Inheritance and familial nastiness.
Discussion
Some friends of ours, a married couple, are worrying themselves sick over this - I've advised them to see a solicitor, but in the meantime thought I'd ask on here.
Brief circumstances - they live in their mortgaged house with 3 kids and, up until recently, her dad. He moved in around 14 years ago - the arrangement was that he gave them £40k, some of which paid of some debts, in return for which he lived there in his own room, rent-free, fed and watered. He died a couple of months ago.
Her brother and sister then come out of the woodwork, having had no contact with her, or her dad, since way before he moved in with them. They want to claim 'what's rightfully theirs'. The will left everything to her. Being the nice person she is, she agreed to give them a third each of the chunk of money he'd left to her. They then find out about the £40k.
Apparently, a 'charge' was put on the property relating to the £40k, along the lines that that amount would form part of his estate as and when the property might be sold. As mentioned earlier, his whole estate was left to her anyway.
Siblings are demanding 'their' third each of said £40k, threatening court and solicitors et al. I'm thinking they haven't got a leg to stand on.
Any observations? As I said, I've advised them to seek proper legal advice. Feel free to post witless remarks and comments as you see fit, I'll sift out anything that might help put their minds at rest!
Pete
Brief circumstances - they live in their mortgaged house with 3 kids and, up until recently, her dad. He moved in around 14 years ago - the arrangement was that he gave them £40k, some of which paid of some debts, in return for which he lived there in his own room, rent-free, fed and watered. He died a couple of months ago.
Her brother and sister then come out of the woodwork, having had no contact with her, or her dad, since way before he moved in with them. They want to claim 'what's rightfully theirs'. The will left everything to her. Being the nice person she is, she agreed to give them a third each of the chunk of money he'd left to her. They then find out about the £40k.
Apparently, a 'charge' was put on the property relating to the £40k, along the lines that that amount would form part of his estate as and when the property might be sold. As mentioned earlier, his whole estate was left to her anyway.
Siblings are demanding 'their' third each of said £40k, threatening court and solicitors et al. I'm thinking they haven't got a leg to stand on.
Any observations? As I said, I've advised them to seek proper legal advice. Feel free to post witless remarks and comments as you see fit, I'll sift out anything that might help put their minds at rest!
Pete
14 years is a long time, i know my wifes family have looked at putting money/assets into a 7 year trust so there is no inheritance tax to pay when the time comes. Surely there is a limit on how long they can look back?
Failing that, surely if the siblings have crawled out just for money threaten to put a claim in for monies owed on upnaid rent?
Failing that, surely if the siblings have crawled out just for money threaten to put a claim in for monies owed on upnaid rent?
milleplod said:
Some friends of ours, a married couple, are worrying themselves sick over this - I've advised them to see a solicitor, but in the meantime thought I'd ask on here.
Brief circumstances - they live in their mortgaged house with 3 kids and, up until recently, her dad. He moved in around 14 years ago - the arrangement was that he gave them £40k, some of which paid of some debts, in return for which he lived there in his own room, rent-free, fed and watered. He died a couple of months ago.
Her brother and sister then come out of the woodwork, having had no contact with her, or her dad, since way before he moved in with them. They want to claim 'what's rightfully theirs'. The will left everything to her. Being the nice person she is, she agreed to give them a third each of the chunk of money he'd left to her. They then find out about the £40k.
Apparently, a 'charge' was put on the property relating to the £40k, along the lines that that amount would form part of his estate as and when the property might be sold. As mentioned earlier, his whole estate was left to her anyway.
Siblings are demanding 'their' third each of said £40k, threatening court and solicitors et al. I'm thinking they haven't got a leg to stand on.
Any observations? As I said, I've advised them to seek proper legal advice. Feel free to post witless remarks and comments as you see fit, I'll sift out anything that might help put their minds at rest!
Pete
So, the sister got £40k initially, and then the whole of his estate including his house, after he passed awayBrief circumstances - they live in their mortgaged house with 3 kids and, up until recently, her dad. He moved in around 14 years ago - the arrangement was that he gave them £40k, some of which paid of some debts, in return for which he lived there in his own room, rent-free, fed and watered. He died a couple of months ago.
Her brother and sister then come out of the woodwork, having had no contact with her, or her dad, since way before he moved in with them. They want to claim 'what's rightfully theirs'. The will left everything to her. Being the nice person she is, she agreed to give them a third each of the chunk of money he'd left to her. They then find out about the £40k.
Apparently, a 'charge' was put on the property relating to the £40k, along the lines that that amount would form part of his estate as and when the property might be sold. As mentioned earlier, his whole estate was left to her anyway.
Siblings are demanding 'their' third each of said £40k, threatening court and solicitors et al. I'm thinking they haven't got a leg to stand on.
Any observations? As I said, I've advised them to seek proper legal advice. Feel free to post witless remarks and comments as you see fit, I'll sift out anything that might help put their minds at rest!
Pete
The other 2 siblings wanted their share of the estate, which the sister has given them.
They now want a share of the £40k that her dad gave her 14 years ago - is that correct?
If the will was made with her as a sole beneficiary, and they weren't dependants, I'd have told them to go and take a long walk off a short pier.
Red 4 said:
I would imagine that any monies gifted/ given as part of an arrangement between father and daughter 14 years ago are irrelevant.
This does not form part of the deceased's residual estate.
As ever though, there are always 2 sides to a story.
Are you sure you've been told the whole truth ?
It seems a bit strange that the estate has been split 3 ways when there was only 1 beneficiary named in the will.
