Slowness contributes to crashes...
Discussion
Said this for years. For myself, the danger comes from hitting 150 mph as soon as the dawdlers have gone due to the frustration 
https://www.itv.com/news/2018-12-29/spike-in-road-...
https://www.itv.com/news/2018-12-29/spike-in-road-...
People joining the motorway too slow is something that really annoys me.
With how busy most are it isn't really that hard to get up to 50-60mph to match the traffic in L1. So many people i seem to follow think that attempting to merge at 30mph is acceptable.
I wouldn't mind if cars were as slow as they were 30 years ago but is there really any car available today that isn't physically able to get up to 50mph even half way down a typical slip road?
With how busy most are it isn't really that hard to get up to 50-60mph to match the traffic in L1. So many people i seem to follow think that attempting to merge at 30mph is acceptable.
I wouldn't mind if cars were as slow as they were 30 years ago but is there really any car available today that isn't physically able to get up to 50mph even half way down a typical slip road?
Yes I do agree, it appears to be quite common in my opinion on the A12 that people are joining dual carrige ways to slow, I also regulary see people driving around 50mph on the A12 being over taken by HGVS for what appears, to be no reason driving that slow, or worse and sitting in the middle lane between 50mph - 60mph.
Experienced just this tonight. Driver in front doing 35 as we hit the motorway, which caused a lorry (which should have anticipated this) to swerve to lane 2 and split us. We sensibly hung back as the dawdler in front jumped in front of the lorry. We joined the motorway, over to lane 3 (completely empty behind) and hit 90 fairly quickly. Meanwhile the dawdler had sped up and was now happy doing c85 in lane 1.
Piss poor given the dawdler was in a decently specced Sxirocco that could’ve done a lot more than 35 when joining the motorway.
Piss poor given the dawdler was in a decently specced Sxirocco that could’ve done a lot more than 35 when joining the motorway.
Digby said:
Old people tend to be ok so long as you only discover them in 30 zones.
Their approach is 40 mph in 70 zones, 40 mph in 60 zones, 40 mph in 50 zones, 40 mph in 30 zones \o/
Define old. I am probably in your category, and feel I need to restrain myself in 70, 60, zones etc. I have no problem getting up to speed on slip roads, usually choosin the LH lane if there is a choice, that is nearly always clear ahead and becomes its own lane.Their approach is 40 mph in 70 zones, 40 mph in 60 zones, 40 mph in 50 zones, 40 mph in 30 zones \o/
Pica-Pica said:
Digby said:
Old people tend to be ok so long as you only discover them in 30 zones.
Their approach is 40 mph in 70 zones, 40 mph in 60 zones, 40 mph in 50 zones, 40 mph in 30 zones \o/
Define old. I am probably in your category, and feel I need to restrain myself in 70, 60, zones etc. I have no problem getting up to speed on slip roads, usually choosin the LH lane if there is a choice, that is nearly always clear ahead and becomes its own lane.Their approach is 40 mph in 70 zones, 40 mph in 60 zones, 40 mph in 50 zones, 40 mph in 30 zones \o/
I’m rarely troubled by the type of behaviour he complains about though; maybe my regular track days sharpen my awareness?
The comments from the IAM spokesperson quoted in the article come from someone to be living in the past...…..tardy is not a word used very often by anyone under 50-60 is it.
“Slow drivers are just one extra hazard that any good driver must be able to deal with," he said.
“By using the key advanced driving skills of observation, anticipation and patience, anyone should be able to cope with a hesitant or tardy person on the road."
I appreciate you the NSL is a limit not a target but the drivers who are in no particular hurry ( for whatever their valid reason ) should try to have more empathy other drivers who might have a little more purpose to their journey. The build up frustration caused by someone who dawdles along a single carriageway at 40-45mph, for no apparent reason, can be enormous if you are travelling for work. The frustrated drivers behind can often make poor / rash decisions when attempting to overtake.
If dawdlers were travelling instead at or near the NSL then they would not be a hazard to be negotiated or avoided. Yes of course anyone should be able to cope with the hazard or hesitant dawdler by using observation, anticipation and patience but the dawdler is creating the hazard.
“Slow drivers are just one extra hazard that any good driver must be able to deal with," he said.
