Norfolk to remove pcso's
Discussion
http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/norfolk-police-s...
Norfolk's pot is getting empty.
I can see where they are coming from re the pcso's. I'm not keen on the closing the front office's and only having 3 in the entire county and non on a sunday.
Norfolk's pot is getting empty.
I can see where they are coming from re the pcso's. I'm not keen on the closing the front office's and only having 3 in the entire county and non on a sunday.
nickfrog said:
PCSO was a poor value idea- not that much cheaper than a proper cop yet always on their phone and not really interested in crime.
They do an awful lot more than you suggest. Attending community meetings, carrying out educational visits in schools, foot patrols, engaging with the locals, obtaining and submitting intelligence, helping with controlling entry to crime scenes etc.
They free bobbies up from a lot of sh!t jobs to allow them to so other things. I don't want a PC sat doing school educational visits about stranger danger when a PCSO can do it. They're the eyes and ears out in the estates and city centres.
It's a shame they're being cut.
baldy1926 said:
http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/norfolk-police-s...
Norfolk's pot is getting empty.
I can see where they are coming from re the pcso's. I'm not keen on the closing the front office's and only having 3 in the entire county and non on a sunday.
Norfolk's pot is getting empty.
I can see where they are coming from re the pcso's. I'm not keen on the closing the front office's and only having 3 in the entire county and non on a sunday.
local rag said:
Tactically there will be also be more focus on operations to prevent crimes before they take place
Back to Peel.
Greendubber said:
nickfrog said:
PCSO was a poor value idea- not that much cheaper than a proper cop yet always on their phone and not really interested in crime.
They do an awful lot more than you suggest. Attending community meetings, carrying out educational visits in schools, foot patrols, engaging with the locals, obtaining and submitting intelligence, helping with controlling entry to crime scenes etc.
They free bobbies up from a lot of sh!t jobs to allow them to so other things. I don't want a PC sat doing school educational visits about stranger danger when a PCSO can do it. They're the eyes and ears out in the estates and city centres.
It's a shame they're being cut.
They were introduced to free Police officers to do the important stuff whilst they dealt with the more mundane stuff, stuff that only relied on limited powers.
The numbers doing the important stuff are down to the bone so they'll take a few more on to tackle that & simply ignore a lot of the more mundane stuff that PCSOs did.
The service is becoming more of a fire fighting model as time goes by.
gottans said:
Apparently the cost saving of a PCSO v a PC is around £1800 and the latter is far more flexible i.e. can be deployed to any situation and actually arrest people.
I can actually see this being an improvement and expect other forces will follow.
But if the PC ends up doing the mundane jobs the PCSO was doing all the time it's a an additional cost of £1800 & just fewer of those resources to deal with it all. You've got to bin the mundane jobs the PCSO was doing to realise the savings.I can actually see this being an improvement and expect other forces will follow.
Greendubber said:
nickfrog said:
PCSO was a poor value idea- not that much cheaper than a proper cop yet always on their phone and not really interested in crime.
They do an awful lot more than you suggest. Attending community meetings, carrying out educational visits in schools, foot patrols, engaging with the locals, obtaining and submitting intelligence, helping with controlling entry to crime scenes etc.
They free bobbies up from a lot of sh!t jobs to allow them to so other things. I don't want a PC sat doing school educational visits about stranger danger when a PCSO can do it. They're the eyes and ears out in the estates and city centres.
It's a shame they're being cut.
The one's around here are on the face of it an actual asset.
I heard the reason they're being cut is due to an increase in paedo & cyber crime (which might be the same thing).
We lost traffic wardens and the specials, that left the Police with fewer eyes on the street. When PCSO were introduced they were sold as eyes and ears of the Police.
The problem with PCSOs has always been they are not proper replacement for real coppers on the beat, they have lower entry requirements, less training and less powers.
If they were a sort of cadet, primarily used as a training/evaluation on a route to becoming full officers I would be be OK with that, but on the whole I would rather see more real copper on the beat.
However, this is cost cutting not working out a way to better Policing.
The problem with PCSOs has always been they are not proper replacement for real coppers on the beat, they have lower entry requirements, less training and less powers.
If they were a sort of cadet, primarily used as a training/evaluation on a route to becoming full officers I would be be OK with that, but on the whole I would rather see more real copper on the beat.
