Has anyone had a fine from an average speed camera?

[Ollywood]

I re-installed mt TomTom on a my phone and was quite surprised to see so many new (poorly marked) average speed areas! which got me thinking.

How many people do actually get fined?
And how could you even try to contest it?

Anyone been fined?

[SDB660]

Was fined the other month. Bang to rights. Photo supplied by authorities as standard.

[2lefthands]

For 6 months I did Cardiff to Leeds twice a week, M1, M5 and M62 works going on. Never caught, but rarely did over 35mph either! It isn't so much you don't get done, you can't get fast enough to try it because some fecktard won't stop twitching on the brakes when they hit 45mph.

[SS2.]

Ollywood said:

How many people do actually get fined?

Plenty.

Ollywood said:

And how could you even try to contest it?

By proving you were actually averaging the posted limit or less over the distance in question, or by identifying an evidential or procedural flaw of sufficient weight to render conviction unsafe.

[R33DNJ]

I had one on the M18/A1 interchange roadworks a few years ago - 57 on Sat Nav, knowing the ACPO guidelines start prosecution at 57, thinking (incorrectly!) that the average cameras would have a larger "buffer"....

I took the speed awareness course as prosecuted for 57 in a 50 average zone.

At least I then knew to sit at 55 on the Nav!!

[Ollywood]

SS2. said:

Ollywood said:

How many people do actually get fined?

Plenty.

Ollywood said:

And how could you even try to contest it?

By proving you were actually averaging the posted limit or less over the distance in question, or by identifying an evidential or procedural flaw of sufficient weight to render conviction unsafe.

So you'd need to have a black box in your car. And then would they recognise the data if you could get it out... Also on the north circular it must a bit of nightmare to calculate as there as so many exits.

Guess next question has anyone contested it and won?!

[Nik da Greek]

I got one from the permanent average camera setup on the A38 past the Bassetts Pole... the one they created to dissuade people from using "minor" roads and to force them onto the M6 Toll. Nothing to do with revenue, clearly... nothing to do with the fact that the A38 was a perfectly safe, open dual carriageway with a national speed limit one year and the next time we drove there the only thing that had changed was that the speed limit had been dropped to 60mph, the priorities changed to make it easier to end up on the M6 Toll whether you like it or not. And the average speed cameras of course.


Still, no arguments, I was bang to rights and it was my own stupid fault for not twigging that the speed enforcement signs were actually backed up by the hateful yellow camera poles. Irritatingly, I got done for 72mph average, which a year previously wouldn't even have triggered anything. I was offered a Speed Awareness Course, which cost more than the fine but avoided the points

[surveyor_101]

Astounded how many people ignore the sign posted ones. Had a new range rover with pouncy private plates come hoofing up behind me a 3rd on the way into in average 50 on the m5, then before it had ended but the 3rd lane reopened he was flat out in and gone. I assume his average would be interesting.

[Nigel_O]

Nik da Greek said:

I got one from the permanent average camera setup on the A38 past the Bassetts Pole...

I'd be interested to know what speed you were doing to be caught. I travel this stretch twice a day and I never cease to be amazed by the number of cars that cruise past me, while I'm sitting at an indicated 63/64mph.

I guess my 64mph is a true 60/61, so I'm probably being over-cautious, but I don't fancy playing Russian roulette with the camera tolerance

Always makes me chuckle when people hit the brakes for the camera gantries, then gas it again straight afterwards - clearly didn't pay attention in mathematics at school....

[Sir Bagalot]

R33DNJ said:

I had one on the M18/A1 interchange roadworks a few years ago - 57 on Sat Nav, knowing the ACPO guidelines start prosecution at 57, thinking (incorrectly!) that the average cameras would have a larger "buffer"....

I took the speed awareness course as prosecuted for 57 in a 50 average zone.

At least I then knew to sit at 55 on the Nav!!

That's handy to know as I usually sit on a real 52

[S11Steve]

Long discussion on it here - http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... - where I posted some examples from the fleet I manage.

Whilst looking for that post, I found another thread about the gantry cameras on the M25 near Heathrow, and whether they are active or not.
Looking at our data, most of the M25 NIPs are issued around Clackett Lane Services, Junction 8-9 Reigate or Epping Road (the tunnel section I think?)- I can't see any issued between J11 and J16 in either direction. Given the size of our fleet and volume of tickets we deal with, I somehow doubt that every single one of our vehicles has has gone through that stretch without speeding...

[Terminator X]

SDB660 said:

Was fined the other month. Bang to rights. Photo supplied by authorities as standard.

How do they supply a photo of you exceeding the average speed?

TX.

[Terminator X]

SS2. said:

Ollywood said:

How many people do actually get fined?