“By using the key advanced driving skills of observation, anticipation and patience, anyone should be able to cope with a hesitant or tardy person on the road."
I appreciate you the NSL is a limit not a target but the drivers who are in no particular hurry ( for whatever their valid reason ) should try to have more empathy other drivers who might have a little more purpose to their journey. The build up frustration caused by someone who dawdles along a single carriageway at 40-45mph, for no apparent reason, can be enormous if you are travelling for work. The frustrated drivers behind can often make poor / rash decisions when attempting to overtake.
If dawdlers were travelling instead at or near the NSL then they would not be a hazard to be negotiated or avoided. Yes of course anyone should be able to cope with the hazard or hesitant dawdler by using observation, anticipation and patience but the dawdler is creating the hazard.
I've experienced the too slows at slip roads too. One t
t even stopped briefly before pulling across into the path of the heavies. Really thought I was going to see something terrible - waited myself (now stationary in the slip road) to see what unfolded only to have Mr impatient/notlooking in his BMW behind me now blasting his horn to get out his way.
Complete lack of spatial awareness and confidence necessary to drive, missed completely as they haven't worked out which sensors the little metal box of electronics needs to police it.
And some of you still enjoy this driving lark..?
t even stopped briefly before pulling across into the path of the heavies. Really thought I was going to see something terrible - waited myself (now stationary in the slip road) to see what unfolded only to have Mr impatient/notlooking in his BMW behind me now blasting his horn to get out his way.Complete lack of spatial awareness and confidence necessary to drive, missed completely as they haven't worked out which sensors the little metal box of electronics needs to police it.
And some of you still enjoy this driving lark..?
I’ve encountered a few 30 drivers lately, on NSL A roads. One had a monster tailback behind them with everyone getting frustrated.
IMHO the UK needs to be proactive with drivers who’s skills and abilities fall short of what is required. Inevitably this means more police on the roads and possibly an age related assessment.
My dearly departed father perhaps drove for too long into his 80s but a tesco carpark incident knocked his confidence and my sibblings & me took over his driving needs for him (shopping, family social events, appointments etc) so he stopped. We knew his abilities had declined prior to the incident. It was a difficult situation for us to address with dad and the minor incident helped with the desired outcome, however, the incident could have been much worse.
Ian
IMHO the UK needs to be proactive with drivers who’s skills and abilities fall short of what is required. Inevitably this means more police on the roads and possibly an age related assessment.
My dearly departed father perhaps drove for too long into his 80s but a tesco carpark incident knocked his confidence and my sibblings & me took over his driving needs for him (shopping, family social events, appointments etc) so he stopped. We knew his abilities had declined prior to the incident. It was a difficult situation for us to address with dad and the minor incident helped with the desired outcome, however, the incident could have been much worse.
Ian
Crackie said:
The comments from the IAM spokesperson quoted in the article come from someone to be living in the past...…..tardy is not a word used very often by anyone under 50-60 is it.
“Slow drivers are just one extra hazard that any good driver must be able to deal with," he said.
“By using the key advanced driving skills of observation, anticipation and patience, anyone should be able to cope with a hesitant or tardy person on the road."
I appreciate you the NSL is a limit not a target but the drivers who are in no particular hurry ( for whatever their valid reason ) should try to have more empathy other drivers who might have a little more purpose to their journey. The build up frustration caused by someone who dawdles along a single carriageway at 40-45mph, for no apparent reason, can be enormous if you are travelling for work. The frustrated drivers behind can often make poor / rash decisions when attempting to overtake.
If dawdlers were travelling instead at or near the NSL then they would not be a hazard to be negotiated or avoided. Yes of course anyone should be able to cope with the hazard or hesitant dawdler by using observation, anticipation and patience but the dawdler is creating the hazard.
Maybe its just me, but in 20+ years of driving I've never had a single issue caused by someone driving too slowly, because I use my eyes and brain and common sense.“Slow drivers are just one extra hazard that any good driver must be able to deal with," he said.
“By using the key advanced driving skills of observation, anticipation and patience, anyone should be able to cope with a hesitant or tardy person on the road."
I appreciate you the NSL is a limit not a target but the drivers who are in no particular hurry ( for whatever their valid reason ) should try to have more empathy other drivers who might have a little more purpose to their journey. The build up frustration caused by someone who dawdles along a single carriageway at 40-45mph, for no apparent reason, can be enormous if you are travelling for work. The frustrated drivers behind can often make poor / rash decisions when attempting to overtake.
