Mobile phone use in cars - again (this time hands free)
Discussion
According to the research reported here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36475180 using a hands free phone in a car is just as dangerous is holding it - if the conversation requires the driver to visualise something.
If so the current legislation regarding mobile phone use is misdirected (which I suppose most people realised already). The next step is surely that certain conversations between passengers and the driver are as dangerous as using a mobile phone. The report on the radio this morning said that passengers who can see what the driver sees, and who regulate the conversation according to the hazards on the road don't present the same level of danger. So it should follow that driving whilst speaking to an inconsiderate or unobservant passenger. (eg a child), or a passenger in the back of the car should also be dangerous.
As should, one assumes, listening to something on the radio that may cause visualisation, such as a radio play.
If this research is onto something though, why doesn't the empirical evidence (such as the number of road accidents) support the findings?
If so the current legislation regarding mobile phone use is misdirected (which I suppose most people realised already). The next step is surely that certain conversations between passengers and the driver are as dangerous as using a mobile phone. The report on the radio this morning said that passengers who can see what the driver sees, and who regulate the conversation according to the hazards on the road don't present the same level of danger. So it should follow that driving whilst speaking to an inconsiderate or unobservant passenger. (eg a child), or a passenger in the back of the car should also be dangerous.
As should, one assumes, listening to something on the radio that may cause visualisation, such as a radio play.
If this research is onto something though, why doesn't the empirical evidence (such as the number of road accidents) support the findings?
Not really considered the stats but casual observation seems to me that the others around people in conversations on the phone when driving allow them to get away with it. If that makes sense. That is to say the road is a dynamic system, so I will avoid someone wandering when engaged on a call, and I do that a lot.
Always understood it is the noggin dealing with a conversation no matter the method of the call.
Always understood it is the noggin dealing with a conversation no matter the method of the call.
Greg66 said:
According to the research reported here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36475180 using a hands free phone in a car is just as dangerous is holding it - if the conversation requires the driver to visualise something.
If so the current legislation regarding mobile phone use is misdirected (which I suppose most people realised already). The next step is surely that certain conversations between passengers and the driver are as dangerous as using a mobile phone. The report on the radio this morning said that passengers who can see what the driver sees, and who regulate the conversation according to the hazards on the road don't present the same level of danger. So it should follow that driving whilst speaking to an inconsiderate or unobservant passenger. (eg a child), or a passenger in the back of the car should also be dangerous.
As should, one assumes, listening to something on the radio that may cause visualisation, such as a radio play.
If this research is onto something though, why doesn't the empirical evidence (such as the number of road accidents) support the findings?
My insurance went up after my daughter was born despite no claims, same car, same company (I did check on comparison websites and they were still very reasonable). I had assumed that the potential distraction from a child/baby was the reason. I can't be bothered to put in some details into a comparison site to see the difference between having and not having a baby/young child in the car right now but you could do that if you some time to kill.If so the current legislation regarding mobile phone use is misdirected (which I suppose most people realised already). The next step is surely that certain conversations between passengers and the driver are as dangerous as using a mobile phone. The report on the radio this morning said that passengers who can see what the driver sees, and who regulate the conversation according to the hazards on the road don't present the same level of danger. So it should follow that driving whilst speaking to an inconsiderate or unobservant passenger. (eg a child), or a passenger in the back of the car should also be dangerous.
As should, one assumes, listening to something on the radio that may cause visualisation, such as a radio play.
If this research is onto something though, why doesn't the empirical evidence (such as the number of road accidents) support the findings?
Utterly stupid, what next? Ban radios, ban adjustable mirrors, ban sneezing, ban people sat in the back. Ban roadside billboards, ban super /posh/modified cars driving past.
Hell, it's all massively pale in comparison to having a child in the back seat. As new parent to a 3 month old, it bugs the hell out of me how easily distracted it can be when he starts off on one... Screaming, crying, laughing, "chattering". Not ideal, but the preprogramming to look at the source of a sudden noise is hard to over come!