Plenty.

Ollywood said:

And how could you even try to contest it?

By proving you were actually averaging the posted limit or less over the distance in question, or by identifying an evidential or procedural flaw of sufficient weight to render conviction unsafe.

Not possible then!

TX.

[Nik da Greek]

Nigel_O said:

Nik da Greek said:

I got one from the permanent average camera setup on the A38 past the Bassetts Pole...

I'd be interested to know what speed you were doing to be caught. I travel this stretch twice a day and I never cease to be amazed by the number of cars that cruise past me, while I'm sitting at an indicated 63/64mph.

I guess my 64mph is a true 60/61, so I'm probably being over-cautious, but I don't fancy playing Russian roulette with the camera tolerance

Always makes me chuckle when people hit the brakes for the camera gantries, then gas it again straight afterwards - clearly didn't pay attention in mathematics at school....

Like I said, an average of 72mph.

It's a road we use only very infrequently, when we visit the mother-in-law. It's around 200 miles from where I live so I've no normal acquaintance with it or how it's changed. It just so happened we hadn't been up that way for a long while and between visits the average cameras had been installed. It had always had speed camera enforcement signs for the occasional mobile camera trap vans but I didn't twig they'd been changed to average speed ones since I'd last driven the road, and by the time we got there it was eleven o'clock at night, pitch dark and I didn't even see the cameras... probably would have just seen the botton of the yellow poles by the road but I wasn't looking for them

As I said, no arguments, I done the crime and took the time. Or the £80 copy of the Highway Code and a lecture, as it turned out

[Truffs]

surveyor_101 said:

Astounded how many people ignore the sign posted ones. Had a new range rover with pouncy private plates come hoofing up behind me a 3rd on the way into in average 50 on the m5, then before it had ended but the 3rd lane reopened he was flat out in and gone. I assume his average would be interesting.

Could well be exempt from speeding lots of exemptions out there and no need for Blues to claim the exemption. All you can do is the speed you are allowed to do and don`t worry about anyone else!

[CAPP0]

• IF* people do get fined from average speed cameras, there are going to be a lot of people who use that road who are going to be getting letters.

That said, the cameras seem really badly placed and if you take many of ths slip roads you'll miss the check zone.

I also wonder how many people, in general, don't understand "average", given how many slam on the brakes for an average speed camera then floor it again.

[All that jazz]

Terminator X said:

SDB660 said:

Was fined the other month. Bang to rights. Photo supplied by authorities as standard.

How do they supply a photo of you exceeding the average speed?

TX.

I am over how this one works too. Eagerly awaiting SDB660s answer to be enlightened!

[FurtiveFreddy]

S11Steve said:

Long discussion on it here - http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... - where I posted some examples from the fleet I manage.

Whilst looking for that post, I found another thread about the gantry cameras on the M25 near Heathrow, and whether they are active or not.
Looking at our data, most of the M25 NIPs are issued around Clackett Lane Services, Junction 8-9 Reigate or Epping Road (the tunnel section I think?)- I can't see any issued between J11 and J16 in either direction. Given the size of our fleet and volume of tickets we deal with, I somehow doubt that every single one of our vehicles has has gone through that stretch without speeding...

All the gantries HADECS cameras I pass under in that area are no longer live, only the newer HADECS3 installations are likely to be and some of them have been installed for a couple of years now and are still not live (like the ones near J6).

I think the Clackett Lane ones are responsible for a lot of penalties maybe because that section of M25 often has a 50mph VSL in place for something or other and a lot of drivers don't seem to be aware the trigger speed is actually quite low when a VSL is in place.

Are you sure about J8/9 M25? AFAIK there are no HADECS live around there at the moment...

[S11Steve]

FurtiveFreddy said:

Are you sure about J8/9 M25? AFAIK there are no HADECS live around there at the moment...

Just looked again, and We've not had any in 2016, but loads in 2015, with the last one was October 2015. I've not been down there for a while, so I'm not sure what system is currently in place or why it changed.

[FurtiveFreddy]

S11Steve said:

FurtiveFreddy said:

Are you sure about J8/9 M25? AFAIK there are no HADECS live around there at the moment...

Just looked again, and We've not had any in 2016, but loads in 2015, with the last one was October 2015. I've not been down there for a while, so I'm not sure what system is currently in place or why it changed.

OK, yes it's possible there was an active overhead gantry HADECS still active then, but not now. Nearest HADECS3 to there is the relatively new one between J9 and 10.

It was possibly here: https://goo.gl/maps/7EtmAbVve9M2

Was there photographic evidence included in that notice? Can you post it (without showing the car)?

Edited by FurtiveFreddy on Wednesday 23 November 16:49