Filing a small claim shortly, any advice?
Discussion
I have tenants who are refusing (not unable, refusing) to pay rent so they'll be getting an S8 and S21 through the post as soon as they go 2 months into arrears. Concurrently, I'm going to file a money claim online against them (have already sent the letter before action), any tips/advice?
I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
Without knowing anything about your case, if you win & are in doubt about being paid the money owing, you could issue a statutory demand.
Read these first;
http://www.mayowynnebaxter.co.uk/blog/dispelling-t...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bankruptcy_in_the_Un...
IANAL
Read these first;
http://www.mayowynnebaxter.co.uk/blog/dispelling-t...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bankruptcy_in_the_Un...
IANAL
Mario149 said:
I have tenants who are refusing (not unable, refusing) to pay rent so they'll be getting an S8 and S21 through the post as soon as they go 2 months into arrears. Concurrently, I'm going to file a money claim online against them (have already sent the letter before action), any tips/advice?
I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
They have upto 2 weeks to file a defence, admission or file an acknowledgement of service, which would extend the date for filing a defence or admission upto 33 days from the date of issue (it is deemed served 5 days after issue, and then you get 14 days + another 14 for that lot).I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
Do they have any money? Bailiffs won't get anything from them if they can't get in the house peacefully. Do they own nice cars? Check they're not on finance first before you waste any money.
Mario149 said:
I have tenants who are refusing (not unable, refusing) to pay rent so they'll be getting an S8 and S21 through the post as soon as they go 2 months into arrears. Concurrently, I'm going to file a money claim online against them (have already sent the letter before action), any tips/advice?
I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
Had kind of a simular thing a few years ago, my tenant didn't have any cash or goods worth taking. So after I'd got judgement I applied for an attachment of earnings order as he did have a job, I got my money but it did take 3 years. I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
Thanks for the advice so far.
Do they have any money? Bailiffs won't get anything from them if they can't get in the house peacefully. Do they own nice cars? Check they're not on finance first before you waste any money.I don't know about cars/valuable goods to be honest. I'm just trying to understand what my options are if they try and make things difficult. Presumably if it's peaceful entry that is required I can just give 24 hours notice that I'm coming round in my capacity as landlord and let the bailiffs in myself...?
Cyberprog said:
Mario149 said:
I have tenants who are refusing (not unable, refusing) to pay rent so they'll be getting an S8 and S21 through the post as soon as they go 2 months into arrears. Concurrently, I'm going to file a money claim online against them (have already sent the letter before action), any tips/advice?
I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
They have upto 2 weeks to file a defence, admission or file an acknowledgement of service, which would extend the date for filing a defence or admission upto 33 days from the date of issue (it is deemed served 5 days after issue, and then you get 14 days + another 14 for that lot).I understand they've got 2 weeks to say if they're going to mount a defence, and if they do, another 2 weeks to prep it.
If I win and want to get bailiffs involved to knock on the door and collect money/goods to that value (to try and mitigate them doing a runner), how do I got about it?
Do they have any money? Bailiffs won't get anything from them if they can't get in the house peacefully. Do they own nice cars? Check they're not on finance first before you waste any money.
I think you may be mixing up the 2 month rule. As soon as rent is late, send them a letter before action giving them 7 days to pay the arrears, then serve proceedings for that months rent. You're recovering money owed here, nothing to do with tenancy notice. That generally chivvies them along. After two months,you can serve a section 8 for breach of tenancy, and depending on the backlog in your local county court, send them another notice before action, then a second set of proceedings, or apply to the court to amend the existing claim you submitted. The latter is preferable as it's been served 4 weeks or so previously and the hearing date will be closer.
Good luck.
Good luck.
catfood12 said:
I think you may be mixing up the 2 month rule. As soon as rent is late, send them a letter before action giving them 7 days to pay the arrears, then serve proceedings for that months rent. You're recovering money owed here, nothing to do with tenancy notice. That generally chivvies them along. After two months,you can serve a section 8 for breach of tenancy, and depending on the backlog in your local county court, send them another notice before action, then a second set of proceedings, or apply to the court to amend the existing claim you submitted. The latter is preferable as it's been served 4 weeks or so previously and the hearing date will be closer.
Good luck.
Yes, appreciate I wasn't clear! The S8 & S21 will be separate from the money claim. I only sent a LBA reference the unpaid rent (1 month's rent had been due 2 weeks before at that point) 10 days or so ago - my research indicated that 14 days notice before action was considered appropriate by the court, hence why I've got a few more days before beginning action. This just happens to coincide with the day I can serve the S8. Good luck.
I could have sent the LBA off say a week or so after they went into arrears, but I still had a bit of hope they'd pay up....as it was it just means that I'm 2 weeks behind where I could be which is irritating.
Mario149 said:
I don't know about cars/valuable goods to be honest. I'm just trying to understand what my options are if they try and make things difficult. Presumably if it's peaceful entry that is required I can just give 24 hours notice that I'm coming round in my capacity as landlord and let the bailiffs in myself...?
I don't know 100%, but I suspect that's not legal Cyberprog said:
Mario149 said:
I don't know about cars/valuable goods to be honest. I'm just trying to understand what my options are if they try and make things difficult. Presumably if it's peaceful entry that is required I can just give 24 hours notice that I'm coming round in my capacity as landlord and let the bailiffs in myself...?