Hell, it's all massively pale in comparison to having a child in the back seat. As new parent to a 3 month old, it bugs the hell out of me how easily distracted it can be when he starts off on one... Screaming, crying, laughing, "chattering". Not ideal, but the preprogramming to look at the source of a sudden noise is hard to over come!
Radios have been proven to make drivers safer on the whole, AIUI. Esp if tuned to pop music, because that stops complex reasoning and means that you just bop along in the moment, reacting to what's going on. Turn it off and you go off thinking about last month's sales figures and how you can get lucky with the new girl in accounts, and suddenly you're in Portsmouth having planned to stop in Southampton.
Quite a few of us on here have been making this point since the mobile phone law was introduced. All evidence from multiple studies around the world suggests it is holding a non-face-to-face conversation that is distracting. Speaking to another person in the car is very different from a concentration point of view.
Here's the mythbusters doing it: http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/mythbusters/vide...
Personally I would rather see the law revoked and we revert to the 'common sense' approach. It's fairly obvious that holding a phone at 0mph in a traffic jam is safer than conducting a hand-free tele-conference at 70mph.
Here's the mythbusters doing it: http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/mythbusters/vide...
Personally I would rather see the law revoked and we revert to the 'common sense' approach. It's fairly obvious that holding a phone at 0mph in a traffic jam is safer than conducting a hand-free tele-conference at 70mph.
It is not new news as such. A Swedish study some years ago showed little difference between hand held and mobile phone usage and both significantly increased reaction time and reduced safety gaps etc. The researches mapped brain activity using a simulator and found that the call uses similar areas of the brain to driving. The brain uses different areas when talking directly to people or listening to music.
Let's face it, the current law as brought in to make the prosecution easier as police now only needed to prove use of the phone when hand held and not either due care or control being impaired.
Let's face it, the current law as brought in to make the prosecution easier as police now only needed to prove use of the phone when hand held and not either due care or control being impaired.
Andehh said:
Utterly stupid, what next? Ban radios, ban adjustable mirrors, ban sneezing, ban people sat in the back. Ban roadside billboards, ban super /posh/modified cars driving past.
Hell, it's all massively pale in comparison to having a child in the back seat. As new parent to a 3 month old, it bugs the hell out of me how easily distracted it can be when he starts off on one... Screaming, crying, laughing, "chattering". Not ideal, but the preprogramming to look at the source of a sudden noise is hard to over come!
Daddy! I'm going to be SICK! Hell, it's all massively pale in comparison to having a child in the back seat. As new parent to a 3 month old, it bugs the hell out of me how easily distracted it can be when he starts off on one... Screaming, crying, laughing, "chattering". Not ideal, but the preprogramming to look at the source of a sudden noise is hard to over come!
techguyone said:
I think BRAKE et all have lost the opportunity, pretty much all cars now have bluetooth, sat nav, phones built in to the car itself - in many cases you can put a SIM in the car, no phone needed.
What is being stated here, though, is that any means of using a telephone whilst driving is excessively distracting. It has been a case of the bleedin' obvious to anyone who has used a mobile at the wheel - hand-held or hands-free, that a conversation that rises above the banal takes too much of your brain's processing power away from driving. Before anyone says that a passenger is also distracting, yes of course, but the passenger can see when the road conditions become difficult whereas a 'voice' on the 'phone cannot and it is innate politeness to divert more attention to a telephone call than to a sentient passenger. My late MiL not withstanding...motco said:
techguyone said:
I think BRAKE et all have lost the opportunity, pretty much all cars now have bluetooth, sat nav, phones built in to the car itself - in many cases you can put a SIM in the car, no phone needed.
