Insurance renewal question (black box)
Discussion
Renewal is due shortly so looking online for quotes, however I’ve came accross a particular company who claim to increase premiums if the driving score is bad?
I understand how this would work if you paid monthly, however I intend on paying annually so how would they increase my premium before the 12 months is up?
I understand how this would work if you paid monthly, however I intend on paying annually so how would they increase my premium before the 12 months is up?
There's a few of the cheaper black box companies who do this. They'll send you a 'premium adjustment' if you drive like what they deem as a knob.
Basically you'll need to pay their excess charges or risk having your insurance cancelled. In some cases they'll just outright decide they're cancelling your policy should you do something really silly.
Not worth the potential savings as the cheaper companies tend to look for any such reason to charge you or cancel without refund.
Tesco Bank are the only black box company I'd consider using.
Basically you'll need to pay their excess charges or risk having your insurance cancelled. In some cases they'll just outright decide they're cancelling your policy should you do something really silly.
Not worth the potential savings as the cheaper companies tend to look for any such reason to charge you or cancel without refund.
Tesco Bank are the only black box company I'd consider using.
Presumably the Aviva 'safer driver' app is included in this. Is it not just a stupidly blunt instrument that tracks acceleration, braking force & speed?
I'm old enough that it doesn't make a significant difference whether I have a black box or not, but it seems like the fun of driving is being sucked out of us.
I'm old enough that it doesn't make a significant difference whether I have a black box or not, but it seems like the fun of driving is being sucked out of us.
At this point it should be pretty obvious to most people what the limitations of black boxes are, and what they don't take into account.
Black boxes aren't for most drivers, but I don't really understand why people get worked up over something they don't have to have.
For young drivers they could mean the difference between being able to get reasonably priced insurance, and not at all. Black boxes weren't an option when I was 17, so I ended up fronting (and probably wasn't actually insured in the event of an accident) because it was basically impossible to get a quote on anything with any kind of power.
Black boxes aren't for most drivers, but I don't really understand why people get worked up over something they don't have to have.
For young drivers they could mean the difference between being able to get reasonably priced insurance, and not at all. Black boxes weren't an option when I was 17, so I ended up fronting (and probably wasn't actually insured in the event of an accident) because it was basically impossible to get a quote on anything with any kind of power.
Biker 1 said:
Presumably the Aviva 'safer driver' app is included in this. Is it not just a stupidly blunt instrument that tracks acceleration, braking force & speed?
I'm old enough that it doesn't make a significant difference whether I have a black box or not, but it seems like the fun of driving is being sucked out of us.
Tried the Aviva drive safer app, hated it. I'm old enough that it doesn't make a significant difference whether I have a black box or not, but it seems like the fun of driving is being sucked out of us.
Tried to drive like my mother was sat at the side of me but seemingly punished for town driving.
On the motorway had a good score as you can plan ahead, town driving my score dropped with the constant accelerate/brake cycle.
The only way I could have improved my score would be to leave a large gap. You know just large enough for other drivers to nip in to.
Couple of years ago Aviva went into partnership with Brake pledging to make our roads safer highlighting the need for all road users to have safety at the forefront of their mind at all times, something to do with changing your mattress every eight years or something, I forget.
https://www.euroshellfuelcard.co.uk/brake-and-aviv...
https://www.euroshellfuelcard.co.uk/brake-and-aviv...
speedyguy said:
Durzel said:
Black boxes aren't for most drivers, but I don't really understand why people get worked up over something they don't have to have.
Yet 
mygoldfishbowl said:
Couple of years ago Aviva went into partnership with Brake pledging to make our roads safer highlighting the need for all road users to have safety at the forefront of their mind at all times, something to do with changing your mattress every eight years or something, I forget.
https://www.euroshellfuelcard.co.uk/brake-and-aviv...
I just had a look at that link - fhttps://www.euroshellfuelcard.co.uk/brake-and-aviv...
k me that comes over as patronising. Whether BRAKE are doing it for the right reasons or not, they will put off an awful lot of people with this sort of thing.speedyguy said:
Durzel said:
Black boxes aren't for most drivers, but I don't really understand why people get worked up over something they don't have to have.
Yet 23 years later...they are a niche product for young drivers.
Biker 1 said:
I think most young people are utterly stuffed on that one - it is almost impossibly expensive for a 17 year old to insure a car, let alone WITHOUT a black box. The knock-on effects are either driving uninsured, or driving deathtrap ancient cars, costing half the amount of the actual insurance. Young people are being shafted IMO......
They’re getting “shafted”, because they tend to have the highest frequency of accidents, coupled with highest severity. If they were just getting shafted then surely one insurer would spot that and clean up by offering insurance at a lower price. The value of their car has little bearing on the cost of their insurance. Car insurance cost is primarily driven (geddit) by the damage you can do with your, not to your car. A £500 snotter driven at 40mph into a few other cars all full of passengers can do as much damage as a £100,000 one doing the same thing. Young drivers tend to be far more likely to do just that compared to a middle aged father of two.
Gavia said:
Biker 1 said:
I think most young people are utterly stuffed on that one - it is almost impossibly expensive for a 17 year old to insure a car, let alone WITHOUT a black box. The knock-on effects are either driving uninsured, or driving deathtrap ancient cars, costing half the amount of the actual insurance. Young people are being shafted IMO......
