Photo ID for Speed Awareness Course

[RyanOPlastry]

There is no requirement (Yet) in this country for anyone to have any Photo Identification.

Mrs O'Plastry does not have a passport, and as we have been living at the same address for the last 28 years, does not have a photo driving licence either.

Consequently she cannot attend a speed awareness course as she can't prove who she is. Is it legal to require photo ID or should an alternative method of identification be accepted?

[vonhosen]

If you don't have a photo licence or passport you can't do a driving test now.

[anonymous-user]

As far as I was aware you needed a photo driving licence, at least the one that my mrs went on. Nothing else was to be accepted, what does the form say? No option to ring for advice?

[RyanOPlastry]

vonhosen said:

If you don't have a photo licence or passport you can't do a driving test now.

This is completely irrelevant, you didn't need it when she passed her driving test.

Having a fear of aeroplanes, ships and tunnels, she has never found the need to have a passport.

It would be useful if instead you could point me to the law which requires a person to have photo ID , or to one which entitles an organisation to demand only photo ID.

I am awaiting a response from the appropriate authorities as to what would be an acceptable alternative. I have not yet had a reply and am not optimistic.

[btcc123]

For the speed awareness course you need your paper and photo licence but if you only have the paper licence you can take photographic ID such as a passport.

If you dont have a passport or another form of photographic ID you should ring or E-mail your course provider and ask for their advice.Perhaps a passport photo of you signed by your doctor or bank manager with a letter to confirm that the person in the photo is the person and address on the passport.

Best to check what is ecceptable .

[Sheepshanks]

RyanOPlastry said:

It would be useful if instead you could point me to the law which requires a person to have photo ID , or to one which entitles an organisation to demand only photo ID.

There's no law which say they have to offer your missus a speed awareness course. And there's no law to say she has to do it - she can refuse their offer.

[btcc123]

She also has the option of 3 points and a £100 fine.

Tell her to keep to the speed limits in future.

[KFC]

RyanOPlastry said:

There is no requirement (Yet) in this country for anyone to have any Photo Identification.

Mrs O'Plastry does not have a passport, and as we have been living at the same address for the last 28 years, does not have a photo driving licence either.

Consequently she cannot attend a speed awareness course as she can't prove who she is. Is it legal to require photo ID or should an alternative method of identification be accepted?

Do you think its unreasonable that they'd want to check it actually is her turning up for this? Otherwise it could be absolutely anyone.

She's already shown she has no regard for the law in the first place by speeding, so I don't see how you can then say we should just take her word for it that its really her signing in the awareness course


I've always thought it a bit weird that you dont need to have (or carry with you) photo id when driving a car in the UK.
I can't think of another developed western nation where you can get pulled over by the police for a speeding offence and they just take your word for it as to who you are. Try that in spain, france, italy etc and you won't get very far.

[Bigends]

KFC said:

RyanOPlastry said:

There is no requirement (Yet) in this country for anyone to have any Photo Identification.

Mrs O'Plastry does not have a passport, and as we have been living at the same address for the last 28 years, does not have a photo driving licence either.

Consequently she cannot attend a speed awareness course as she can't prove who she is. Is it legal to require photo ID or should an alternative method of identification be accepted?

Do you think its unreasonable that they'd want to check it actually is her turning up for this? Otherwise it could be absolutely anyone.

She's already shown she has no regard for the law in the first place by speeding, so I don't see how you can then say we should just take her word for it that its really her signing in the awareness course


I've always thought it a bit weird that you dont need to have (or carry with you) photo id when driving a car in the UK.
I can't think of another developed western nation where you can get pulled over by the police for a speeding offence and they just take your word for it as to who you are. Try that in spain, france, italy etc and you won't get very far.

What if you forget your photo i.d. when stopped - just popped up the shops officer - forgot my wallet.
What happens then - arrest for not having it on you?
Dont really think we want to go down that route

[ging84]

epic preaching
the OP hasn't actually even said his wife has been caught speeding
Just asking the questions

I'm sure it will turn out she is a fantastic driver who never exceeds the speeding limit, not even when drunk or texting
And that this whole thread is hypothetical, or she will have turned out to be one of those caught doing 32 in a 30 by a misreading speed gun.

[vonhosen]

RyanOPlastry said:

vonhosen said:

If you don't have a photo licence or passport you can't do a driving test now.

This is completely irrelevant, you didn't need it when she passed her driving test.

Having a fear of aeroplanes, ships and tunnels, she has never found the need to have a passport.

It would be useful if instead you could point me to the law which requires a person to have photo ID , or to one which entitles an organisation to demand only photo ID.

I am awaiting a response from the appropriate authorities as to what would be an acceptable alternative. I have not yet had a reply and am not optimistic.

You said there was no requirement yet to have photo ID. I was pointing out that's not the case for certain things by giving an example, so it was relevant to your statement.

