Extra penalty points for speeding
Discussion
Morning PH
I’m sure this will have been asked and answered before, but I’ll ask again for my individual case
Last year I got caught speeding (56 in a 40, gatso Camera ), and received 3 points and £100 fine. Fair cop, I hold my hands up to it. I paid the fine late and didn’t send my licence away as, like a fool, I didn’t read the letter and assumed (the mother of all f**k ups!) the points would digitally be put on my licence.
I’m the end, they wrote to me to summons me to court. I didn’t attend and instead made my guilty plea on the paperwork and sent it off, with an explanation as to why I didn’t do things right (no excuse really) along with an apology.
Now I expected the fine to increase along with court costs (although I’m not sure who the victim was to add a victim surcharge!) and I’m not disputing the fine att all, but I received 5 points. When all is considered, the offence seems to be your bog standard speeding offence, so to chuck me a couple extra doesn’t seem fair at all.
Has something changed where the points increase depending on the offence? I think I’ll appeal it, which goes to the crown court. I think it’s totally unfair but if I don’t have any chance of getting two points removed, I won’t bother.
I’m totally fine with the monetary penalty, but the extra two points are a bit of a Liberty in my eyes
Any advice would be much appreciated
Cheers
I’m sure this will have been asked and answered before, but I’ll ask again for my individual case
Last year I got caught speeding (56 in a 40, gatso Camera ), and received 3 points and £100 fine. Fair cop, I hold my hands up to it. I paid the fine late and didn’t send my licence away as, like a fool, I didn’t read the letter and assumed (the mother of all f**k ups!) the points would digitally be put on my licence.
I’m the end, they wrote to me to summons me to court. I didn’t attend and instead made my guilty plea on the paperwork and sent it off, with an explanation as to why I didn’t do things right (no excuse really) along with an apology.
Now I expected the fine to increase along with court costs (although I’m not sure who the victim was to add a victim surcharge!) and I’m not disputing the fine att all, but I received 5 points. When all is considered, the offence seems to be your bog standard speeding offence, so to chuck me a couple extra doesn’t seem fair at all.
Has something changed where the points increase depending on the offence? I think I’ll appeal it, which goes to the crown court. I think it’s totally unfair but if I don’t have any chance of getting two points removed, I won’t bother.
I’m totally fine with the monetary penalty, but the extra two points are a bit of a Liberty in my eyes
Any advice would be much appreciated
Cheers
When I received the letter informing me that I got caught by the camera and I had received points and a fine, I had so much going on at the time, I forgot to pay the fine or send my licence off. They sent me a reminder and explained that they take me to court if I didn’t sort it out, so I paid the fine but made the assumption (because I didn’t read the paperwork) that they wouldn’t need my licence as it’s all digital these days and I don’t have the paper part to write points on anyway. Because I didn’t send the licence, they ordered me to court.
It seems like they’ve given me extra points for not sending my licence away, which seems a little unfair. I expected the costs to rise, but the offence is the offence, which carries three points, so feel a little aggrieved I got five
It seems like they’ve given me extra points for not sending my licence away, which seems a little unfair. I expected the costs to rise, but the offence is the offence, which carries three points, so feel a little aggrieved I got five
I think I understand.
When you get the dreaded letter it gives you the choice of accepting the Fixed Penalty and 3 points, or going to court where the maximum penalty is ( I believe ) 6 points and £1000 fine.
Whilst you intended to accept the fixed penalty you failed to respond in time, and failed to enclose your licence and therefore it was dealt with at court.
The punishment then is at the court's discretion and it seems they would apply a higher penalty than the Fixed Penalty to incentivise people not to waste the courts' time when they should have read the Fixed Penalty instructions more carefully.
Not intending to be harsh but I think that's the logic behind you getting more points / bigger fine.
When you get the dreaded letter it gives you the choice of accepting the Fixed Penalty and 3 points, or going to court where the maximum penalty is ( I believe ) 6 points and £1000 fine.
Whilst you intended to accept the fixed penalty you failed to respond in time, and failed to enclose your licence and therefore it was dealt with at court.
The punishment then is at the court's discretion and it seems they would apply a higher penalty than the Fixed Penalty to incentivise people not to waste the courts' time when they should have read the Fixed Penalty instructions more carefully.
Not intending to be harsh but I think that's the logic behind you getting more points / bigger fine.
He will have been offer a fixed penalty of £100/3 points, this required him to send off £100 and his licence. He admits he did not send off his licence so the fixed penalty will have been withdrawn, the points removed (probably never added) and the £100 refunded. The offence will the have gone to court (or more likely Single Justice Procedure) and for 56 in a 40 thats a Band B fine plus 4 to 6 points.
Countdown said:
Sorry that doesn't make sense to me 
So they convicted you once and you got 3 points/fine. Why did they then summons you back to Court? Was that a different offence or the same one?
Same offence; I would assume. So they convicted you once and you got 3 points/fine. Why did they then summons you back to Court? Was that a different offence or the same one?
They offered him 3 points and fine for pleading guilty. He failed to follow the process in order to receive that punishment option, so it was closed off and he was taken to court.
The court looked dimly on their time being wasted because he couldn't read an important letter properly.
AGTLAW will probably be along to correct me
DeanR32 said:
HantsRat, the original penalty was 3 points and £100 fine.
