2 new gas bottles in the van that could be used for my dads camper. I dont think they will be posted back to us.
My brother is recovering well so thats one thing off my mind. But i can tell this is all stressing him out a bit. If it was his car it can be replaced easy like for like. But the van where it can be replaced like for like the items inside cant so easily. Sleeping bags, dogs bed pots pans etc.
But we would like to be able to go and remove anything we wanted rather than relying on someone else to do it. For example to 2 new gas bottles in the van that could be used for my dads camper. I dont think they will be posted back to us.
My brother is recovering well so thats one thing off my mind. But i can tell this is all stressing him out a bit. If it was his car it can be replaced easy like for like. But the van where it can be replaced like for like the items inside cant so easily. Sleeping bags, dogs bed pots pans etc.
OutInTheShed said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Only if they deal with the claim. But the vehicle is your property until such point as you agree a settlement and get paid. The insurers can refuse to let you have the salvage as part of their conditions of settling the claim, but you can choose to withdraw the claim or not claim in the first place. If he had tpo cover, or no insurance, who would be taking the vehicle out of circulation then?? There would be no insurance company.
And what about the stuff in the vehicle. What right does anyone have to move your atlas, sunglasses, purse full of loose change for parking, stuff in the back, hundreds of miles across the country without your permission?
it's not about freeman of the land 'you can't take my chattels!, give me back my sunglasses and road atlas!' stuff.And what about the stuff in the vehicle. What right does anyone have to move your atlas, sunglasses, purse full of loose change for parking, stuff in the back, hundreds of miles across the country without your permission?
I suspect it's the police taking these vehicles out of circulation in some cases.
In others, the owner has agreed in the terms and conditions to allow the insurance company to do what they do in the circumstances.
You might, theoretically, have the right to cancel your agreement with the insurer and not make a claim, but that might have serious consequences when the authorities start sending out bills.
I'm not sure exactly what law enables the Cat A/Cat B system, or the details of the mechanics of it, but the essence of it is someone decides those vehicles get crushed and the owner doesn't have much say in that.
I know of people who've tried to fight it and got nowhere.
As for theorising about cars with no insurance, tens of thousands of those have been crushed without being Cat Anything, I guess they're Cat A now.
OutInTheShed said:
it's not about freeman of the land 'you can't take my chattels!, give me back my sunglasses and road atlas!' stuff.
I'm not sure that being the boss of what happens to your own property that you've bought and paid for is quite the same as claiming to be a freeman of the land. poo at Paul's said:
He’s quite correct though. Until it’s settled and paid out on it’s his, not the insurance company’s nor the police’s.
That doesn't mean it's not the police and insurance company who have control of the vehicle.Do you have anything to add about how these situations work in reality, as opposed to vague theories about 'ownership'?
Maybe it would be more useful to consider that the ins co own the vehicle post incident and owe the insured a payout for it?
That would seem consistent with what actually happens after a crash where a vehicle gets cat A or B?
OP, Did your brother contact his insurance company after the crash and start a claim rolling? If so, the movement of the van will be authorised by the insurance company to reduce the storage charges from the Police recovery company.
It will not be the Police trying to remove the damaged vehicle from circulation.
It will not be the Police trying to remove the damaged vehicle from circulation.
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