If dawdlers were travelling instead at or near the NSL then they would not be a hazard to be negotiated or avoided. Yes of course anyone should be able to cope with the hazard or hesitant dawdler by using observation, anticipation and patience but the dawdler is creating the hazard.
Anyone who finds slow moving vehicles a problem should look at their own driving and attitude first, because that slow moving vehicle could just as easily be slowing due to breaking down or some other circumstance that other drivers can't easily see, and any good driver should be more than capable of anticiapting and dealing with such situations because they are not rare, slow moving vehicles or those doing the unexpected occur on every journey we drive.
If people took more responsibility for their own driving first and foremost, rather than blaming their own low standards on others, our general road safety would improve no end. Sadly we now have a culture where people leave no room for error (their own or others) and then blame everyone but themselves for anything they do wrong.
A few points.
HGVs may be travelling at 50 in a 60, but police realise that those HGVs that travel at 60 do not provoke risky overtakes.
Some travelling at 50 may have a temporary spare.
I usual spot a few driving hesitantly, they are usually looking for somewhere, a house, side road etc.
Tardy is not a particularly old word (Retard, on the other hand is an obnoxious word that says more about its user than the person described)
HGVs may be travelling at 50 in a 60, but police realise that those HGVs that travel at 60 do not provoke risky overtakes.
Some travelling at 50 may have a temporary spare.
I usual spot a few driving hesitantly, they are usually looking for somewhere, a house, side road etc.
Tardy is not a particularly old word (Retard, on the other hand is an obnoxious word that says more about its user than the person described)
JimSuperSix said:
Maybe its just me, but in 20+ years of driving I've never had a single issue caused by someone driving too slowly, because I use my eyes and brain and common sense.
Anyone who finds slow moving vehicles a problem should look at their own driving and attitude first, because that slow moving vehicle could just as easily be slowing due to breaking down or some other circumstance that other drivers can't easily see, and any good driver should be more than capable of anticiapting and dealing with such situations because they are not rare, slow moving vehicles or those doing the unexpected occur on every journey we drive.
If people took more responsibility for their own driving first and foremost, rather than blaming their own low standards on others, our general road safety would improve no end. Sadly we now have a culture where people leave no room for error (their own or others) and then blame everyone but themselves for anything they do wrong.
I am with you but not a single "Issue"? Yes I have never come close to crashing into one or swerving into traffic to avoid one but issues encompass more than that. I have had longer journey times, used more fuel, been involved in congestion and slowed to the extent that there was a chance that someone might run into me. Anyone who finds slow moving vehicles a problem should look at their own driving and attitude first, because that slow moving vehicle could just as easily be slowing due to breaking down or some other circumstance that other drivers can't easily see, and any good driver should be more than capable of anticiapting and dealing with such situations because they are not rare, slow moving vehicles or those doing the unexpected occur on every journey we drive.
If people took more responsibility for their own driving first and foremost, rather than blaming their own low standards on others, our general road safety would improve no end. Sadly we now have a culture where people leave no room for error (their own or others) and then blame everyone but themselves for anything they do wrong.
This was very close once and it did result in a several car accident (Not involving mine, the bad driver or the slow moving vehicle directly) . It was caused by someone's poor reaction to a slow driver so it was an issue in as much it wouldn't have happened were it not for the slow driver,but the lion's share of the blame lies elsewhere.
Let's turn it around, hustling down a narrow country road at 60. A car reverses out of a blind driveway and there is an accident. Just because better driving by the person emerging would have avoided the accident does not mean the speed of the car was not an issue.
Edited by Graveworm on Sunday 30th December 12:13
at the age of 78 and following a stroke last january, i await a date for my 3 year ROSPA retest in early 2019.
have one silver and six gold passes since 2001...hope to add another gold around march 2019.
age alone does not cause poor driving awareness...i had to take an assessment following the stroke and report result to dvla - who were very helpful throughout the procedure...assessment drive had one in the back and driving instructor in passenger seat...training prevailed!
