Driving ban, 18 points for lying motorist

[thelawnet1]

http://www.surrey.police.uk/News/News-Stories/Full...

"Yvonne Bramwell (54) of Maidstone, Kent, appeared at Redhill Magistrates Court last week (3 June) as a result of her vehicle having activated a speed camera on the M25 in Surrey on three successive days in January 2014.
She pleaded guilty to the offence of failing to identify the driver and was banned from driving from six months and received 18 points on her licence. She was also ordered to pay £500 fine for each offence, £620 costs, and £50 victim surcharge, making a total of £2,170.
Surrey Police is keen to highlight this case as from the very outset Ms Bramwell went out of her way to evade, obstruct and delay the police investigation and made it as difficult as possible for officers to identify the correct driver of the vehicle at the time of the offence. She described her car's nocturnal activities as a ‘mystery' and her list of excuses ranged from being asleep at home at the time of the offence to the car must have been cloned.
Ms Bramwell then embarked on a campaign of complaints against Surrey Police, despite being warned that her failure to supply information about the driver would lead to heavy fines and points on her licence."

Google suggests that Ms. Bramwell worked (works) for the council, in Maidstone.

[Durzel]

Seems like she was battered for Failure to Furnish for all 3 offences. What an idiot.

[hondafanatic]

I thought it's regularly pointed out that you can't get a ban and points? Or did I just make that up?

[hondafanatic]

Durzel said:

Seems like she was battered for Failure to Furnish for all 3 offences. What an idiot.

Ooooo...so could she have received a ban for one of the offences and points for the other two?

[MrRee145]

hondafanatic said:

I thought it's regularly pointed out that you can't get a ban and points? Or did I just make that up?

The way I understand it is 12 points will get you a totting up ban of 6months therefore she had 6 for each FTF charge giving her the ban for 6 months... not sure what happens to the remaining 6 through

[agtlaw]

hondafanatic said:

Ooooo...so could she have received a ban for one of the offences and points for the other two?

No.

[hondafanatic]

agtlaw said:

hondafanatic said:

Ooooo...so could she have received a ban for one of the offences and points for the other two?

No.

Ow

[Retroman]

Depending on the speed she was doing and if she has any previous issues like this she may have got off with a driving awareness courts + costs for 1 offense and 6 points and £200 FPN for the other 2.

[agtlaw]

Retroman said:

Depending on the speed she was doing and if she has any previous issues like this she may have got off with a driving awareness courts + costs for 1 OFFENCE and 6 points and £200 FPN for the other 2.

Edit: This is wrong. She couldn't have received a fixed penalty for a second s. 172 offence - as she would be on 12 points, therefore a court appearance. Are you supposing that one matter was NFA?

Edited by agtlaw on Monday 22 June 15:13

[tapereel]

agtlaw said:

Retroman said:

Depending on the speed she was doing and if she has any previous issues like this she may have got off with a driving awareness courts + costs for 1 OFFENCE and 6 points and £200 FPN for the other 2.

Edit: This is wrong. She couldn't have received a fixed penalty for a second s. 172 offence - as she would be on 12 points, therefore a court appearance. Are you supposing that one matter was NFA?

I do believe retroman is suggesting that Mrs B could have admitted being the driver on 3 occasions and hence have received the SAC for one speeding offence and 3pts for each of the other two speeding offences making 6pts.
That would have course have relied on her being better advised and to have admitted the driving offences in the first place.

[agtlaw]

thelawnet1 said:

and was banned from driving from six months and received 18 points on her licence.

This is incorrect. A notional 18 points, therefore a 6 month "totting up" disqualification.

[Durzel]

The article says she was caught on 3 consecutive days, therefore 3 separate offences - not a continuation of several offences in a short space of time/on the same road that might be dealt in a discretionary way by prosecuting for only one of them.

