Rearrested for offence already convicted for?
Discussion
A friend of mine (yes really) has been arrested for evading duty. He is due to appear before magistrates on Monday.
Yes he did it because he's a complete idiot (and our 'friendship' has suffered somewhat as a result), but the point is he was arrested for this and convicted three years ago. The charge is the same as it was three years ago - identical dates and charge wording.
I can't speak to him as he's being held by the police, but is there any chance whatsoever this is a mistake?
Yes he did it because he's a complete idiot (and our 'friendship' has suffered somewhat as a result), but the point is he was arrested for this and convicted three years ago. The charge is the same as it was three years ago - identical dates and charge wording.
I can't speak to him as he's being held by the police, but is there any chance whatsoever this is a mistake?
Yes, it could be a mistake...
It isn't though.
Ask yourself, if the Police arrested him, he went to custody, pointed out the error and the Police checked (which would take less than 5 minutes) why would they still be holding him? They would release him immediately with an apology and probably a lift home. They haven't done this which indicates it's either a separate duty offence or a entirely different offence. Also for him to be given a court date he must have been charged, Police charge after speaking to the CPS, CPS are risk averse, won't charge unless they are fairly certain the individual has committed an offence.
It would take no time and no effort to see if this matter has been dealt with previously.
It isn't though.
Ask yourself, if the Police arrested him, he went to custody, pointed out the error and the Police checked (which would take less than 5 minutes) why would they still be holding him? They would release him immediately with an apology and probably a lift home. They haven't done this which indicates it's either a separate duty offence or a entirely different offence. Also for him to be given a court date he must have been charged, Police charge after speaking to the CPS, CPS are risk averse, won't charge unless they are fairly certain the individual has committed an offence.
It would take no time and no effort to see if this matter has been dealt with previously.
Edited by CoreyDog on Saturday 10th June 21:51
What was the result last time. Is there anyway he has not complied with any part of the sentence.
Mistakes do happen if its a court backed warrant he will be there until monday. If he can get proof of the convictions prior to then and its a circulation not via the court he may be able to get bail.
If he knows 100% that its wrong he could be on a nice little earner.
The arresting officers should make all possible efforts to prove or disprove the offence if it had been a weekend day it could be as simple as ringing the court.
Mistakes do happen if its a court backed warrant he will be there until monday. If he can get proof of the convictions prior to then and its a circulation not via the court he may be able to get bail.
If he knows 100% that its wrong he could be on a nice little earner.
The arresting officers should make all possible efforts to prove or disprove the offence if it had been a weekend day it could be as simple as ringing the court.
CoreyDog said:
Yes, it could be a mistake...
It isn't though.
Ask yourself, if the Police arrested him, he went to custody, pointed out the error and the Police checked (which would take less than 5 minutes) why would they still be holding him? They would release him immediately with an apology and probably a lift home. They haven't done this which indicates it's either a separate duty offence or a entirely different offence.
Yes, that's sort of my thinking too. His daughter has called me to tell me what has happened and he was allowed to call her and explain the charge on the arrest warrant. She has contacted his solicitor, but as yet no reply from her.It isn't though.
Ask yourself, if the Police arrested him, he went to custody, pointed out the error and the Police checked (which would take less than 5 minutes) why would they still be holding him? They would release him immediately with an apology and probably a lift home. They haven't done this which indicates it's either a separate duty offence or a entirely different offence.
That said would the police at a local station have the knowledge to be able to say whether or not it's the same offence? You would think so.
I suspect I'm not in possession of the full story.
baldy1926 said:
What was the result last time. Is there anyway he has not complied with any part of the sentence.
Mistakes do happen if its a court backed warrant he will be there until monday. If he can get proof of the convictions prior to then and its a circulation not via the court he may be able to get bail.
If he knows 100% that its wrong he could be on a nice little earner.
The arresting officers should make all possible efforts to prove or disprove the offence if it had been a weekend day it could be as simple as ringing the court.
He was found guilty and convicted. He is still technically on probation. The warrant is to appear before magistrates in Leeds. He is in Cheshire so being held at the local police station. Mistakes do happen if its a court backed warrant he will be there until monday. If he can get proof of the convictions prior to then and its a circulation not via the court he may be able to get bail.
If he knows 100% that its wrong he could be on a nice little earner.
The arresting officers should make all possible efforts to prove or disprove the offence if it had been a weekend day it could be as simple as ringing the court.
As to your question as to whether he has complied with the sentence I genuinely don't know. I think so, but like I said I don't really know him as well as I thought I did.
CoreyDog said:
Yes, it could be a mistake...
It isn't though.