BOF
have one silver and six gold passes since 2001...hope to add another gold around march 2019.
age alone does not cause poor driving awareness...i had to take an assessment following the stroke and report result to dvla - who were very helpful throughout the procedure...assessment drive had one in the back and driving instructor in passenger seat...training prevailed!
BOF
JimSuperSix said:
Crackie said:
The comments from the IAM spokesperson quoted in the article come from someone to be living in the past...…..tardy is not a word used very often by anyone under 50-60 is it.
“Slow drivers are just one extra hazard that any good driver must be able to deal with," he said.
“By using the key advanced driving skills of observation, anticipation and patience, anyone should be able to cope with a hesitant or tardy person on the road."
I appreciate you the NSL is a limit not a target but the drivers who are in no particular hurry ( for whatever their valid reason ) should try to have more empathy other drivers who might have a little more purpose to their journey. The build up frustration caused by someone who dawdles along a single carriageway at 40-45mph, for no apparent reason, can be enormous if you are travelling for work. The frustrated drivers behind can often make poor / rash decisions when attempting to overtake.
If dawdlers were travelling instead at or near the NSL then they would not be a hazard to be negotiated or avoided. Yes of course anyone should be able to cope with the hazard or hesitant dawdler by using observation, anticipation and patience but the dawdler is creating the hazard.
Maybe its just me, but in 20+ years of driving I've never had a single issue caused by someone driving too slowly, because I use my eyes and brain and common sense.“Slow drivers are just one extra hazard that any good driver must be able to deal with," he said.
“By using the key advanced driving skills of observation, anticipation and patience, anyone should be able to cope with a hesitant or tardy person on the road."
I appreciate you the NSL is a limit not a target but the drivers who are in no particular hurry ( for whatever their valid reason ) should try to have more empathy other drivers who might have a little more purpose to their journey. The build up frustration caused by someone who dawdles along a single carriageway at 40-45mph, for no apparent reason, can be enormous if you are travelling for work. The frustrated drivers behind can often make poor / rash decisions when attempting to overtake.
If dawdlers were travelling instead at or near the NSL then they would not be a hazard to be negotiated or avoided. Yes of course anyone should be able to cope with the hazard or hesitant dawdler by using observation, anticipation and patience but the dawdler is creating the hazard.
Anyone who finds slow moving vehicles a problem should look at their own driving and attitude first, because that slow moving vehicle could just as easily be slowing due to breaking down or some other circumstance that other drivers can't easily see, and any good driver should be more than capable of anticiapting and dealing with such situations because they are not rare, slow moving vehicles or those doing the unexpected occur on every journey we drive.
If people took more responsibility for their own driving first and foremost, rather than blaming their own low standards on others, our general road safety would improve no end. Sadly we now have a culture where people leave no room for error (their own or others) and then blame everyone but themselves for anything they do wrong.
Slow or slower drivers have been around ever since the man with the red flag.
It is a clear indication of the impatience of drivers which is a large part of modern motoring.
Try driving in or around York at any time and you'll find that it's rare for anyone to speed. Whilst the city centre is usually busy and requires driving at 10-15mph, even when heading out from the centre the same dawdlers are always there. It also continues in to the 40 zones for some.
When you reach the national speed limit road e.g outer ring road it's rare to see anyone over 40mph. It used to piss me off at first tbh but I've found that my driving has actually improved from it! When you get outside the outer ring road there's not that many and the A64 can be pretty mental with the amount of crashes that happen on it.
Leeds is completely different in comparison though. There's always some asshole sitting right up your dungchute trying to bully other drivers out the way, particularly on the dual carriageways.
When you reach the national speed limit road e.g outer ring road it's rare to see anyone over 40mph. It used to piss me off at first tbh but I've found that my driving has actually improved from it! When you get outside the outer ring road there's not that many and the A64 can be pretty mental with the amount of crashes that happen on it.
Leeds is completely different in comparison though. There's always some asshole sitting right up your dungchute trying to bully other drivers out the way, particularly on the dual carriageways.
nonsequitur said:
Please define slow in this context.
Slow in the sense that a 40ton supermarket wagon feels the need to get passed to maintain his schedule.That was the last near accident I had, I imagine the driver either miss judged how close he was to the bend, or the dawdler he was passing suddenly decided then was the time to accelerate from 35 to 55, as often happens when you try to pass someone in a goods vehicle.
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