Driverless cars - a question

[wildone63]

If these things ever take to British roads (and I certainly hope not),I would say that anyone who is operating one should not need a driving licence because they are not technically driving the car right?,
but I suspect that UK law being the ass that it is will still state that (just for the hell of it)you need a licence to operate one.

[Randy Winkman]

Are driverless cars intended to operate without driver input?

[anonymous-user]

They still certainly seem to need a driver........


http://www.slashgear.com/fatal-crash-prompts-tesla...

[Crafty_]

wildone63 said:

If these things ever take to British roads (and I certainly hope not),I would say that anyone who is operating one should not need a driving licence because they are not technically driving the car right?,
but I suspect that UK law being the ass that it is will still state that (just for the hell of it)you need a licence to operate one.

At least initially I can only see them being the same as every other car - you will need a driving licence, driver must be insured and ready to take control of the car at any time to avoid incidents and will be held responsible for control of the vehicle and any offences/accidents.

[Johnnytheboy]

I've said this on every thread so far, the UK govt will not allow people who are not qualified and fit to drive to be in ghee cars alone.

Someone has to be guilty when there is a collision, because we don't have accidents any more.

[deckster]

Johnnytheboy said:

I've said this on every thread so far, the UK govt will not allow people who are not qualified and fit to drive to be in ghee cars alone.

Someone has to be guilty when there is a collision, because we don't have accidents any more.

This year, sure. In ten years time? More than likely.

However in 50 years time, we'll be amazed we ever let people drive.

[Johnnytheboy]

Where did ghee come from?

Apart from Indian cuisine, obviously.

[otolith]

deckster said:

This year, sure. In ten years time? More than likely.

However in 50 years time, we'll be amazed we ever let people drive.

This, I'm afraid.

[Johnnytheboy]

deckster said:

This year, sure. In ten years time? More than likely.

However in 50 years time, we'll be amazed we ever let people drive.

I agree. In a world without lawyers!

As I said, we don't do accidents any more, we do collisions. So someone is guilty when there is a crash.

The manufacturers won't want to be, so I strongly believe that the legislation will end up stipulating that a fit, trained driver is at the wheel of the car, and is ultimately responsible if there is a collision that they could have avoided by intervening when the car had a bit of a moment.

[Fastpedeller]

Will they (driverless cars) ever work successfully though? Can they anticipate the kiddy on the pavement with the football about to run under the car (contrary to popular belief cars can't stop in no distance even with abs). Can they spot the "mud on road" sign on a country lane, and the vehicle seen through the gap in the hedge across the field approaching the blind bend from the other direction?
maybe they'll use a very accurate interactive GPS for the last one, but you get my drift.

[98elise]

REALIST123 said:

They still certainly seem to need a driver........


http://www.slashgear.com/fatal-crash-prompts-tesla...

Thats not a driverless car.

[98elise]

Fastpedeller said:

Will they (driverless cars) ever work successfully though? Can they anticipate the kiddy on the pavement with the football about to run under the car (contrary to popular belief cars can't stop in no distance even with abs). Can they spot the "mud on road" sign on a country lane, and the vehicle seen through the gap in the hedge across the field approaching the blind bend from the other direction?
maybe they'll use a very accurate interactive GPS for the last one, but you get my drift.

Why not? We manage with just two optical sensors and a processing computer hat gets tired,emotional,angry, forgetful, old etc.

Camera's can identify people, faces, even if you've blinked. Add a whole host of other sensors, and the ability to learn from other cars (tesla already do this) and its not a massive leap. I think we're about 10 years from fully autonomous as capability, and probably 20 from cars without a steering wheel.

Edited by 98elise on Saturday 2nd July 13:52

[98elise]

Johnnytheboy said:

I've said this on every thread so far, the UK govt will not allow people who are not qualified and fit to drive to be in ghee cars alone.

Someone has to be guilty when there is a collision, because we don't have accidents any more.

Really? They seem quite keen on the idea

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...

[Burwood]

Fastpedeller said:

Will they (driverless cars) ever work successfully though? Can they anticipate the kiddy on the pavement with the football about to run under the car (contrary to popular belief cars can't stop in no distance even with abs). Can they spot the "mud on road" sign on a country lane, and the vehicle seen through the gap in the hedge across the field approaching the blind bend from the other direction?
maybe they'll use a very accurate interactive GPS for the last one, but you get my drift.

if i can't get a bloody 4G signal across large parts of Surrey, what chance does a driverless car have. The idea whilst great for M road and long boring distances is a nonsense for more rural areas. It will be 50 years away at least.

[Starfighter]

And then the inevitable call to ban drivers completely.

[Truffs]

At least we won't be worried about speed cameras!

[4rephill]

98elise said:

REALIST123 said:

They still certainly seem to need a driver........


http://www.slashgear.com/fatal-crash-prompts-tesla...

Thats not a driverless car.

You're right - It's not a driverless car, it's a car with self driving capability, with a proviso that there is driver in the drivers seat who have their hands on the steering wheel.

It seems though that the driver involved in the fatal accident did not understand the technology that the car has, and either decided to have a nap whilst the car drove itself, or stupidly decided to trust the car to deal with any situations that might crop up.

I struggle to believe that a driver who is awake and paying attention would fail to notice that an articulated truck turning across a road is towing a trailer - Even with the "white trailer - light background" excuse.

[Randy Winkman]

DfT and BIS have a joint unit "The Centre for Connected and Autonomous Vehicles".

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/driverle...

[Johnnytheboy]

98elise said:

Johnnytheboy said:

I've said this on every thread so far, the UK govt will not allow people who are not qualified and fit to drive to be in ghee cars alone.

Someone has to be guilty when there is a collision, because we don't have accidents any more.

Really? They seem quite keen on the idea

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...

Document said:

Clarification of liabilities – There needs to be greater certainty
around criminal and civil liability in the event of an automated
vehicle being in a collision. Under the current legal framework
these issues would be dealt with on a case by case basis by the
Courts. We will aim to provide additional clarity and certainty in
legislation, to provide a sound basis upon which to allocate
criminal and civil liability.

.........

Perhaps the most commonly asked question regarding driverless and
automated vehicles is whose fault would it be if there was a collision or
other incident – the ‘driver’ (or operator or occupant) or the vehicle
manufacturer?
4.23 In reality this question is too simplistic. In most road traffic collisions
there is a range of different people or bodies which may bear or share
liability:
• Vehicle drivers
• Vehicle owners
• Vehicle operators
• Vehicle manufacturers
• Vehicle suppliers/importers
• Service providers
• Data providers
4.24 Each of these parties may be found to be civilly (or in some cases
criminally) liable to a greater or lesser extent depending on the exact
circumstances of the situation. In the event of a collision where the
parties are unable to resolve where liability lies, this process would
probably take place in a court of law. The available evidence would
be examined in detail and a judge would assess whether each party
is liable in law and the extent to which their fault had contributed to
the loss.
......

The legal position of the driver when ceding control over the steering
and similar controls in a highly automated vehicle is untested before
British courts.

..........

The question of liability is more complex when examining the situation
when automated vehicles come to market and are sold for public use.

Here's another thought: if I got banned from driving, I wonder if I'd be allowed to just hop in a driverless car?

[4rephill]

Johnnytheboy said:

Here's another thought: if I got banned from driving, I wonder if I'd be allowed to just hop in a driverless car?

How about if you've been out on the lash with your mates and are pie-eyed - Would you be allowed to go home in a driverless car?