As regard the course, their game, their rules.
You've sent them an e-mail & they'll give you their answer.

[55palfers]

I don't think it matters who attends the course. So long as the two ill-informed, superannuated trainers get their £100, who cares?

[KFC]

Bigends said:

What if you forget your photo i.d. when stopped - just popped up the shops officer - forgot my wallet.
What happens then - arrest for not having it on you?
Dont really think we want to go down that route

Speaking from experience of living in various EU countries, generally if pulled over in a random stop and you have no id you won't be arrested. I've heard of expats having to phone home to get someone to bring their ID to where they are. Or being escorted home by the cops to get it. Or more likely "dont do that again" and let you on your way if you appear to be a genuine case of forgotten.

I would assume they have less leeway in how they deal with you if you've actually done something wrong and been caught, as opposed to a random check.


I don't have a problem at all with carrying my driving license in my wallet - its credit card sized, and when are you going to be out with no wallet etc anyway. I think everyone having to have the very minor inconvenience of carrying it, is better than the alternative of people just knowing full well they can drive without one and just lie if stopped.

Edited by KFC on Sunday 22 March 20:56

[Bigends]

KFC said:

Bigends said:

What if you forget your photo i.d. when stopped - just popped up the shops officer - forgot my wallet.
What happens then - arrest for not having it on you?
Dont really think we want to go down that route

Speaking from experience of living in various EU countries, generally if pulled over in a random stop and you have no id you won't be arrested. I've heard of expats having to phone home to get someone to bring their ID to where they are. Or being escorted home by the cops to get it. Or more likely "dont do that again" and let you on your way if you appear to be a genuine case of forgotten.

I would assume they have less leeway in how they deal with you if you've actually done something wrong and been caught, as opposed to a random check.


I don't have a problem at all with carrying my driving license in my wallet - its credit card sized, and when are you going to be out with no wallet etc anyway. I think everyone having to have the very minor inconvenience of carrying it, is better than the alternative of people just knowing full well they can drive without one and just lie if stopped.

Edited by KFC on Sunday 22 March 20:56

No point in having the law if you cant/dont enforce it

[KFC]

Bigends said:

No point in having the law if you cant/dont enforce it

So you don't want the police to have any leeway at all when it comes to making decisions? Personally I'd rather the Spanish cops just let the well dressed, 73 year old lady with the British accent go on her way with a "don't do that again" when stopped in a random check and she tells them she didn't realise she had to have her license on her.

[TBSC]

I don't have photo ID so when I attended a SAC I had to sign a piece of paper and show the signature on my paper licence.

[Bigends]

KFC said:

Bigends said:

No point in having the law if you cant/dont enforce it

So you don't want the police to have any leeway at all when it comes to making decisions? Personally I'd rather the Spanish cops just let the well dressed, 73 year old lady with the British accent go on her way with a "don't do that again" when stopped in a random check and she tells them she didn't realise she had to have her license on her.

We're talking about the UK - cant have one law for one and different for others.
In the case of driving licences - many other countries dont have licence or criminal records recorded on nationsl databases. Easier to check whether people hold licences over here with a few simple checks - though agreed not 100% foolproof and one or two may slip through

[Gareth79]

Bigends said:

What if you forget your photo i.d. when stopped - just popped up the shops officer - forgot my wallet.
What happens then - arrest for not having it on you?
Dont really think we want to go down that route

The police have skills to identify if somebody is telling the truth, and they have resources available to confirm lots of details, and then the powers of arrest to identify somebody at the station. The speed awareness course has none of this, and so needs easily checkable ID.

[KFC]

Bigends said:

We're talking about the UK - cant have one law for one and different for others.
In the case of driving licences - many other countries dont have licence or criminal records recorded on nationsl databases. Easier to check whether people hold licences over here with a few simple checks - though agreed not 100% foolproof and one or two may slip through

So in the OP's mrs case (someone with zero photo identity, but a legitimate drivers license holder) how do you stop people pretending to be her when stopped?

They will know full well there is no photograph, there is no way they can verify roadside that the person is who they say they are. All they need to do is memorise this persons date of birth and address.


I'm not suggesting having one law for one and different from others - I'm just saying any sensible police force would have a bit of discretion as to whether to bust you / drag you back to your hotel to check id / insist on someone bringing it to you, etc. It works perfectly well in most other EU countries so there is no reason why it couldn't work in the UK.


I guess all the people in the OP's mrs circumstances are dying off anyway. It won't be that long until everyone has a photo card ID. and from that point forward its only a tiny step to enforce carrying it while driving. Or make that redundant by giving all cops access to the dvla info instantly, including photographs.

[RyanOPlastry]

KFC said:

I guess all the people in the OP's mrs circumstances are dying off anyway

I hope not ...
Photocard licences were only introduced 17 years ago , so anyone over 35 who hasn't moved house may still have one...