Traffic incident- What will the insurers do?

[Swerve17]

Hi guys, had an incident yesterday and I'd just like to hear what you guys have to say on who's fault it was.

It happened at this junction. I was turning right into the Esso fuel station coming from the opposite direction that we are facing on google maps.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.755532,-1.712628...

Basically, I'd just come right out of the junction you can see in the distance behind the harvester. As soon as my indicator self cancelled after turning on the main road I flicked it on again in order to make the garage turn. I checked my mirrors, slowed to about 15 mph and placed myself towards the center of the road, the other carriage way was clear so I turned. Bang, Motorcyclist trying to pass me on the right.

He was fine, my cars got a big dent right on the back of the rear quarter and I've got damage to my rear alloy.

He was okay, he did say he didn't see me indicate although I'm 100% certain I was indicating.

One of my biggest worries is an old couple witnessed the collision from behind, immediately came over and prodded me in the chest accusing me of not looking in my mirrors. There's of course no way they could know if I checked or not. I understand that from their point of view they saw me basically turn into the motorcyclist, but he should surely not have been trying to overtake me there?

Am I waving goodbye to my no claims bonus here? I did genuinely check my mirrors and didn't see him.

Thanks for you input.

[Nigel Worc's]

I ride motorcycles and drive .

I am immediately on your side without even witnessing the "incident".

Sorry I can't help you with the legalities or insurance issues, I just find some motorcyclists to be bloody morons regarding overtaking where their brain should tell them not to.

Good luck.

[PurpleMoonlight]

It'll go 50:50.

[Swerve17]

PurpleMoonlight said:

It'll go 50:50.

Even though now I look at it he was attempting to overtake on dashed road markings which I believe the highway code says you can only enter if it is necessary to do so? is an overtake necessary?

[AgentZ]

Although it isn't marked as such, that is a right turn lane for the Harvester and petrol station isn't it?

Why a motorcyclist would think it a good idea to overtake at such a spot I'll never know, but as others have said above insurance will probably go 50:50 at best.

[snapdragon69]

50:50 bad move to overtake there and you should be able to turn right without collecting something that's passing rightly or wrongly. I still have sympathy though. Thanks for the reminder of mirror-signal-mirror-manoeuvre.

[LoonR1]

Tough one. The biker is nt going to get away Scott free under any circumstances, the questions whether you will. You are supposed to loo to your right and check hat nothing is overtaking g you before turning right. You may end up 25-50% liable.

As for NCD if you are wholly or partially at fault the your NCD is affected. You lose 2 years for your first accident in a policy year and the rest if you have a second normally. If it's protected then it won't be affected. NCD protection is NOT a premium guarantee

Edited by LoonR1 on Sunday 4th May 17:45

[llewop]

As you say - the road markings don't encourage overtaking, in fact seem to be trying to close out the temptation - clearly not enough!

Where did the biker claim he came from? same direction as you or down the road you'd turned on to? Either way, there appears to be about 150m between the junction and the entrance to the petrol station - are you sure you have no recollection of seeing him approaching or behind you? Even at 40 mph - the limit for the road as far as I can tell, it would take several seconds to complete the two parts of your manoeuvres.

[dacouch]

llewop said:

As you say - the road markings don't encourage overtaking, in fact seem to be trying to close out the temptation - clearly not enough!

Where did the biker claim he came from? same direction as you or down the road you'd turned on to? Either way, there appears to be about 150m between the junction and the entrance to the petrol station - are you sure you have no recollection of seeing him approaching or behind you? Even at 40 mph - the limit for the road as far as I can tell, it would take several seconds to complete the two parts of your manoeuvres.

The OP's is not clear on his cars position before turning, it looks like he was in the middle of the road but does not state whether that was the middle of the lane of traffic or the turning box.

The motorbike hit him in the rear quarter so it's possible the bike was only just into the hatching or was in the normal lane of traffic

Edited by dacouch on Sunday 4th May 17:58

[Swerve17]

llewop said:

As you say - the road markings don't encourage overtaking, in fact seem to be trying to close out the temptation - clearly not enough!

Where did the biker claim he came from? same direction as you or down the road you'd turned on to? Either way, there appears to be about 150m between the junction and the entrance to the petrol station - are you sure you have no recollection of seeing him approaching or behind you? Even at 40 mph - the limit for the road as far as I can tell, it would take several seconds to complete the two parts of your manoeuvres.

Ever since I can remember my parents have always referred to it as the nasty junction- it's a dangerous piece of road. He was already on the road when I joined it, there was 2 cars on the road when I pulled out, I think he must have been behind them and overtook them to be behind me. It's about 80-100m between the 2 junctions.

I think the biker saw my indicators but assumed they just hadn't cancelled when I pulled out. He accelerated to try and pass me before cars coming from the other direction arrived. By the time he had realized what I was actually doing he had already committed to the move.

I'll feel very aggrieved if I do get any liability, the way I see it he's crashed into the back of me. How can that be my fault?

[Swerve17]

dacouch said:

The motorbike hit him in the rear quarter so it's possible the bike was only just into the hatching or was in the normal lane of traffic

Edited by dacouch on Sunday 4th May 17:58

Even if that was the case then he's just rear ended me?