I don't know 100%, but I suspect that's not legal https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/a...
Cyberprog said:
Mario149 said:
I don't know about cars/valuable goods to be honest. I'm just trying to understand what my options are if they try and make things difficult. Presumably if it's peaceful entry that is required I can just give 24 hours notice that I'm coming round in my capacity as landlord and let the bailiffs in myself...?
I don't know 100%, but I suspect that's not legal elanfan said:
Just quietly unlock the door and walk away - the bailiffs found the door open. Or escalate to high court and I think they can force entry.
I don't think even High Court Enforcement can force entry to residential property unless it's an eviction. Commercial properties they can.Grunt Futtock said:
I don't think even High Court Enforcement can force entry to residential property unless it's an eviction. Commercial properties they can.
If the door is open they can enter. They do not need to be invited in, even if a window is open and they can get through, that is fine. So yes I imagine attending a property with an open door would allow them lawful access.nikaiyo2 said:
If the door is open they can enter. They do not need to be invited in, even if a window is open and they can get through, that is fine. So yes I imagine attending a property with an open door would allow them lawful access.
That's why I used the word 'force', doors/windows open isn't forcing entry. Locksmith / hydraulic wedges is forcing entry.nikaiyo2 said:
Grunt Futtock said:
I don't think even High Court Enforcement can force entry to residential property unless it's an eviction. Commercial properties they can.
If the door is open they can enter. They do not need to be invited in, even if a window is open and they can get through, that is fine. So yes I imagine attending a property with an open door would allow them lawful access.Sheriff's Office says said:
There are strict rules around what is and isn’t permitted, and these do differ in some areas between bailiffs (County Court Bailiff or a Certificated Bailiff) on the one hand and High Court Enforcement Officers (HCEO) on the other.
Rights of entry to commercial premises
Generally speaking, HCEOs have greater power to force entry into commercial premises.
The HCEO can force entry to commercial premises to levy on a first visit or any subsequent visit to remove goods providing the property is not physically attached to, and form any part of, a residential dwelling. Before forcing entry, the HCEO should have a genuine reason to believe that goods of the defendant are inside. They should check whether the property is rented, contacting the landlord if necessary.
Bailiffs are ONLY permitted to force entry to commercial premises with the Court’s permission.
Rights of entry to residential premises
No one enforcing a judgment has the right to force entry into residential premises unless they have a signed walking possession agreement or were forcibly ejected. However, the HCEO or bailiff may climb a perimeter wall or fence to get into the grounds of the property.
They can enter where a door is open, opening further to aid entry if required.
They may also use the door handle to gain access when the door is unlocked. Under the new regulations (Taking Control of Goods 2014), they may no longer gain access via a window.
Once inside, they can break down the inner doors of the property to find goods belonging to the defendant.
They may not be forcibly ejected; however, if they are, they can now force re-entry back into the property. Also, once they have a signed Controlled Goods Agreement, they may also force entry, if necessary, on a return visit.
On a first visit, the HCEO or bailiff may force entry to a garage, out house, stables or barn providing it is not physically attached to, and form any part of, the residence
Rights of entry to commercial premises
Generally speaking, HCEOs have greater power to force entry into commercial premises.
The HCEO can force entry to commercial premises to levy on a first visit or any subsequent visit to remove goods providing the property is not physically attached to, and form any part of, a residential dwelling. Before forcing entry, the HCEO should have a genuine reason to believe that goods of the defendant are inside. They should check whether the property is rented, contacting the landlord if necessary.
Bailiffs are ONLY permitted to force entry to commercial premises with the Court’s permission.
Rights of entry to residential premises
No one enforcing a judgment has the right to force entry into residential premises unless they have a signed walking possession agreement or were forcibly ejected. However, the HCEO or bailiff may climb a perimeter wall or fence to get into the grounds of the property.
They can enter where a door is open, opening further to aid entry if required.
They may also use the door handle to gain access when the door is unlocked. Under the new regulations (Taking Control of Goods 2014), they may no longer gain access via a window.
Once inside, they can break down the inner doors of the property to find goods belonging to the defendant.
They may not be forcibly ejected; however, if they are, they can now force re-entry back into the property. Also, once they have a signed Controlled Goods Agreement, they may also force entry, if necessary, on a return visit.
On a first visit, the HCEO or bailiff may force entry to a garage, out house, stables or barn providing it is not physically attached to, and form any part of, the residence
KevinCamaroSS said:
Correct, not legal. Your 24hrs notice in the contract is an unenforceable term because it is trumped by the tenant's right to quiet enjoyment. You can ask if they will let you in, not demand it.
The Property Ombudsman has recently changed Rule 8F, that in practice landlords, agents must continue to write to tenant/s requesting at least 24 hours before access is required, sought, and must ask the tenant/s to confirm if access is acceptable. Consequently subject to this condition, the tenant/s must be given the opportunity to refuse access. The TPO now state “express consent SHOULD, rather than must be obtained”. Obviously an agent, landlord will need to record and keep evidence of the attempt/s to contact the tenant/s for access prior to entering the rental property.Forums | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff