quick small claims court question.....
Discussion
Court requested that both parties serve the evidence/documents they intend to rely on in court by a certain date to the court & other party. I (claimant) sent this to both & know they were received on time as I used signed for service. I haven't received anything from the defendant & obviously he's now missed the cut off date for serving.
Can I assume that even if he does turn up for the hearing , the judge will immediately rule 100% in my favour because the defendant hasn't filed on time? anyone have experience of a similar situation?
Also if I do win, could I expect the defendant (who's a sole trader) to play silly buggers and offer to pay me £10 a month (the claim is over £2k). His business isn't big but I'd think he's got the cash to pay the full amount immediately.
Thanks all
Can I assume that even if he does turn up for the hearing , the judge will immediately rule 100% in my favour because the defendant hasn't filed on time? anyone have experience of a similar situation?
Also if I do win, could I expect the defendant (who's a sole trader) to play silly buggers and offer to pay me £10 a month (the claim is over £2k). His business isn't big but I'd think he's got the cash to pay the full amount immediately.
Thanks all
george123 said:
Can I assume that even if he does turn up for the hearing , the judge will immediately rule 100% in my favour because the defendant hasn't filed on time?
No, if he turns up the judge will still hear the case and rule as he sees fit. It won't help their cause though.george123 said:
Also if I do win, could I expect the defendant (who's a sole trader) to play silly buggers and offer to pay me £10 a month (the claim is over £2k). His business isn't big but I'd think he's got the cash to pay the full amount immediately.
Yes, I have several people paying me at £1 per month. You can apply for (i think it's called) declaration of earnings but it's just throwing more money away.In my opinion the process for recovering small amounts of money firmly sides with the debtor. If they know how to play the system it makes it financially unviable to recover.
george123 said:
Also if I do win, could I expect the defendant (who's a sole trader) to play silly buggers and offer to pay me £10 a month (the claim is over £2k). His business isn't big but I'd think he's got the cash to pay the full amount immediately.
If he doesn't pay and you have good reason to think he is gaming the system, one tactic is to apply for an oral examination. The fee is £50 plus the cost of a process server. It isn't a particularly well known option and is quite effective because sanctions for non-compliance can be severe.http://www.compactlaw.co.uk/free-legal-information...
A debt of £2k also means you can escalate it direct to the High Court to obtain a Writ of Control. I can never understand why creditors faff around with County Court enforcement agents. They are as much use as a chocolate fireguard. HCEOs have real teeth, not dentures.
JustinP1 said:
Hold your horses - he maybe just isn't relying on any paperwork.
Thanks - this is a possibility, however his defence questionnaire was pretty robust, talk of expert witnesses etc., though from previous form he's not that on the ball & prefers to avoid confrontation. I think his heads in the sand hoping it'll go away so won't bother turning up, therefore ruling is against him & then he can pay me a £1 a week.george123 said:
JustinP1 said:
Hold your horses - he maybe just isn't relying on any paperwork.
Thanks - this is a possibility, however his defence questionnaire was pretty robust, talk of expert witnesses etc., though from previous form he's not that on the ball & prefers to avoid confrontation. I think his heads in the sand hoping it'll go away so won't bother turning up, therefore ruling is against him & then he can pay me a £1 a week.A tip now is to create a sheet on the hours that you've spent on each part of the claim, filing and coming to court.
If the judge believes that the other party has acted unreasonably (like they've not turned up), then you can get your costs paid at £18 per hour. That's on top of the 45p a mile.
As has been said, once you have judgment the chap has 28 days to pay.
Don't use the court forms to employ bailiffs, use a company like The Sherriff's Office. They charge only the court fee of £70 IIRC to escalate the debt to the High Court and get a writ of enforcement. Then they organise the bailiffs. They get paid from the money paid or stuff seized.
Red Devil said:
If he doesn't pay and you have good reason to think he is gaming the system, one tactic is to apply for an oral examination. The fee is £50 plus the cost of a process server. It isn't a particularly well known option and is quite effective because sanctions for non-compliance can be severe.
http://www.compactlaw.co.uk/free-legal-information...
A debt of £2k also means you can escalate it direct to the High Court to obtain a Writ of Control. I can never understand why creditors faff around with County Court enforcement agents. They are as much use as a chocolate fireguard. HCEOs have real teeth, not dentures.
