Deposit Protection Service - Useless, Incompetent etc
Discussion
Just thought I'd post of my experience with the Government's Deposit Protection Service...
If you have Googled this and ended up here, let me help by saying you will lose a lot of hair in frustration - they are totally inept. At best.
So, my basic story is this...
6/7/8 years ago (deliberately vague, small world etc) rented a house with my partner. I paid the deposit, from my account, via cheque, to Agent.
Tenancy in joint names.
Tenancy agreement in joint names.
Got some photocopied generic paperwork about the Deposit Protection Service (DPS) along with other ''legal' stuff from Agent.
Fast-forward to some months ago, moved out.
Landlord happy with everything verbally, condition etc upon vacation. No arrears, no problems...
2 weeks later ask (via DPS who actually have the money I paid 6/7/8 years previously) to claim back the deposit...referred to with ref number in Tenancy Agreement.
Had to register etc with DPS - found the website totally confusing...and open an 'Account' to get my money back.
Anyway, requested deposit via the DPS, had to fill in my bank account details for repayment of deposit..then waited days, and waited more days...for The Landlord to get in touch to agree I could have my deposit back.
Rang up to ask how long does DPS allow an AWOL Landlord to respond, or what happens if they don't respond etc...
"We are not authorised to speak to you as the deposit is not in your name" Wow..So had to get my partner to ring and give them permission to speak with me - the person who actually paid the deposit, who is named on the Tenancy Agreement...
Then the Landlord eventually decides (via DPS website) that they want to keep our/my deposit, but didn't provide any details as to why...
At this point (via the useless DPS website) I had a stark choice of either accepting or rejecting not getting my deposit back - the actual language wasn't clear so I rang up to clarify.
So in the absence of any further options, I clicked the button that I reject the Landlord's answer, which was basically the Landlord rejecting me asking for some actual details...I hadn't actually disputed anything, as there wasn't any information or facts to dispute. Forgot to say I had to enter my bank account details again...
And that was that...no further dialog...we were now at the 'Dispute Resolution' stage...and I have to provide evidence as to why I want my deposit back...
I rang up the DPS and asked if there had been a mistake? How can we be in dispute when I have no details of allegations? "That is the procedure" I was told. Also told of the deadline to submit evidence. Reminded of that a lot. Move the caller along...
A totally ridiculous situation to be in!
Bit like going to the Police and saying you'd been assaulted but not saying where or how and then going to court, but the defendant hasn't got a clue what charges he is answering...
Or a hire car being damaged but the Hire firm refusing to say what damage has been inflicted. Then taking the person who hired it to court, and asking them to provide evidence to show they didn't damage the car...totally the opposite of impartial!
So I have to submit evidence and literally guess what the problem is...was it a broken blade of grass? Chimney damaged by Santa one year? Crashed plane in the bathroom? No idea - the Landlord won't say, and the DPS won't ask the Landlord to clarify..."just submit your evidence"...
I could go on...but at every stage I have been let down.
But the best is yet to come...
The deadline that the DPS gives itself (Terms And Conditions - see irony below) to reach a decision (either I get all, some or none of my deposit back) is 4 weeks (which I only found out about today) after the original deadline that both parties have to submit evidence by.
Today I ring up the DPS to see what the situation is - the deadline is now an extra 5 weeks, on top of their 4 weeks, meaning 9 weeks waiting, on top of the 8 weeks already to get to this stage...I questioned the use of the word 'Deadline'.
The DPS isn't fit for purpose. They just make it up as they go along, nothing is transparent, it (in my case) is geared to favour the Landlord.
I may have been able to write a better account of my experience so far, but it really is that crazy it has sent me a little bit crazy. Entering your bank account details at 2 separate stages for money that nobody plans to pay you. No timescale communicated, and when I rang it changed etc etc. Deadlines are guidelines, but not for me. Double-standards.
I was told today (via phone) that I'd accepted the Terms and Conditions when I opened my 'account' with them...I had no choice - how else do I get 'my' deposit' back from them?
They are only competent when earning the interest from 'my' deposit. The rest is a farce.
Honestly, they are useless.
My advice?
Invent a Time Machine.
P.S I was given 24 hours to submit my evidence, as the DPS finally 'processed' the evidence the Landlord submitted towards the end of the period (14 days) where we both submit our evidence. Comically I could view this evidence (if I requested it in writing, bearing in mind it historically took them 3 working days to even read an email) before I sent in my evidence - but it would take 5 working days to send me details of the allegations the Landlord has.