People, in my experience, are not usually that generous - especially if they were not on the best terms anyway, before any of this.
Yes, I have no doubt at all that we have the full story.This does not form part of the deceased's residual estate.
As ever though, there are always 2 sides to a story.
Are you sure you've been told the whole truth ?
It seems a bit strange that the estate has been split 3 ways when there was only 1 beneficiary named in the will.
People, in my experience, are not usually that generous - especially if they were not on the best terms anyway, before any of this.
She gave them a third each of the chunk of cash because she thought it was the right thing to do. She's a kind and generous person. Its not something I would have done in the circumstances, but she did it - I think she may even have hoped that it would build some sort of bridge between them.
milleplod said:
...I'll sift out anything that might help put their minds at rest!
...
How does that work? "Don't worry, dear friends, some anonymous person on an internet car forum who for all I know has zero legal training and zero relevant experience says that it will all be OK and you have nothing to fret about"....
I am sure that you mean well, but ....take fact specific and insured legal advice.
milleplod said:
Yes, I have no doubt at all that we have the full story.
She gave them a third each of the chunk of cash because she thought it was the right thing to do. She's a kind and generous person. Its not something I would have done in the circumstances, but she did it - I think she may even have hoped that it would build some sort of bridge between them.
Being nice to scum rarely comes with any reward.She gave them a third each of the chunk of cash because she thought it was the right thing to do. She's a kind and generous person. Its not something I would have done in the circumstances, but she did it - I think she may even have hoped that it would build some sort of bridge between them.
The reality is they would have to take legal action to get any more, and could end up with all the costs of doing so.
http://www.hmg-law.co.uk/-Challenging-a-Will-Who-P...
milleplod said:
They want to claim 'what's rightfully theirs'. The will left everything to her.
Give them what they are legally entitled to- no more, no less. I estimate that at zero.milleplod said:
Apparently, a 'charge' was put on the property relating to the £40k, along the lines that that amount would form part of his estate as and when the property might be sold.
How can he put a charge on their property without their knowledge & consent?Breadvan72 said:
How does that work? "Don't worry, dear friends, some anonymous person on an internet car forum who for all I know has zero legal training and zero relevant experience says that it will all be OK and you have nothing to fret about".
I am sure that you mean well, but ....take fact specific and insured legal advice.
Because there are quite esteemed voices on here whose scribblings would be worthy of merit, surely? Point taken though, of course. I am sure that you mean well, but ....take fact specific and insured legal advice.
Edited by milleplod on Thursday 9th August 15:39
Breadvan72 said:
I am sure that you mean well, but ....take fact specific and insured legal advice.
Did you miss this bit in the first line of his first post?milleplod said:
I've advised them to see a solicitor, but in the meantime thought I'd ask on here.
He was probably hoping that someone on here with the relevant expertise might give him something to go on.i.e. in general terms. With the usual caveat, IAAL but IANYL.
Red Devil said:
Breadvan72 said:
I am sure that you mean well, but ....take fact specific and insured legal advice.
Did you miss this bit in the first line of his first post?milleplod said:
I've advised them to see a solicitor, but in the meantime thought I'd ask on here.
He was probably hoping that someone on here with the relevant expertise might give him something to go on.i.e. in general terms. With the usual caveat, IAAL but IANYL.
Some SPL issues are quite simple and susceptible to internet advice (and not worth spending much or any money on), but family property disputes are in the "get help!" category.
I see no reason why they can't contest the Will.
If they are just after money, then they probably won't as it will cost them to do so.
Is it possible that your 'friend' influenced their father in some way while he lived with her, so that she was the only beneficiary?
I'm sure that's not the case, but you never know.
And that will probably be the line taken by their solicitor.
I'd try to arrange a reasoned and calm meeting in a neutral place, with a 3rd party present if possible.
Hammer out a deal or lawyer up.
If they are just after money, then they probably won't as it will cost them to do so.
Is it possible that your 'friend' influenced their father in some way while he lived with her, so that she was the only beneficiary?
I'm sure that's not the case, but you never know.
And that will probably be the line taken by their solicitor.
I'd try to arrange a reasoned and calm meeting in a neutral place, with a 3rd party present if possible.
Hammer out a deal or lawyer up.
Part of me thinks that anyone who would charge their own father 40K for food and shelter deserves whatever plaguey siblings they evidently have.
My 81 year old mum lives in my house*. I do not send her any bills.
* I wish that I could say that I actually live with my mum, but I don't, as I live somewhere else.
My 81 year old mum lives in my house*. I do not send her any bills.
* I wish that I could say that I actually live with my mum, but I don't, as I live somewhere else.
catman said:
If I was put in that position, I would write a letter withdrawing my previous, very generous offer and tell them to sue me. If she hasn't seen them for that long, then she doesn't really have any Siblings.
Tim
I completely agree with Breadvan - you need fact-based, objective and dispassionate advice, just to put your friends' minds at rest and give them confidence to face the siblings down if that is what they decide to do. Tim
I've seen family rifts following wills too often to want to see another. The wills seldom cause the problem - they are a catalyst for the eruption of expressions of the factors underlying the pre-existing state of the (non-) relationships, so it is almost always too late to do anything about them. Even if she meets their requests, the relationships are unlikely to improve.
That said, my instinct, were I in her shoes, would be to tell them that she's now not giving them a penny and their "shares" are going to the Dog's Home instead (or buying her husband a seriously frivolous car as this is PH). She doesn't need to follow through on either, obvs
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