Thanks for the link, very helpful. So if he does lose & tries to game it I can go down the oral examination route, if he doesn't but won't pay full stop I can go for the writ of control & a pair of those big lads you see on the TV show try to re-claim the debt in person. Its good to know the scenarios post judgment thank you.http://www.compactlaw.co.uk/free-legal-information...
A debt of £2k also means you can escalate it direct to the High Court to obtain a Writ of Control. I can never understand why creditors faff around with County Court enforcement agents. They are as much use as a chocolate fireguard. HCEOs have real teeth, not dentures.
JustinP1 said:
Well - if he's wasting the court's time with talk of expert witnesses and doesn't turn up then they won't look kindly to that.
A tip now is to create a sheet on the hours that you've spent on each part of the claim, filing and coming to court.
If the judge believes that the other party has acted unreasonably (like they've not turned up), then you can get your costs paid at £18 per hour. That's on top of the 45p a mile.
As has been said, once you have judgment the chap has 28 days to pay.
Don't use the court forms to employ bailiffs, use a company like The Sherriff's Office. They charge only the court fee of £70 IIRC to escalate the debt to the High Court and get a writ of enforcement. Then they organise the bailiffs. They get paid from the money paid or stuff seized.
Good tip to record hours spent so far, thanks. I didn't know you can claim compensation, I assume this is at the judges discretion? Pulling together the documents I'm going to rely on was a day off work. Pulling it together, printing 2 copies x 30 pages, posting it....A tip now is to create a sheet on the hours that you've spent on each part of the claim, filing and coming to court.
If the judge believes that the other party has acted unreasonably (like they've not turned up), then you can get your costs paid at £18 per hour. That's on top of the 45p a mile.
As has been said, once you have judgment the chap has 28 days to pay.
Don't use the court forms to employ bailiffs, use a company like The Sherriff's Office. They charge only the court fee of £70 IIRC to escalate the debt to the High Court and get a writ of enforcement. Then they organise the bailiffs. They get paid from the money paid or stuff seized.
george123 said:
JustinP1 said:
Well - if he's wasting the court's time with talk of expert witnesses and doesn't turn up then they won't look kindly to that.
A tip now is to create a sheet on the hours that you've spent on each part of the claim, filing and coming to court.
If the judge believes that the other party has acted unreasonably (like they've not turned up), then you can get your costs paid at £18 per hour. That's on top of the 45p a mile.
As has been said, once you have judgment the chap has 28 days to pay.
Don't use the court forms to employ bailiffs, use a company like The Sherriff's Office. They charge only the court fee of £70 IIRC to escalate the debt to the High Court and get a writ of enforcement. Then they organise the bailiffs. They get paid from the money paid or stuff seized.
Good tip to record hours spent so far, thanks. I didn't know you can claim compensation, I assume this is at the judges discretion? Pulling together the documents I'm going to rely on was a day off work. Pulling it together, printing 2 copies x 30 pages, posting it....A tip now is to create a sheet on the hours that you've spent on each part of the claim, filing and coming to court.
If the judge believes that the other party has acted unreasonably (like they've not turned up), then you can get your costs paid at £18 per hour. That's on top of the 45p a mile.
As has been said, once you have judgment the chap has 28 days to pay.
Don't use the court forms to employ bailiffs, use a company like The Sherriff's Office. They charge only the court fee of £70 IIRC to escalate the debt to the High Court and get a writ of enforcement. Then they organise the bailiffs. They get paid from the money paid or stuff seized.
18th May 2015: Filing claim - 2 hrs.
25th June 2015: Collating evidence - 5.5 hrs
25th June 2015: 60 copies at 5p each. Postage by Special Delivery £6.20
So on and so forth.
There are usually no 'costs' awarded on the small claims track unless a party has been unreasonable.
Last time I was in court, I had a list of things to make a representation of unreasonable behaviour. The Judge said he didn't need to hear it, as in his opinion, not turning up to court was enough.
The figure in the Civil Procedure Rules for a litigant in person is £18 per hour.
If you win the case & he doesn't pay up, issue one of these;
http://uk.practicallaw.com/6-502-3951?source=relat...