Not a lot of good when the deadline is 24 hours away!
See what I mean about it not being impartial. And inept, useless, incompetent etc etc.
With inflation, my original 4 figure deposit will be worth about £11 by the time the DPS process it, assuming they find the Landlord is talking sh*t and can't read the original Inventory, or any of the other correspondence I'd kept/written during the tenancy period (which constituted part of my evidence).
If this helps anyone I'll be pleased.
P.S I'm sure someone will say about the 'olden days' before the Law changed...and Landlords who don't pay the deposit back, or make up things. But in my case I have not just a Landlord who is that, but as an added bonus hides behind an incompetent Government Agency that takes 3 to 4 months to possibly maybe pay me my deposit back.
To be fair to my Landlord, being drunk (as per every visit we endured during the tenancy period) at 09.00 in the morning of the 'check-out' and unable to walk up the garden steps may have prepared me for the hassles ahead.
So, my serious advice is - live abroad.
If you have Googled this and ended up here, let me help by saying you will lose a lot of hair in frustration - they are totally inept. At best.
So, my basic story is this...
6/7/8 years ago (deliberately vague, small world etc) rented a house with my partner. I paid the deposit, from my account, via cheque, to Agent.
Tenancy in joint names.
Tenancy agreement in joint names.
Got some photocopied generic paperwork about the Deposit Protection Service (DPS) along with other ''legal' stuff from Agent.
Fast-forward to some months ago, moved out.
Landlord happy with everything verbally, condition etc upon vacation. No arrears, no problems...
2 weeks later ask (via DPS who actually have the money I paid 6/7/8 years previously) to claim back the deposit...referred to with ref number in Tenancy Agreement.
Had to register etc with DPS - found the website totally confusing...and open an 'Account' to get my money back.
Anyway, requested deposit via the DPS, had to fill in my bank account details for repayment of deposit..then waited days, and waited more days...for The Landlord to get in touch to agree I could have my deposit back.
Rang up to ask how long does DPS allow an AWOL Landlord to respond, or what happens if they don't respond etc...
"We are not authorised to speak to you as the deposit is not in your name" Wow..So had to get my partner to ring and give them permission to speak with me - the person who actually paid the deposit, who is named on the Tenancy Agreement...
Then the Landlord eventually decides (via DPS website) that they want to keep our/my deposit, but didn't provide any details as to why...
At this point (via the useless DPS website) I had a stark choice of either accepting or rejecting not getting my deposit back - the actual language wasn't clear so I rang up to clarify.
So in the absence of any further options, I clicked the button that I reject the Landlord's answer, which was basically the Landlord rejecting me asking for some actual details...I hadn't actually disputed anything, as there wasn't any information or facts to dispute. Forgot to say I had to enter my bank account details again...
And that was that...no further dialog...we were now at the 'Dispute Resolution' stage...and I have to provide evidence as to why I want my deposit back...
I rang up the DPS and asked if there had been a mistake? How can we be in dispute when I have no details of allegations? "That is the procedure" I was told. Also told of the deadline to submit evidence. Reminded of that a lot. Move the caller along...
A totally ridiculous situation to be in!
Bit like going to the Police and saying you'd been assaulted but not saying where or how and then going to court, but the defendant hasn't got a clue what charges he is answering...
Or a hire car being damaged but the Hire firm refusing to say what damage has been inflicted. Then taking the person who hired it to court, and asking them to provide evidence to show they didn't damage the car...totally the opposite of impartial!
So I have to submit evidence and literally guess what the problem is...was it a broken blade of grass? Chimney damaged by Santa one year? Crashed plane in the bathroom? No idea - the Landlord won't say, and the DPS won't ask the Landlord to clarify..."just submit your evidence"...
I could go on...but at every stage I have been let down.
But the best is yet to come...
The deadline that the DPS gives itself (Terms And Conditions - see irony below) to reach a decision (either I get all, some or none of my deposit back) is 4 weeks (which I only found out about today) after the original deadline that both parties have to submit evidence by.
Today I ring up the DPS to see what the situation is - the deadline is now an extra 5 weeks, on top of their 4 weeks, meaning 9 weeks waiting, on top of the 8 weeks already to get to this stage...I questioned the use of the word 'Deadline'.
The DPS isn't fit for purpose. They just make it up as they go along, nothing is transparent, it (in my case) is geared to favour the Landlord.