Ask yourself, if the Police arrested him, he went to custody, pointed out the error and the Police checked (which would take less than 5 minutes) why would they still be holding him? They would release him immediately with an apology and probably a lift home. They haven't done this which indicates it's either a separate duty offence or a entirely different offence. Also for him to be given a court date he must have been charged, Police charge after speaking to the CPS, CPS are risk averse, won't charge unless they are fairly certain the individual has committed an offence.
It would take no time and no effort to see if this matter has been dealt with previously.
If hes arrested on warrant there wont be any charges - he'll go straight before the court as directed by the warrant. Police wont be interested in any explanations - theyll leave it to the court to sort outIt isn't though.
Ask yourself, if the Police arrested him, he went to custody, pointed out the error and the Police checked (which would take less than 5 minutes) why would they still be holding him? They would release him immediately with an apology and probably a lift home. They haven't done this which indicates it's either a separate duty offence or a entirely different offence. Also for him to be given a court date he must have been charged, Police charge after speaking to the CPS, CPS are risk averse, won't charge unless they are fairly certain the individual has committed an offence.
It would take no time and no effort to see if this matter has been dealt with previously.
Edited by CoreyDog on Saturday 10th June 21:51
Edited by Bigends on Saturday 10th June 22:50
Evasion of duty is normally dealt with by HMRC, not the Police, although they use Police custody suites as they've none of their own.
Pure speculation on my part but I'm guessing he was caught smuggling cigarettes or booze. That being the case there was almost certainly a confiscation under the Proceed of Crime Act 2002. Failure to satisfy a confiscation order will result in a further period of imprisonment so he may have been arrested on a commital warrant in connection with that.
Or
He was on licence and the licence has been rescinded.
Or
It's a mistake. It happens but he'll get about £800 for each hour in custody. Allegedly.
Pure speculation on my part but I'm guessing he was caught smuggling cigarettes or booze. That being the case there was almost certainly a confiscation under the Proceed of Crime Act 2002. Failure to satisfy a confiscation order will result in a further period of imprisonment so he may have been arrested on a commital warrant in connection with that.
Or
He was on licence and the licence has been rescinded.
Or
It's a mistake. It happens but he'll get about £800 for each hour in custody. Allegedly.
Bigyoke said:
Evasion of duty is normally dealt with by HMRC, not the Police, although they use Police custody suites as they've none of their own.
Pure speculation on my part but I'm guessing he was caught smuggling cigarettes or booze. That being the case there was almost certainly a confiscation under the Proceed of Crime Act 2002. Failure to satisfy a confiscation order will result in a further period of imprisonment so he may have been arrested on a commital warrant in connection with that.
Or
He was on licence and the licence has been rescinded.
Or
It's a mistake. It happens but he'll get about £800 for each hour in custody. Allegedly.
I am suspecting the former, but the charge would normally say failure to comply with confiscation order under POCA whereas this is a charge of evading duty.Pure speculation on my part but I'm guessing he was caught smuggling cigarettes or booze. That being the case there was almost certainly a confiscation under the Proceed of Crime Act 2002. Failure to satisfy a confiscation order will result in a further period of imprisonment so he may have been arrested on a commital warrant in connection with that.
Or
He was on licence and the licence has been rescinded.
Or
It's a mistake. It happens but he'll get about £800 for each hour in custody. Allegedly.
Anyway I am pretty sure I am not in possession of the full facts. Will know more tomorrow I guess.
Bigends said:
If hes arrested on warrant there wont be any charges - he'll go straight before the court as directed by the warrant. Police wont be interested in any explanations - theyll leave it to the court to sort out
That is very true.Edited by Bigends on Saturday 10th June 22:50
I just assumed as OP said he had been charged with an offence. Old saying, assumption makes an arse out of you and me.
If he was in Scotland he CAN (in theory) be tried twice for the same offence under our Double Jeopardy rules. But, there has to be substantially new evidence, and normally would only apply to a crime that carried a prison sentence, and normally a very serious one for the OK to be granted by the court of session.
Case I know of was one of a double murder where 40 years later the guy was retried and found guilty on the basis of new DNA evidence that linked him to the two separate scenes of crime.
Case I know of was one of a double murder where 40 years later the guy was retried and found guilty on the basis of new DNA evidence that linked him to the two separate scenes of crime.
grumpyscot said:
If he was in Scotland he CAN (in theory) be tried twice for the same offence under our Double Jeopardy rules. But, there has to be substantially new evidence, and normally would only apply to a crime that carried a prison sentence, and normally a very serious one for the OK to be granted by the court of session.
Case I know of was one of a double murder where 40 years later the guy was retried and found guilty on the basis of new DNA evidence that linked him to the two separate scenes of crime.
Not if he has already been found guilty of the same crime previously, as the OP stated.Case I know of was one of a double murder where 40 years later the guy was retried and found guilty on the basis of new DNA evidence that linked him to the two separate scenes of crime.
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