Although it's not explicit it's clear the ban she received was for totting up as a consequence of receiving 6 points for each of her S172 offences. Don't know what latitude Mags have with this stuff but I'd assume her recalcitrance meant they were quite happy to deal with her strictly by the letter of the Law.

Edited by Durzel on Monday 22 June 16:06

[tapereel]

Durzel said:

The article says she was caught on 3 consecutive days, therefore 3 separate offences - not a continuation of several offences in a short space of time/on the same road that might be dealt in a discretionary way by prosecuting for only one of them.

Although it's not explicit it's clear the ban she received was for totting up as a consequence of receiving 6 points for each of her S172 offences. Don't know what latitude Mags have with this stuff but I'd assume her recalcitrance meant they were quite happy to deal with her strictly by the letter of the Law.

I think that is quite obvious from the polce report.

Surrey Police said:

...from the very outset Ms Bramwell went out of her way to evade, obstruct and delay the police investigation and made it as difficult as possible for officers to identify the correct driver of the vehicle at the time of the offence. She described her car's nocturnal activities as a ‘mystery' and her list of excuses ranged from being asleep at home at the time of the offence to the car must have been cloned.

Ms Bramwell then embarked on a campaign of complaints against Surrey Police, despite being warned that her failure to supply information about the driver would lead to heavy fines and points on her licence
- See more at: http://www.surrey.police.uk/News/News-Stories/Full...

[stuart313]

So at the end of the day she went a bit quick on the motorway, no one got hurt, no victims, and it seems not even anyone in any danger.

Meanwhile

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33206372

Its the most recent story I got from this post on another forum.

http://www.grumpieroldmen.co.uk/forum/phpBB3/viewt...

I would like to point out the above topic is 85 pages long.

Just saying.

[Funkycoldribena]

It is amazing how much effort the police put into catching people for speeding offences.

[Vipers]

stuart313 said:

So at the end of the day she went a bit quick on the motorway, no one got hurt, no victims, and it seems not even anyone in any danger.

Plus being very unhelpful, what do you suggest a free trip to the caribbean maybe?

[stuart313]

Vipers said:

stuart313 said:

So at the end of the day she went a bit quick on the motorway, no one got hurt, no victims, and it seems not even anyone in any danger.

Plus being very unhelpful, what do you suggest a free trip to the caribbean maybe?

No-one can compel her to name the driver, she had every right to keep stum. Since when does someone have to do the polices investigating for them.

[tapereel]

stuart313 said:

Vipers said:

stuart313 said:

So at the end of the day she went a bit quick on the motorway, no one got hurt, no victims, and it seems not even anyone in any danger.

Plus being very unhelpful, what do you suggest a free trip to the caribbean maybe?

No-one can compel her to name the driver, she had every right to keep stum. Since when does someone have to do the polices investigating for them.

The law compels her to do so and it has done for many years; advice like yours has got her a ban from driving.

If you have a driving licence you need to be aware you too are so compelled should you receive the same notice as her 3.

[stuart313]

tapereel said:

stuart313 said:

Vipers said:

stuart313 said:

So at the end of the day she went a bit quick on the motorway, no one got hurt, no victims, and it seems not even anyone in any danger.

Plus being very unhelpful, what do you suggest a free trip to the caribbean maybe?

No-one can compel her to name the driver, she had every right to keep stum. Since when does someone have to do the polices investigating for them.

The law compels her to do so and it has done for many years; advice like yours has got her a ban from driving.

If you have a driving licence you need to be aware you too are so compelled should you receive the same notice as her 3.

What I meant was she can either name the driver or take the 6 points and MS90, she cant be forced to break her silence. It just so happens that I think 6 points and a big fine is too harsh a penalty for the offence comitted, especially when people do way worse day in and day out and get nothing like.

[lbc]

Funkycoldribena said:

It is amazing how much effort the police put into catching people for speeding offences.

It's just as amazing how some drivers put in a lot of effort to try and evade speeding convictions.