[Mandat]

Swerve17 said:

PurpleMoonlight said:

It'll go 50:50.

Even though now I look at it he was attempting to overtake on dashed road markings which I believe the highway code says you can only enter if it is necessary to do so? is an overtake necessary?

The question is not whether the overtake itself is necessary, but rather is it necessary to enter the hatching to perform the overtake. It's a subtle but important difference.

[PurpleMoonlight]

Swerve17 said:

Even if that was the case then he's just rear ended me?

But you said your rear quarter panel was dented so didn't he hit the side of you?

[BOF]

These things happen despite our best efforts...in somewhat different conditions I was approaching a roundabout where I wanted the first exit...on the left pavement were three signs at decreasing distances showing nearside lane closure on the exit...

On taking the left turn (mirror check - left indicator) I found the inside lane coned off exactly as expected...(mirrors clear speed to vision...10 mph and right indicator) and moved over.

The biker who missed the offside of my car by what seemed to be 2" sped away - I hope that he st himself at his lack of observation.

Had there been an "accident" I would have shared the costs due to this prick?

I should add that as an IAM Observer I know many bikers, civilian and Police, who spend their time working for road safety - I am not anti bikers - just anti aholes.

BOF

[llewop]

dacouch said:

The OP's is not clear on his cars position before turning, it looks like he was in the middle of the road but does not state whether that was the middle of the lane of traffic or the turning box.

The motorbike hit him in the rear quarter so it's possible the bike was only just into the hatching or was in the normal lane of traffic

He did say 'in the middle of the road' - OP - do you mean in that short middle lane that seems to run as far as the pub and near entrance/exit for the petrol station? or after the hatching etc closes in and turning into the petrol station from the far side? If the first option, overtaking you there seems madness regardless of anything else; if the later, still poor judgement on his side to presume you'd not cancelled your indicator, rather than you might actually be turning, but later than might have been expected. Also, if he'd already apparently passed a couple of other cars, sounds like he's lucky to not suffer much in the way of injury/damage.

[Swerve17]

llewop said:

He did say 'in the middle of the road' - OP - do you mean in that short middle lane that seems to run as far as the pub and near entrance/exit for the petrol station? or after the hatching etc closes in and turning into the petrol station from the far side? If the first option, overtaking you there seems madness regardless of anything else; if the later, still poor judgement on his side to presume you'd not cancelled your indicator, rather than you might actually be turning, but later than might have been expected. Also, if he'd already apparently passed a couple of other cars, sounds like he's lucky to not suffer much in the way of injury/damage.

It was the secondary turn off- The one not shared with the pub. To be honest I do not use this station much and judging by the way all the cars already in the station were facing I went in at the end I did. He went down before hitting my car and slid into it.

[Swerve17]

PurpleMoonlight said:

But you said your rear quarter panel was dented so didn't he hit the side of you?

Notice I said even if that was the case- it wasn't. He would have been in the road markings, he might even have been on the wrong side of the road actually- when he hit me my bumper was pretty much level with the opening of the garage.

[LoonR1]

Swerve17 said:

It was the secondary turn off- The one not shared with the pub. To be honest I do not use this station much and judging by the way all the cars already in the station were facing I went in at the end I did. He went down before hitting my car and slid into it.

That puts a completely different perspective on things. Why do posters insist on holding back some pretty vital info?

[Swerve17]

LoonR1 said:

That puts a completely different perspective on things. Why do posters insist on holding back some pretty vital info?

I'm confused to how thats changed anything I've said?

[LoonR1]

Swerve17 said:

LoonR1 said:

That puts a completely different perspective on things. Why do posters insist on holding back some pretty vital info?

I'm confused to how thats changed anything I've said?

The fact that he didn't ride into you. This is the first time you've mentioned that he was on his arse sliding down the road. In fact your OP below says he was trying to overtake you. I doubt very much that he was trying to overtake whilst sliding down the road. I'd guess he was more likely trying to stop before hitting anything hard.

If you can't see that this latest info completely changes the scenario then I doubt you'll do too well with this

Swerve17 said:

Hi guys, had an incident yesterday and I'd just like to hear what you guys have to say on who's fault it was.

It happened at this junction. I was turning right into the Esso fuel station coming from the opposite direction that we are facing on google maps.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.755532,-1.712628...

Basically, I'd just come right out of the junction you can see in the distance behind the harvester. As soon as my indicator self cancelled after turning on the main road I flicked it on again in order to make the garage turn. I checked my mirrors, slowed to about 15 mph and placed myself towards the center of the road, the other carriage way was clear so I turned. Bang, Motorcyclist trying to pass me on the right.

He was fine, my cars got a big dent right on the back of the rear quarter and I've got damage to my rear alloy.

He was okay, he did say he didn't see me indicate although I'm 100% certain I was indicating.

One of my biggest worries is an old couple witnessed the collision from behind, immediately came over and prodded me in the chest accusing me of not looking in my mirrors. There's of course no way they could know if I checked or not. I understand that from their point of view they saw me basically turn into the motorcyclist, but he should surely not have been trying to overtake me there?

Am I waving goodbye to my no claims bonus here? I did genuinely check my mirrors and didn't see him.

Thanks for you input.