However, this is cost cutting not working out a way to better Policing.
A lot, it would appear, is in the way they are managed.
I didn't reckon the idea when they appeared but, given ever increasing costs and little or no increase in the income, they seemed to be a practical answer to underfunding. The odd thing is that now the police are struggling to cope, the thing that is easy to cut is the eyes and ears as it has little immediate effect.
Mind you, where's the intelligence going to come from? Information for home beat and patrolling officers was an essential to major inquiries.
So in effect the cheap replacement for home beat and patrolling officers has had to be cut because they are too expensive.
What a stupid way to pay for policing.
I didn't reckon the idea when they appeared but, given ever increasing costs and little or no increase in the income, they seemed to be a practical answer to underfunding. The odd thing is that now the police are struggling to cope, the thing that is easy to cut is the eyes and ears as it has little immediate effect.
Mind you, where's the intelligence going to come from? Information for home beat and patrolling officers was an essential to major inquiries.
So in effect the cheap replacement for home beat and patrolling officers has had to be cut because they are too expensive.
What a stupid way to pay for policing.
Problem is that PCSO were brought in to relieve PC of cycle and dog problems, before the cycle problems were ignored and dog problems tendered out to local councils, who can't afford to fund this service. My understanding of PCSO IQ ,is that on patrol ,they need two- one to workout how to get there ,and the other to workout how to get back. And to investigate a crime, another is needed .
Then CC saw them as a cheap way to get boots on the street, forgetting that they had no formal powers .
Then CC saw them as a cheap way to get boots on the street, forgetting that they had no formal powers .
My only interaction with a PCSO was not an inspiring one. Picture the scene: My old house with small front garden, gated. Resident's road (so quiet, narrow), police van with said PCSO parked just before front of my place with PCSO in it stuffing her face with some sort of pie, then alongside other side road grassed area about 10m wide then hedge, then main road. I'm out on the grass playing with hound when said hound decides to curl one out, I duly pick it up, walk across the road and lob it over my fence into my garden to square away later. PCSO doesn't like this and starts yelling at me from inside her van to pick it up and not leave it there. It's my house says I, I'll pick it up later thanks. She really doesn't like this and starts banging on about children and dog turds, etc. This actually annoyed me and I asked her how many kids she saw around right now and even if there were any, they would have to unlock my gate, go into my front garden, find the bag, undo it and start playing with it. All that right in front of me, not fifteen feet away. She just wound her window up without saying a single word, stupid fat woman. I'm a law-abiding bloke and quite respectful of police et al (I wear a uniform myself) and having been public facing in a previous life, know how stupid the general public can be but this lump just pissed me off due to her moronic stupidity and adherence to some sort of PCSO logic that had bugger all grounding in common sense. So no, not a big fan!
Edited by Osinjak on Friday 20th October 02:46
I don't have a problem with PCSOs being axed - as long as police numbers are increased.
In my opinion PCSOs are poor value for money - I see them in groups of two (and occasionally three) when I would much rather see a police officer.
1 x P.C. is cheaper than 2 x PCSOs.
I've no doubt there are some very good PCSOs out there but let's not forget they were introduced by Blunkett as a cost saving measure first and foremost, regardless of what roles they perform.
The way PCSOs are funded has changed and it would appear Norfolk don't regard them as cost effective either.
In my opinion PCSOs are poor value for money - I see them in groups of two (and occasionally three) when I would much rather see a police officer.
1 x P.C. is cheaper than 2 x PCSOs.
I've no doubt there are some very good PCSOs out there but let's not forget they were introduced by Blunkett as a cost saving measure first and foremost, regardless of what roles they perform.
The way PCSOs are funded has changed and it would appear Norfolk don't regard them as cost effective either.
Norfolk won't be the only force to axe the PCSO role, I'm sure. The cuts have taken everything there is to give in terms of fat, and now the core model of policing we're used to will have to change. Ironically enough, that probably means going back to pure police work. A lot of the neighbourhood stuff enacted under Labour was to boost the public confidence in the police, if not the effectiveness of the police outright. Under the Tories, that seems to be less of a consideration.
We may have got used to PCSO patrols on our streets but it looks like that age may be over. I can still remember the fuss from when they were introduced.
We may have got used to PCSO patrols on our streets but it looks like that age may be over. I can still remember the fuss from when they were introduced.
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