That should make him take notice.
http://uk.practicallaw.com/6-502-3951?source=relat...
That should make him take notice.
quick update on this, he emailed me offering to pay up but it was around £500 short of the value. This is essentially the value of the claim when I first served on him, I then increased it to cover a further issue that arose a couple of week later. I went through the correct process/form filling with the court to amend the particulars including paying the extra £50 for the change. He's trying to assert that I can't increase the claim once its been served therefore he's offering the lower amount.
He's also telling me he's checked with his solicitor and the court, I can't change the claim amount without the court's consent - implying that the court's told him I haven't followed correct process. Am I right in thinking that the court would never divulge this type of info to him? I'm assuming he's clutching at straws hoping to pay the lesser amount.
I've gone back to him stating that I'll accept an out of court settlement but only for the full value....lets see....
He's also telling me he's checked with his solicitor and the court, I can't change the claim amount without the court's consent - implying that the court's told him I haven't followed correct process. Am I right in thinking that the court would never divulge this type of info to him? I'm assuming he's clutching at straws hoping to pay the lesser amount.
I've gone back to him stating that I'll accept an out of court settlement but only for the full value....lets see....
Edited by george123 on Friday 16th October 17:18
george123 said:
quick update on this, he emailed me offering to pay up but it was around £500 short of the value. This is essentially the value of the claim when I first served on him, I then increased it to cover a further issue that arose a couple of week later. I went through the correct process/form filling with the court to amend the particulars including paying the extra £50 for the change. He's trying to assert that I can't increase the claim once its been served therefore he's offering the lower amount.
He's also telling me he's checked with his solicitor and the court, I can't change the claim amount without the court's consent - implying that the court's told him I haven't followed correct process. Am I right in thinking that the court would never divulge this type of info to him? I'm assuming he's clutching at straws hoping to pay the lesser amount.
I've gone back to him stating that I'll accept an out of court settlement but only for the full value....lets see....
You can apply to the court to amend the claim, but has that application been accepted by the court?He's also telling me he's checked with his solicitor and the court, I can't change the claim amount without the court's consent - implying that the court's told him I haven't followed correct process. Am I right in thinking that the court would never divulge this type of info to him? I'm assuming he's clutching at straws hoping to pay the lesser amount.
I've gone back to him stating that I'll accept an out of court settlement but only for the full value....lets see....
Edited by george123 on Friday 16th October 17:18
Cyberprog said:
You can apply to the court to amend the claim, but has that application been accepted by the court?
I assume so - they've cashed my cheque for the additional fee. I'll try calling MCOL again Monday for confirmation - tried a couple of times today but didn't get through. Would they disclose about acceptance of this change to the defendant if he or his solicitor asked?george123 said:
Court requested that both parties serve the evidence/documents they intend to rely on in court by a certain date to the court & other party.
How did you serve the evidence/documents to the court? Email/post/drop them off? I need to do the same but the letter from the court offers no instructions on how to do this.CC07 PEU said:
george123 said:
Court requested that both parties serve the evidence/documents they intend to rely on in court by a certain date to the court & other party.
How did you serve the evidence/documents to the court? Email/post/drop them off? I need to do the same but the letter from the court offers no instructions on how to do this.Email them making clear the case number and which party you are, and attach the documents - pdf is probably best. They acknowledge receipt. Judge has access to the files on his screen.
george123 said:
I assume so - they've cashed my cheque for the additional fee. I'll try calling MCOL again Monday for confirmation - tried a couple of times today but didn't get through. Would they disclose about acceptance of this change to the defendant if he or his solicitor asked?
Cashing the cheque does not indicate that the application is successful, so it sounds like they are in receipt of it but may not have been before a directions judge yet for approval.
Cyberprog said:
Cashing the cheque does not indicate that the application is successful, so it sounds like they are in receipt of it but may not have been before a directions judge yet for approval.
Have spoken to the court, they confirmed the updated cost of the claim has been filed. CC07 PEU said:
How did you serve the evidence/documents to the court? Email/post/drop them off? I need to do the same but the letter from the court offers no instructions on how to do this.
I sent them by signed for postal service to both court and defendant. Then printed off copies from the Post Office tracking website showing delivery and who signed for each incase I need them in court as proof. Forums | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff