Average Speed Cameras Most Stressful
Discussion
My own thoughts too for many years - but JC does write well 
https://www.drivetribe.com/p/bMVGfo03RsCbE4yI3lDBj...
https://www.drivetribe.com/p/bMVGfo03RsCbE4yI3lDBj...
Clarkson is similarly adept as Farage in igniting the hard of thinking. It doesn't mean he's right any more than he might be wrong.
Human policing of poor driving is lacking, however that isnt a supporting argument to remove speed cameras. After all, what you're saying is that people are such bad drivers that putting them altogether in close proximity is a dangerous thing- so lets allow them to be in close proximity at a higher speed. No doubt the argument would be that allowing higher speeds would reduce the bunch up, however that's really a function of traffic volumes rather than speeds. The same traffic would be at similar proximity with the same bad habits without the limit, albeit at a higher speed.
Clarkson's real argument is for the right to drive as fast as he likes, without accepting the rights given to him would also apply to the woman with no distance judgement and the Jonny Foreigners he likes to bemoan.
Human policing of poor driving is lacking, however that isnt a supporting argument to remove speed cameras. After all, what you're saying is that people are such bad drivers that putting them altogether in close proximity is a dangerous thing- so lets allow them to be in close proximity at a higher speed. No doubt the argument would be that allowing higher speeds would reduce the bunch up, however that's really a function of traffic volumes rather than speeds. The same traffic would be at similar proximity with the same bad habits without the limit, albeit at a higher speed.
Clarkson's real argument is for the right to drive as fast as he likes, without accepting the rights given to him would also apply to the woman with no distance judgement and the Jonny Foreigners he likes to bemoan.
AMG Merc said:
Like Clarkson's writing style. One thing there that can't be argued against is the fact that averge speed sections cause bunching and reduce stopping distances. I wonder where UK Gov stands on enforcing a lack of safety on us? 
They don't reduce stopping distances, stopping distances are reaction time + braking distance & braking distances are shorter with lower speeds (that's what can't be argued).They also don't cause bunching, driver's are responsible for the space they leave in front of themselves, not the speed limit.
What they do is keep traffic flowing, with less stop/start.
I'm with OP on this one.
'Speed' gets way over-represented as a cause of death but it's a real easy cash cow. If the powers that be found a way of taxing heart disease instead the speed kills thing would evaporate instantly and BRAKE would find all theirs chums have disappeared.
The thing I find little annoying is that contraflows on a motorway always seem to be 50 despite the fact that 'normal' A roads which are also contraflows are NSL.
'Speed' gets way over-represented as a cause of death but it's a real easy cash cow. If the powers that be found a way of taxing heart disease instead the speed kills thing would evaporate instantly and BRAKE would find all theirs chums have disappeared.
The thing I find little annoying is that contraflows on a motorway always seem to be 50 despite the fact that 'normal' A roads which are also contraflows are NSL.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
He seems to be criticising the lack of evidence for the view he doesn't agree with, whilst presenting no evidence to back up his own.
No, he's simply presenting qualitative evidence.You (and I) may prefer quantitative, but that's something the government likes to keep to itself particularly when it doesn't support its position and qualitative still has its place regardless.
The bunching that results on average limit sections is silly. He has a point as far as I'm concerned.
768 said:
The bunching that results on average limit sections is silly. He has a point as far as I'm concerned.
But that's down to drivers and their driving style surely?I join the local DC every day and some mornings there is slow moving traffic up to the exit I need.
You leave a gap and someone behind will pull out, overtake, and pull in in front of you to gain exactly 20 yards.
That's just down to bad driving nothing else.
vonhosen said:
They also don't cause bunching, driver's are responsible for the space they leave in front of themselves, not the speed limit.
How do you propose they maintain the space in front without encroaching on those arriving behind?This could be a breakthrough in queuing theory the likes of which we haven't seen for 50 years.
I find that drivers as a group are their own worst enemy. There might well be a few very well qualified drivers in my vicinity on a bunched up part of the road, but the overall IQ is less than an amoeba for want of a better term. We are the issue.
Most average speed sections I drive, generally flow, odd exception down to sheer volume (and more stupidity). What does not flow is the self regulated national speed limit sections when there are too many numpties up the jacksie of the car in front.
Most average speed sections I drive, generally flow, odd exception down to sheer volume (and more stupidity). What does not flow is the self regulated national speed limit sections when there are too many numpties up the jacksie of the car in front.
768 said:
vonhosen said:
They also don't cause bunching, driver's are responsible for the space they leave in front of themselves, not the speed limit.
How do you propose they maintain the space in front without encroaching on those arriving behind?This could be a breakthrough in queuing theory the likes of which we haven't seen for 50 years.
I dislike average speed sections as you're forced to mix with all traffic, frustrated van drivers, bimbling grannies, distracted mums etc, whereas usually I'd be past them in moments.
It's also a horrible feeling of being controlled like a puppet as usually I take speed limits with a pinch of salt and drive to the conditions plus chances of there being police or scamera vans in the immediate area.
I do find that with a GPS speed reading and cruise control set to 54, this does get you past a lot of people who are doing a speedometer 48 and an actual 45/46.
It's also a horrible feeling of being controlled like a puppet as usually I take speed limits with a pinch of salt and drive to the conditions plus chances of there being police or scamera vans in the immediate area.
I do find that with a GPS speed reading and cruise control set to 54, this does get you past a lot of people who are doing a speedometer 48 and an actual 45/46.
vonhosen said:
They don't reduce stopping distances, stopping distances are reaction time + braking distance & braking distances are shorter with lower speeds (that's what can't be argued).
They also don't cause bunching, driver's are responsible for the space they leave in front of themselves, not the speed limit.
What they do is keep traffic flowing, with less stop/start.
But the government are consulting on increasing the average speed through roadwork, mainly because it should improve the flow.........They also don't cause bunching, driver's are responsible for the space they leave in front of themselves, not the speed limit.
What they do is keep traffic flowing, with less stop/start.
Never had a problem with them, personally I don't rate Clarkson much, and that's putting it midley.
What has this crap to do with it - Behind, there’s a Lithuanian lorry driver who is busy texting his mistress in Finland. To my right, there’s a big woman in a Peugeot who’s too close to the steering wheel and far too close to the car in front, which is being driven by someone who arrived last week from Syria and who can’t read English, so while he’s seen the signs saying “average speed cameras” he doesn’t know what that means, so he’s impatient. He’s roaring up to the car that’s in his way, and then braking, a lot.
Does he have a crystal ball with him.
What has this crap to do with it - Behind, there’s a Lithuanian lorry driver who is busy texting his mistress in Finland. To my right, there’s a big woman in a Peugeot who’s too close to the steering wheel and far too close to the car in front, which is being driven by someone who arrived last week from Syria and who can’t read English, so while he’s seen the signs saying “average speed cameras” he doesn’t know what that means, so he’s impatient. He’s roaring up to the car that’s in his way, and then braking, a lot.
Does he have a crystal ball with him.
Edited by Vipers on Sunday 1st January 10:50
768 said:
vonhosen said:
They also don't cause bunching, driver's are responsible for the space they leave in front of themselves, not the speed limit.
How do you propose they maintain the space in front without encroaching on those arriving behind?This could be a breakthrough in queuing theory the likes of which we haven't seen for 50 years.
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