I may have been able to write a better account of my experience so far, but it really is that crazy it has sent me a little bit crazy. Entering your bank account details at 2 separate stages for money that nobody plans to pay you. No timescale communicated, and when I rang it changed etc etc. Deadlines are guidelines, but not for me. Double-standards.
I was told today (via phone) that I'd accepted the Terms and Conditions when I opened my 'account' with them...I had no choice - how else do I get 'my' deposit' back from them?
They are only competent when earning the interest from 'my' deposit. The rest is a farce.
Honestly, they are useless.
My advice?
Invent a Time Machine.
P.S I was given 24 hours to submit my evidence, as the DPS finally 'processed' the evidence the Landlord submitted towards the end of the period (14 days) where we both submit our evidence. Comically I could view this evidence (if I requested it in writing, bearing in mind it historically took them 3 working days to even read an email) before I sent in my evidence - but it would take 5 working days to send me details of the allegations the Landlord has.
Not a lot of good when the deadline is 24 hours away!
See what I mean about it not being impartial. And inept, useless, incompetent etc etc.
With inflation, my original 4 figure deposit will be worth about £11 by the time the DPS process it, assuming they find the Landlord is talking sh*t and can't read the original Inventory, or any of the other correspondence I'd kept/written during the tenancy period (which constituted part of my evidence).
If this helps anyone I'll be pleased.
P.S I'm sure someone will say about the 'olden days' before the Law changed...and Landlords who don't pay the deposit back, or make up things. But in my case I have not just a Landlord who is that, but as an added bonus hides behind an incompetent Government Agency that takes 3 to 4 months to possibly maybe pay me my deposit back.
To be fair to my Landlord, being drunk (as per every visit we endured during the tenancy period) at 09.00 in the morning of the 'check-out' and unable to walk up the garden steps may have prepared me for the hassles ahead.
So, my serious advice is - live abroad.
BlimeyCharlie said:
Just thought I'd post of my experience with the Government's Deposit Protection Service...
Slow down, take a deep breath, apply to DPS & say you want the money back as there's no reason why not & onus is on LL to show damage not on you to show none.
BlimeyCharlie said:
"We are not authorised to speak to you as the deposit is not in your name" Wow..
Sounds reasonable so far.BlimeyCharlie said:
Then the Landlord eventually decides (via DPS website) that they want to keep our/my deposit, but didn't provide any details as to why...
At this point ......... I had a stark choice of either accepting or rejecting not getting my deposit back
So nothing unusual so far.At this point ......... I had a stark choice of either accepting or rejecting not getting my deposit back
BlimeyCharlie said:
I rang up to clarify.
So in the absence of any further options, I clicked the button that I reject the Landlord's answer
Via telephone? Sounds more like a website.So in the absence of any further options, I clicked the button that I reject the Landlord's answer
BlimeyCharlie said:
So I have to submit evidence and literally guess what the problem is...was it a broken blade of grass? Chimney damaged by Santa one year? Crashed plane in the bathroom? No idea - the Landlord won't say, and the DPS won't ask the Landlord to clarify..."just submit your evidence"...
Evidence = "there was nothing wrong"BlimeyCharlie said:
the DPS finally 'processed' the evidence the Landlord submitted towards the end of the period (14 days) where we both submit our evidence.
So they did it within the timescale required?Slow down, take a deep breath, apply to DPS & say you want the money back as there's no reason why not & onus is on LL to show damage not on you to show none.
Rovinghawk said:
BlimeyCharlie said:
"We are not authorised to speak to you as the deposit is not in your name" Wow..
Sounds reasonable so far."
I paid the deposit, from my account, via cheque, to Agent.
Tenancy in joint names.
Tenancy agreement in joint names.
"
so no, it doesn't really sound reasonable.
Landlord here and this is what I have had with them.
Tenant did a runner and left the house in a bit of a mess (not very bad) owed outstanding rent the total was more than the Bond.
I filled in the DPS section about the owed rent, rubbish left, damage to property. The DPS have no contact details for the tenant and neither do I, so I wait weeks until they say ok its past the time and you can claim the bond for yourself.
BUT you cant just have it, you have to fill out forms, find a Commissioner of Oaths, book an appointment, take time off work, travel to see the commissioner & pay a fee to the commissioner to sign the form.
So I'm the one who gets ripped off and I have to jump through hoops just to get back the deposit I already had in my hand a year ago.
