Need to reject vehicle on finance.
Discussion
Long and short of it is this.
Partner bought a bike from a dealership in march of last year, 600 miles on the clock.
First service I raised concerns about notchy head bearings and some rust issues forming on the bike, was told I would be contacted and no one did.
I then get a letter asking to bring the bike back for a final end of warranty inspection (was sold with 3 year warranty, bike is 2 years old)
In this period the bike covered 900 miles (1500 miles on the clock) it doesn't get ridden in the rain, it gets washed and dried, it is kept in the garage (which is dry and fairly free from damp but it is still a garage)
This is the gist of what was submitted on the warranty claim
Conversation started 30 April
30/04/2014 11:57
I have a question for Honda Motorcycles.
I bought a CBF125 from an authorised dealer, had it serviced with the same dealer, August last year with about 900 miles on the clock I noticed some rust starting on the bike, so I had it inspected at the dealership, nothing came of it.
Warranty was due to end and was told to bring it back in where a list was created for warranty work, a little back story the bike has only done 1500 miles, it has full Honda service history, it has never been dropped, it has never been out in the rain, it is always washed down and dried and I keep it in a garage.
On the warranty inspection the following was raised
N/S frame welds on engine mount rusty
N/S headstock welds rusty
N/S Heel plate rusty
N/S gear lever rusty
N/S frame welds all over rusty
N/S chain tight links and failing
N/S rear shock showing signs of rust
N/S welds on genuine Honda top box rack rusty
N/S tax disc holder rusty
N/S Fairing bracket on tank rusty
N/S Tank side has large rust spot
O/S frame welds on engine mount rusty
O/S headstock welds rusty
O/S Heel plate rusty
O/S gear lever rusty
O/S frame welds all over rusty
O/S chain tight links and failing
O/S rear shock showing signs of rust
O/S Exhaust rusting internally
O/S Fairing bracket on tank rusty
Head bearings failed
Top yoke rusting along with wire clips
Bottom yoke rusting along with wire clips
Front wheel tyre valve threads rusty
Swing arm showing signs of rust
Centre stand pivot
Handle bar bracket paint wearing off
Rocker cover gasket leaking
This is a common/known problem with these bikes in fact there is one at the dealership with 7 miles on the clock showing the same rust. This has been rejected for warranty work due to "fair wear and tear on a 2 year old bike" which is frankly bulls
t my Ducati has no rust and that gets treated like a pig.
So the current position we are left in
Paid £1000 off the finance of £2400
The bike has been in the garage for 3 months
Honda refuse to do any warranty work to it
The dealership have done work out of goodwill because they are annoyed with Honda UK's response and lack of wanting to do anything.
Honda refuse to either ring me or the dealership back
Honda have left us paying for a bike we can not use, nor want to use.
Honda have left us with a bike that is practically worthless.
So I need to get the money back that has been paid for it, or get the bike exchanged for one that isn't rusty.
Any help is greatly appreciated
It's a Honda CBF125 if anyone is interested, if you search on line for CBF125 rust you will see loads of pictures and threads about these things, so they are a known problem bike.
Partner bought a bike from a dealership in march of last year, 600 miles on the clock.
First service I raised concerns about notchy head bearings and some rust issues forming on the bike, was told I would be contacted and no one did.
I then get a letter asking to bring the bike back for a final end of warranty inspection (was sold with 3 year warranty, bike is 2 years old)
In this period the bike covered 900 miles (1500 miles on the clock) it doesn't get ridden in the rain, it gets washed and dried, it is kept in the garage (which is dry and fairly free from damp but it is still a garage)
This is the gist of what was submitted on the warranty claim
Conversation started 30 April
30/04/2014 11:57
I have a question for Honda Motorcycles.
I bought a CBF125 from an authorised dealer, had it serviced with the same dealer, August last year with about 900 miles on the clock I noticed some rust starting on the bike, so I had it inspected at the dealership, nothing came of it.
Warranty was due to end and was told to bring it back in where a list was created for warranty work, a little back story the bike has only done 1500 miles, it has full Honda service history, it has never been dropped, it has never been out in the rain, it is always washed down and dried and I keep it in a garage.