No it wasn't. He didn't get three points and a fine because he didn't comply with the fixed penalty offer, so he was summoned for the offence and given five points, in line with Band B which is disqualify 7 – 28 days or 4 – 6 points. Looks like he might have dodged the Band B fine though which is 100% of your weekly income unless the offence was committed before the new sentences came into force so they might have kept the £100 but worth the OP checking to see if they cashed the cheque.DeanR32 said:
It seems like they’ve given me extra points for not sending my licence away, which seems a little unfair. I expected the costs to rise, but the offence is the offence, which carries three points, so feel a little aggrieved I got five
The fine and points in court will often be greater than the fixed penalty. It's to put people off appearing in court.Speeding is punishable with a fine of up to £1000 (£2500 on a motorway) and 3-6 penalty points or a ban of any length.
You were offered a fixed penalty. (3 points / £100.) If you comply with the conditional offer then court proceedings do not commence. You didn’t comply with the condition to send in your driving licence. This is unfortunately quite common.
Court proceedings were commenced. I doubt that a summons was issued. A Single Justice Procedure Notice is the usual method of commencing proceedings in England & Wales.
The court has a guideline that it must follow. 56/40 has a starting point of a Band B fine. 56-65 mph in a 40 limit has a guideline of 7-28 disqualification or 4-6 penalty points.
If the matter is prosecuted then I would normally anticipate 4 points for driving at 56/40.
If there is a good reason why the fixed penalty offer was not complied with then it is arguable that the court should endorse no more than 3 penalty points and the fine should be equivalent to a fixed penalty.
Didn’t read it carefully and didn’t send in my licence. I’m not convinced that’s a good a reason but you never know.
In my view 5 points is a bit high and a crown court judge may have some sympathy. You risk prosecution costs if your appeal isn’t successful. Another £300 or so.
You were offered a fixed penalty. (3 points / £100.) If you comply with the conditional offer then court proceedings do not commence. You didn’t comply with the condition to send in your driving licence. This is unfortunately quite common.
Court proceedings were commenced. I doubt that a summons was issued. A Single Justice Procedure Notice is the usual method of commencing proceedings in England & Wales.
The court has a guideline that it must follow. 56/40 has a starting point of a Band B fine. 56-65 mph in a 40 limit has a guideline of 7-28 disqualification or 4-6 penalty points.
If the matter is prosecuted then I would normally anticipate 4 points for driving at 56/40.
If there is a good reason why the fixed penalty offer was not complied with then it is arguable that the court should endorse no more than 3 penalty points and the fine should be equivalent to a fixed penalty.
Didn’t read it carefully and didn’t send in my licence. I’m not convinced that’s a good a reason but you never know.
In my view 5 points is a bit high and a crown court judge may have some sympathy. You risk prosecution costs if your appeal isn’t successful. Another £300 or so.
Edited by agtlaw on Thursday 1st March 14:39
DeanR32 said:
... and received 3 points and £100 fine. Fair cop, I hold my hands up to it. I paid the fine late and didn’t send my licence away as, like a fool, I didn’t read the letter and assumed (the mother of all f**k ups!) the points would digitally be put on my licence. ...
They made you a "Conditional Offer of 3 points and a £100 fine" with the emphasis on the "Conditional".The conditions are that you comply with that offer. By failing to do so you have now been dealt with in another way and that has taken into account your failure to comply with the instructions of how to comply with the conditions.
As you failed to comply then your subsequent penalty seems reasonable and fair in the circumstances your failure created.
agtlaw said:
The court has a guideline that it must follow. 56/40 has a starting point of a Band B fine. 56-65 mph in a 40 limit has a guideline of 7-28 disqualification or 4-6 penalty points.
If the matter is prosecuted then I would normally anticipate 4 points for driving at 56/40.
So was I 1mph too fast to avoid more points? Now that’s a kick in the gusset! If this is the case, could I argue that my vehicle could have a discrepancy in the accuracy of its Speedo? It’s a standard vehicle, but every vehicle seems to read speeds a little differently. I fancy an M3, but 5 points will mean insurance will be extortionate! The bit that grates is that I thought it was a traffic light camera (to detect people jumping the lights).If the matter is prosecuted then I would normally anticipate 4 points for driving at 56/40.
Again, it’s my fault for making assumptions and not reading the paperwork, but I thought paying the fine is an admission of guilt (bit like a parking ticket).
I happen to know someone who was caught speeding.. 3 points + £100 fixed penalty.. he paid the £100 online months ago but never sent his licence away and the points have not been put on his licence, checking the online system.
What has happened here? This thread prompted me to let him know.
What has happened here? This thread prompted me to let him know.
Lee540 said:
I happen to know someone who was caught speeding.. 3 points + £100 fixed penalty.. he paid the £100 online months ago but never sent his licence away and the points have not been put on his licence, checking the online system.
What has happened here? This thread prompted me to let him know.
How many months ago?What has happened here? This thread prompted me to let him know.
<6 - I'd say the issue is probabaly working is way through 'the system'.
>6 - There's more chance its fallen through the cracks.
Either way, I'd be looking to get the situation resolved. But that's just me
esxste said:
Lee540 said:
I happen to know someone who was caught speeding.. 3 points + £100 fixed penalty.. he paid the £100 online months ago but never sent his licence away and the points have not been put on his licence, checking the online system.
What has happened here? This thread prompted me to let him know.
How many months ago?What has happened here? This thread prompted me to let him know.
<6 - I'd say the issue is probabaly working is way through 'the system'.
>6 - There's more chance its fallen through the cracks.
Either way, I'd be looking to get the situation resolved.
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