I can see why people dont bother with the DPS even if they are happy to give deposits back.
Tenant did a runner and left the house in a bit of a mess (not very bad) owed outstanding rent the total was more than the Bond.
I filled in the DPS section about the owed rent, rubbish left, damage to property. The DPS have no contact details for the tenant and neither do I, so I wait weeks until they say ok its past the time and you can claim the bond for yourself.
BUT you cant just have it, you have to fill out forms, find a Commissioner of Oaths, book an appointment, take time off work, travel to see the commissioner & pay a fee to the commissioner to sign the form.
So I'm the one who gets ripped off and I have to jump through hoops just to get back the deposit I already had in my hand a year ago.
I can see why people dont bother with the DPS even if they are happy to give deposits back.
I have used the DPS from a landlords side and can equally say they have been rubbish.
Tenant moved out and left numerous broken items, toilet seat, light switches, light fittings, pulled down the garden shed and put a 'shanty town' develpoment in its place, redecorated (seemingly around the furniture thereby leaving patches all over, painted the natural wood front door, et cetera et cetera. She then moved out and basically emptied everything from the house including her pots and pans, tinned food, washing up, clothing and general household items and left x20 plus bin bags in the front yard. On top of that the house had not been properly cleaned the house. There were pubes and mildew around the bathroom.
We put our case and she put hers and they basically gave us some £40 back saying they did not know the state of the house when she moved in. The contract clearly said no decorating without written permission from the landlord. It took weeks after their final deadline and personally I think they rushed the decision through and did not consider the points we made.
Following that I would recommend doing what we have since done which is make a picture book of the whole house and get the tenant to sign every page to say he agrees that the picture that of the place in the state she took it over.
Pip
Tenant moved out and left numerous broken items, toilet seat, light switches, light fittings, pulled down the garden shed and put a 'shanty town' develpoment in its place, redecorated (seemingly around the furniture thereby leaving patches all over, painted the natural wood front door, et cetera et cetera. She then moved out and basically emptied everything from the house including her pots and pans, tinned food, washing up, clothing and general household items and left x20 plus bin bags in the front yard. On top of that the house had not been properly cleaned the house. There were pubes and mildew around the bathroom.
We put our case and she put hers and they basically gave us some £40 back saying they did not know the state of the house when she moved in. The contract clearly said no decorating without written permission from the landlord. It took weeks after their final deadline and personally I think they rushed the decision through and did not consider the points we made.
Following that I would recommend doing what we have since done which is make a picture book of the whole house and get the tenant to sign every page to say he agrees that the picture that of the place in the state she took it over.
Pip
Pip1968 said:
Following that I would recommend doing what we have since done which is make a picture book of the whole house and get the tenant to sign every page to say he agrees that the picture that of the place in the state she took it over.
Pip
That's exactly what I had to do when I rented a few years ago. Agency had a photo of every single room, from multiple angles, and I had to sign and date each one.Pip
Letting Agent here. Quite agree with all comments about the DPS being incompetent. (Goverment-installed system? It's bound to be useless - see CSA / Universal Credit / dozens of others. All have a good idea as their basis but ALL are implemented in such a way as to make them unfit for purpose).
Best advice is to sue the landlord at the address you have for him on the tenancy agreement. It'll cost you the SCC fee (£80 or so) and if he doesn't respond then you will have a judgement in default in your favour. You then take that judgement to the DPS and ask them to act upon it. It'll take time and you will need to stump up the £80 but you will get a fair hearing.
Given you are already down the path of asking the DPS for a judgement then you'll need to back out of this, which I am unsure of how to do. You could try calling them.
Pip - you always always ALWAYS have to get a move-in inventory done and agreed by the tenant. A picture book such as you describe is a good idea but I have heard of issues where they are not done by an independent third party - although I can't vouch for this in any way.
Best advice is to sue the landlord at the address you have for him on the tenancy agreement. It'll cost you the SCC fee (£80 or so) and if he doesn't respond then you will have a judgement in default in your favour. You then take that judgement to the DPS and ask them to act upon it. It'll take time and you will need to stump up the £80 but you will get a fair hearing.
Given you are already down the path of asking the DPS for a judgement then you'll need to back out of this, which I am unsure of how to do. You could try calling them.
Pip - you always always ALWAYS have to get a move-in inventory done and agreed by the tenant. A picture book such as you describe is a good idea but I have heard of issues where they are not done by an independent third party - although I can't vouch for this in any way.