What is being stated here, though, is that any means of using a telephone whilst driving is excessively distracting. It has been a case of the bleedin' obvious to anyone who has used a mobile at the wheel - hand-held or hands-free, that a conversation that rises above the banal takes too much of your brain's processing power away from driving. Before anyone says that a passenger is also distracting, yes of course, but the passenger can see when the road conditions become difficult whereas a 'voice' on the 'phone cannot and it is innate politeness to divert more attention to a telephone call than to a sentient passenger. My late MiL not withstanding...Tonsko said:
motco said:
techguyone said:
I think BRAKE et all have lost the opportunity, pretty much all cars now have bluetooth, sat nav, phones built in to the car itself - in many cases you can put a SIM in the car, no phone needed.
What is being stated here, though, is that any means of using a telephone whilst driving is excessively distracting. It has been a case of the bleedin' obvious to anyone who has used a mobile at the wheel - hand-held or hands-free, that a conversation that rises above the banal takes too much of your brain's processing power away from driving. Before anyone says that a passenger is also distracting, yes of course, but the passenger can see when the road conditions become difficult whereas a 'voice' on the 'phone cannot and it is innate politeness to divert more attention to a telephone call than to a sentient passenger. My late MiL not withstanding...motco said:
I'm sure you're right, but wasn't it obvious from the start that holding the handset is the least of the problems? Otherwise smoking should have been banned at the wheel decades ago. It isn't hard to prove that the 'phone was in use by its logs, but as others have said, it's no longer talking that poses the greatest risks, but texting and other on-screen activities.
Well, yes. But since when has that informed legislation?I know that there is absolutely no suggestion that this will be legislated against but for a moment, imagine if it was?
Its bad enough now motorists been prosecuted for scratching their ear, allegedly on the phone when its actually locked in the boot, been accused when they dont own a phone.... can you imagine how such legislation could be enforced. You would be scared to even sing to yourself or move your lips in case you were accused on talking on a mobile!!
Its bad enough now motorists been prosecuted for scratching their ear, allegedly on the phone when its actually locked in the boot, been accused when they dont own a phone.... can you imagine how such legislation could be enforced. You would be scared to even sing to yourself or move your lips in case you were accused on talking on a mobile!!
Some can hold a conversation etc whilst driving some cannot.
Some cannot walk and chew gum .
Some cannot hold a conversation without looking at the other person .
A guy collided with my parked car writing it off while putting something in his centre console.
Some cannot do the commentary section of the advanced driving scheme.
Should we allow these people on the roads ?
Is the driving test suitable for the modern driving environment ?
Should be have a review via onboard monitoring periodically?
I feel that something needs to be done to raise our standard of driving and driver education.
Some cannot walk and chew gum .
Some cannot hold a conversation without looking at the other person .
A guy collided with my parked car writing it off while putting something in his centre console.
Some cannot do the commentary section of the advanced driving scheme.
Should we allow these people on the roads ?
Is the driving test suitable for the modern driving environment ?
Should be have a review via onboard monitoring periodically?
I feel that something needs to be done to raise our standard of driving and driver education.
alock said:
Quite a few of us on here have been making this point since the mobile phone law was introduced.
All evidence from multiple studies around the world suggests it is holding a non-face-to-face conversation that is distracting.
Speaking to another person in the car is very different from a concentration point of view
+1All evidence from multiple studies around the world suggests it is holding a non-face-to-face conversation that is distracting.
Speaking to another person in the car is very different from a concentration point of view
This topic has been done to death. The act of physically holding the phone to talk has never really been the dangerous part of a phone call while driving. Speaking to the caller is the distracting and potentially dangerous part.
If I speak on the phone whilst driving then I have absolutely no recollection of what happened during the call. I miss turn offs, I can't remember if I overtook anyone, what speed I was doing... It's really very scary. I therefore rarely use the phone in the car.
I suspect many people may be like me, and despite them obeying the law and using hands-free, they are still potentially a danger to other road users, and may not have the good sense to realise it.
With this in mind, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that talking on the phone while driving may be banned altogether.
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