On the warranty inspection the following was raised
N/S frame welds on engine mount rusty
N/S headstock welds rusty
N/S Heel plate rusty
N/S gear lever rusty
N/S frame welds all over rusty
N/S chain tight links and failing
N/S rear shock showing signs of rust
N/S welds on genuine Honda top box rack rusty
N/S tax disc holder rusty
N/S Fairing bracket on tank rusty
N/S Tank side has large rust spot
O/S frame welds on engine mount rusty
O/S headstock welds rusty
O/S Heel plate rusty
O/S gear lever rusty
O/S frame welds all over rusty
O/S chain tight links and failing
O/S rear shock showing signs of rust
O/S Exhaust rusting internally
O/S Fairing bracket on tank rusty
Head bearings failed
Top yoke rusting along with wire clips
Bottom yoke rusting along with wire clips
Front wheel tyre valve threads rusty
Swing arm showing signs of rust
Centre stand pivot
Handle bar bracket paint wearing off
Rocker cover gasket leaking
This is a common/known problem with these bikes in fact there is one at the dealership with 7 miles on the clock showing the same rust. This has been rejected for warranty work due to "fair wear and tear on a 2 year old bike" which is frankly bulls
t my Ducati has no rust and that gets treated like a pig.So the current position we are left in
Paid £1000 off the finance of £2400
The bike has been in the garage for 3 months
Honda refuse to do any warranty work to it
The dealership have done work out of goodwill because they are annoyed with Honda UK's response and lack of wanting to do anything.
Honda refuse to either ring me or the dealership back
Honda have left us paying for a bike we can not use, nor want to use.
Honda have left us with a bike that is practically worthless.
So I need to get the money back that has been paid for it, or get the bike exchanged for one that isn't rusty.
Any help is greatly appreciated
It's a Honda CBF125 if anyone is interested, if you search on line for CBF125 rust you will see loads of pictures and threads about these things, so they are a known problem bike.
Edited by pits on Monday 2nd June 20:26
So if I'm not mistaken, you want to reject a bike that bought over a year ago, which was already to years old because it's rusted in that time?
Have you checked to see if it's just surface rust? Is the rust on the actual chassis or on things like the exhaust?
If the bike is 2 years old when you bought it you bought it a year ago it's out of the manufacturers warranty, the dealer may add their own but you can't claim off of Honda for that.
Have you checked to see if it's just surface rust? Is the rust on the actual chassis or on things like the exhaust?
If the bike is 2 years old when you bought it you bought it a year ago it's out of the manufacturers warranty, the dealer may add their own but you can't claim off of Honda for that.
You have a legal relationship with two parties; the dealership who supplied the bike and the finance company.
It sounds as if the bike is not of satisfactory quality as per the requirements of the Sale of Goods Act (see s.14).
You ought to check with your finance provider, but it is likely they will be jointly liable with the supplying dealer under s.75 of the Consumer Credit Act.
It might be worth writing to both the dealership and the finance company giving a detailed list of the faults, which of them are agreed (and any which are not), alongside a chronology, how you want it putting right (be reasonable, I suggest an opportunity to make the bike good or a suitable discount is proportionate) and giving a reasonable timescale to do so. Make it clear that if left unresolved proceedings will be launched against both the dealership and the finance company (assuming your agreement is such that they will also be liable- this you need to confirm with them).
It sounds as if the bike is not of satisfactory quality as per the requirements of the Sale of Goods Act (see s.14).
You ought to check with your finance provider, but it is likely they will be jointly liable with the supplying dealer under s.75 of the Consumer Credit Act.
It might be worth writing to both the dealership and the finance company giving a detailed list of the faults, which of them are agreed (and any which are not), alongside a chronology, how you want it putting right (be reasonable, I suggest an opportunity to make the bike good or a suitable discount is proportionate) and giving a reasonable timescale to do so. Make it clear that if left unresolved proceedings will be launched against both the dealership and the finance company (assuming your agreement is such that they will also be liable- this you need to confirm with them).
Mr SFJ said:
So if I'm not mistaken, you want to reject a bike that bought over a year ago, which was already to years old because it's rusted in that time?
Have you checked to see if it's just surface rust? Is the rust on the actual chassis or on things like the exhaust?
If the bike is 2 years old when you bought it you bought it a year ago it's out of the manufacturers warranty, the dealer may add their own but you can't claim off of Honda for that.
The bike is just two years old now so it is still within manufacturers warranty, it got taken back when they sent a letter telling me my 3 year warranty was running out a year early and they wanted to inspect it, this where I raised issues from August last year when the bike went in for a service.Have you checked to see if it's just surface rust? Is the rust on the actual chassis or on things like the exhaust?
If the bike is 2 years old when you bought it you bought it a year ago it's out of the manufacturers warranty, the dealer may add their own but you can't claim off of Honda for that.
Every single weld is rusty on the frame, we are not talking like little spots we are talking the whole length of every single weld, the exhaust is rusting from the inside out.
Here are the 1500 mile head bearings on my bike
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv9Z1-3r-S0
The dealership have done as much as they can.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz said:
You have a legal relationship with two parties; the dealership who supplied the bike and the finance company.
It sounds as if the bike is not of satisfactory quality as per the requirements of the Sale of Goods Act (see s.14).