We recently rented a house for 22 months after selling our house & searching for another. The landlords (actually 2 sisters in their 60s/70s) used an agent who presented us with a folder holding approximately 60 photos showing the condition of the property. During our tenancy the sisters visited 4 times without any notice, but we didn't mind and gave them tea & cake. When we left they authorised the return of our deposit before we had moved out and without inspecting the property. We received a full refund into our bank account a week after we filled in the on-line form.
If the property was inspected when you checked out and all was ok, according to the agreement, then there is no scope for any later claim for damage etc. Thats the whole point of s check out, with you present. Anything could have happened after the check out.
Give the agent 14 days and then small claims court.
Give the agent 14 days and then small claims court.
As a landlord my perception is you have to make a claim with proof against the deposit or the tenant gets it back by default. The one time I had to claim the deposit barely made a dent anyway.
My landlord friend tried to claim when her house was left trashed by some knuckle dragger alcoholic tenant and was knocked back because the tenant hadn’t signed the before photos. Useless.
My landlord friend tried to claim when her house was left trashed by some knuckle dragger alcoholic tenant and was knocked back because the tenant hadn’t signed the before photos. Useless.
Used dps as a tenant, LL happy to return in full, but between letting agent and dps actually trying to get hold of it was a pita.
They don't answer their phones, don't reply to the website contact form and the website really didn't explain how it worked.
Can imagine moving being a nightmare for some,having to pay a deposit on the new place and not knowing when you'll get the old one back.
They don't answer their phones, don't reply to the website contact form and the website really didn't explain how it worked.
Can imagine moving being a nightmare for some,having to pay a deposit on the new place and not knowing when you'll get the old one back.
SydneyBridge said:
If the property was inspected when you checked out and all was ok, according to the agreement, then there is no scope for any later claim for damage etc. Thats the whole point of s check out, with you present. Anything could have happened after the check out.
Give the agent 14 days and then small claims court.
^^^^agree, landlord should be accorded 14 days, then small claims court.Give the agent 14 days and then small claims court.
This LL of 30 years, would be very reluctant to use any of the Deposit dispute resolution service, instead preferring to come to some financial decision with the departing tenant, or using the small claims court, and at the last resort taking the "hit".
Wings said:
This LL of 30 years, would be very reluctant to use any of the Deposit dispute resolution service, instead preferring to come to some financial decision with the departing tenant, or using the small claims court, and at the last resort taking the "hit".
There speaks the voice of good sense. NEVER use the dispute resolution service. Always attempt to come to an agreement with the outgoing tenants for an amount to be reclaimed from the deposit as quickly as possible and ask the DPS to pay to the two parties as agreed. Only if that doesn't work then you write a Letter Before Action and then off to the Small Claims Court. Don't, under any circumstance, use the Dispute Resolution Service.
Spumfry said:
Rovinghawk said:
BlimeyCharlie said:
"We are not authorised to speak to you as the deposit is not in your name" Wow..
Sounds reasonable so far."
I paid the deposit, from my account, via cheque, to Agent.
Tenancy in joint names.
Tenancy agreement in joint names.
"
so no, it doesn't really sound reasonable.
The deposit should really be in my name - I paid it!
charltjr said:
Why not just enter “I’m not aware of any damage to the property, the landlord has not provided any information as to why the deposit should be withheld, I want my full deposit back” as your evidence. Then let the system do it’s thing.
Doesn’t seem especially problematic?
Fair point I guess...though I consider not being able to read or grasp what is written as especially problematic...Doesn’t seem especially problematic?
If you read what I originally wrote the DPS insist I go through their system...essentially backing The Landlord regardless, without asking for details from The Landlord.
The Landlord just clicks a button to say they disagree with me having my deposit back...no information required at that stage...no nothing.
Crazy but true. And especially problematic...
The Landlord only managed to sober-up and provide details towards the end of the 14 days period of submitting evidence - meaning (as I originally wrote) I had until the next day to submit my evidence. Guess the problem.
As I also wrote, it took 3 days for anyone at the DPS to read emails, then a further 5 working days to send me details of The Landlord's evidence (or details) of what their problem is...guess the problem...as the DPS can't do anything for 8 working days...The Deadline was the next day - The DPS refused to extend this (a Deadline is a Deadline) but the DPS can extend it's own 4 week Deadline by 5 weeks...meaning a 9 week wait...
Crazy but true. And especially problematic...
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