They’re getting “shafted”, because they tend to have the highest frequency of accidents, coupled with highest severity. If they were just getting shafted then surely one insurer would spot that and clean up by offering insurance at a lower price. The value of their car has little bearing on the cost of their insurance. Car insurance cost is primarily driven (geddit) by the damage you can do with your, not to your car. A £500 snotter driven at 40mph into a few other cars all full of passengers can do as much damage as a £100,000 one doing the same thing. Young drivers tend to be far more likely to do just that compared to a middle aged father of two.
Yes, I think young people do get shafted by us old-folk, mostly in terms of housing costs....
Biker 1 said:
I'm aware of the whys & wherefores, but there must be a better way. In fact, if a 17 year old had a really nice, but not powerful, new-ish car, surely they would want to avoid crashing it at all costs.
I doubt most young drivers set out to crash, most do it because they are inexperienced and overconfident, a bad mix. I don't think it necessarily follows that because they are driving a newer car that they will automatically take less risks, or make fewer bad judgements. A lack of experience is simply and unemotionally just that - a lack of experience.Unfortunately systems necessarily based around statistics will inevitably result in outliers being punished for the sins of their peers. Careful 17 year old drivers exist, but not as far as insurance companies are concerned, and as far as their statistics show.
The solutions to this unfairness are things like black boxes, relatively blunt-but-better-than-nothing devices that seek to inform insurance companies about a specific driver's behaviour. They aren't infallible, as we all know, but arguably its a net positive thing (for young drivers) that they exist as an option.
Short of giving every policyholder a psych evaluation to determine what kind of driver they are, whether they're the sort to react aggressively, etc, all insurance companies have to go on is semi-anonymous statistics.
Zor600 said:
Renewal is due shortly so looking online for quotes, however I’ve came accross a particular company who claim to increase premiums if the driving score is bad?
I understand how this would work if you paid monthly, however I intend on paying annually so how would they increase my premium before the 12 months is up?
I would only get one if I was young and it was the only way to get some no claims to make the cost of motoring more sensible.I understand how this would work if you paid monthly, however I intend on paying annually so how would they increase my premium before the 12 months is up?
It's a bit like having a driving instructor next to you so for the 10-12mths you have to drive like an angel or risk having increased premiums and some policies I have heard have been canceled. I have driven works vehicles with a similar driver performance tracker and it takes discipline.
If you can't stick to speed limits etc don't bother with one as you will soon find problems. Heard of one young lady who got loads of speed alerts and 3 months before her policy ended started sticking to the limits but they refused her future insurance or a renewal.
Durzel said:
The solutions to this unfairness are things like black boxes, relatively blunt-but-better-than-nothing devices
That's blunt compared to what? Trying to predict the risk based on age, postcode and crash history?Having actual personal telematics data of the driver doesn't feel that blunt to me!
BertBert said:
That's blunt compared to what? Trying to predict the risk based on age, postcode and crash history?
Having actual personal telematics data of the driver doesn't feel that blunt to me!
I meant more blunt in the sense that it measures and assesses things without any context. Rapid acceleration could be an appropriate response to an anticipated threat (e.g. someone about to crash into the back of you), a dramatic steering input might be necessary to avoid an animal or large pothole. Either one of those things could result in a black mark.Having actual personal telematics data of the driver doesn't feel that blunt to me!
That's before considering how dangerous people can be when operating perfectly within speed, acceleration and cornering parameters - e.g. not looking before joining a road, not giving way, etc.
But I take your point.
BertBert said:
Durzel said:
The solutions to this unfairness are things like black boxes, relatively blunt-but-better-than-nothing devices
That's blunt compared to what? Trying to predict the risk based on age, postcode and crash history?Having actual personal telematics data of the driver doesn't feel that blunt to me!
"Insurance is a scam. So unfair that they just lump me in with others of my age and area, driving my type of car."
"No problem sir, this black box monitors you as an individual. If you're better than the average, you'll be rewarded"
"I'm not falling for that scam, spying on my wherever I go and seeing my indiscretions."
Biker 1 said:
I'm aware of the whys & wherefores, but there must be a better way. In fact, if a 17 year old had a really nice, but not powerful, new-ish car, surely they would want to avoid crashing it at all costs.
Yes, I think young people do get shafted by us old-folk, mostly in terms of housing costs....
Oh please, I see this so many times. How many youngsters pay mortgages with double digit interest rates? I was paying the same monthly amount for my first house in the late 80's and 90's as someone would now. Not to mention that being pre-China it cost massively more to furnish that house than it does now. Every generation thinks the one before had it easy. I've lost count of the number of young relatives who look at my house and say how "lucky" I am. All they see is the fruits of years of hard work not the years without holidays, nights out, new clothes etc etc that myself and many others of my generation went through to get on the housing ladder in the first place.Yes, I think young people do get shafted by us old-folk, mostly in terms of housing costs....
Kraken said:
Biker 1 said:
I'm aware of the whys & wherefores, but there must be a better way. In fact, if a 17 year old had a really nice, but not powerful, new-ish car, surely they would want to avoid crashing it at all costs.
Yes, I think young people do get shafted by us old-folk, mostly in terms of housing costs....
Oh please, I see this so many times. How many youngsters pay mortgages with double digit interest rates? I was paying the same monthly amount for my first house in the late 80's and 90's as someone would now. Not to mention that being pre-China it cost massively more to furnish that house than it does now. Every generation thinks the one before had it easy. I've lost count of the number of young relatives who look at my house and say how "lucky" I am. All they see is the fruits of years of hard work not the years without holidays, nights out, new clothes etc etc that myself and many others of my generation went through to get on the housing ladder in the first place.Yes, I think young people do get shafted by us old-folk, mostly in terms of housing costs....
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