You ought to check with your finance provider, but it is likely they will be jointly liable with the supplying dealer under s.75 of the Consumer Credit Act.
It might be worth writing to both the dealership and the finance company giving a detailed list of the faults, which of them are agreed (and any which are not), alongside a chronology, how you want it putting right (be reasonable, I suggest an opportunity to make the bike good or a suitable discount is proportionate) and giving a reasonable timescale to do so. Make it clear that if left unresolved proceedings will be launched against both the dealership and the finance company (assuming your agreement is such that they will also be liable- this you need to confirm with them).
At the moment we are still paying for the bike, no point in cancelling DD or anything silly like that.It sounds as if the bike is not of satisfactory quality as per the requirements of the Sale of Goods Act (see s.14).
You ought to check with your finance provider, but it is likely they will be jointly liable with the supplying dealer under s.75 of the Consumer Credit Act.
It might be worth writing to both the dealership and the finance company giving a detailed list of the faults, which of them are agreed (and any which are not), alongside a chronology, how you want it putting right (be reasonable, I suggest an opportunity to make the bike good or a suitable discount is proportionate) and giving a reasonable timescale to do so. Make it clear that if left unresolved proceedings will be launched against both the dealership and the finance company (assuming your agreement is such that they will also be liable- this you need to confirm with them).
Someone who may or may not work at the dealer may or may not have told me that he would reject it as well.
So far the dealer has offered to do some paint work on the bike, but it doesn't really cure the problem. As it stands the bike has been there for 3 months and Honda refuse to do anything with it apart from say it is fair wear and tear on a 2 year old bike with 1500 miles on it.
Yet the man at Honda wouldn't be happy if his brand new car had structural rust and paint issues.
Honda are a bunch if s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre.
My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. wkers
s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre. My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. w
kers Speak to the finance company and ask them how you can reject the vehicle/hand the vehicle back to them (after all, they own it as reported 
); then arrange to hand the keys (all of them) to the finance bods ASAP in same conversation and ask them to collect said vehicle at their earliest convenience...
Be assertive, ie "I *am* going to hand the keys back at 10AM on Wednesday the eleventieth of Never, where do I do this at 10AM on Wednesday the eleventieth of Never?" etc
); then arrange to hand the keys (all of them) to the finance bods ASAP in same conversation and ask them to collect said vehicle at their earliest convenience...Be assertive, ie "I *am* going to hand the keys back at 10AM on Wednesday the eleventieth of Never, where do I do this at 10AM on Wednesday the eleventieth of Never?" etc
s3fella said:
Honda are a bunch if s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre.
My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. wkers
Your contract is with the dealer that sold you the bike, not Honda UK, and it is they that should be rectifying any issues.s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre. My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. w
kers s3fella said:
Honda are a bunch if s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre.
My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. wkers
Find that hard to argue with. Honda's once pristine reputation is somewhat tarnished these days IMO.s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre. My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. w
kers In another area, 4 years ago I bought a Honda garden tractor. It cost about 60% more than other similarly sized brands. I paid because in the last other Honda products I have had have been faultless.
From day one this machine proved hard to start, though it worked reasonably well in other respects. Thing is, after grumbling about the starting issue, I learned that several other brands use the same basic machine, fitted with different engines, all made in the same Spanish (?) factory. I could have had the same thing for hundreds of pounds less, just with different plastic and type of motor.
To cut a long story etc...... Traded in now for a less expensive brand, bigger machine at over a grand less than the equivalent Honda. This one starts and performs fine.
Honda? Not what they used to be.
PurpleMoonlight said:
s3fella said:
Honda are a bunch if s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre.
My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. wkers
Your contract is with the dealer that sold you the bike, not Honda UK, and it is they that should be rectifying any issues.s when it comes to warranty work or complaints. My 14 plate Honda had a problem only 2 miles into its life on March 1st and Honda have done fk all. Absolutely useless bunch o twerps. 6500 down ten drain, it sits in the garage 3 months old with 17 miles on it, 3 of which is me fking pushing it, the chain is hitting parts of the bike and the rear tyre despite being adjusted to spec, (which, incidentally, it wasn't upon delivery). But it's still Unrideable and would fail an mot would it need one, with chain taking chunks out of the tyre. My advice, don't waste your time with them, get shot of it and buy a Suzuki. Honda build quality is a thing if the past, and their customer service is an absolute joke. Ffs you call Honda UK and speak to someone in Romania or something like that. About a week later you get some school kid call you who doesn't even know whether what the del you have is a car or a motorbike, never mind how to document the problem. w
kers Edited by s3fella on Sunday 15th June 17:41
Edited by s3fella on Sunday 15th June 17:42
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