PCN Single yellow broken line

[TROOPER88]

Hi
On the 10.03.19 (a Sunday) I was visiting Cirencester.
When I returned to my car I had received a PCN (along with half a dozen other cars parked on the same stretch of road) for being parked on a single yellow line.

When I parked I noticed the partial line but looked into it no further due to the condition of it (see pics below).

I challenged the ticket but my appeal has been refused due to Gloucestershire Council stating that the yellow line is visible enough for drivers to see.

Now whether or not the line in question is indeed visible enough for drivers to see, I thought was besides the point. I was under the impression; maybe wrongly so that road markings must:

A) Must be continuous
B) Must have a T bar at the start and finish

I now have 3 options:

1) Pay £35 within 14 days
2) Pay £70 within 28 days
3) Formally challenge the PCN by using a notice to owner form that I will automatically receive if I do not comply with number 1 or 2

If I am indeed wrong, I will pay the £35.

It is more to do with the principle of the matter rather than the charge.

Does anyone know the law regarding this?

I will add the pictures now

Thank you

[TROOPER88]

You can see the corner of my car here:



And the condition of the line directly in front of the red car:



And the pictures from the PCN:



One would think that the Council have a duty of care to maintain the lines.

[KungFuPanda]

I'd formally appeal that. It's more road than line!

[TROOPER88]

KungFuPanda said:

I'd formally appeal that. It's more road than line!

My thoughts, but....

I reside in Surrey, I would assume that if I need to attend a hearing that this would take place in the Gloucestershire area.

I could just pay it, but as I say, it is the principle.

[vonhosen]

On principle I don't personally park (during their hours of operation) where there are yellow lines faded or not.

[TROOPER88]

vonhosen said:

On principle I don't personally park (during their hours of operation) where there are yellow lines faded or not.

Totally understand.

In this case, is there a law that states that the lines have to continuous and with a T bar at either end?

As I understood it:

Road Markings must conform to “SCHEDULE 6 ROAD MARKINGS'. The road markings are a continuous line terminating with T Bars.

[KungFuPanda]

TROOPER88 said:

KungFuPanda said:

I'd formally appeal that. It's more road than line!

My thoughts, but....

I reside in Surrey, I would assume that if I need to attend a hearing that this would take place in the Gloucestershire area.

I could just pay it, but as I say, it is the principle.

If the Council seek to rely on a fellow line to enforce their parking, the line should be legal. That's my viewpoint anyway.

Don't worry about the location of the traffic penalty tribunal hearing. It's all done online and an adjudicator considers your evidence prior to making their decision.

[vonhosen]

Yellow lines are Schedule 7 Part 4.

It's now post year 2016.

[Richard-D]

TROOPER88 said:

When I parked I noticed the partial line but looked into it no further due to the condition of it (see pics below).

This is nuts, you even point out that you noticed the yellow line when you parked. You know that they are there in areas where obstructing the road at busy times would cause it to be more dangerous. But you do it anyway.

[mac96]

Richard-D said:

TROOPER88 said:

When I parked I noticed the partial line but looked into it no further due to the condition of it (see pics below).

This is nuts, you even point out that you noticed the yellow line when you parked. You know that they are there in areas where obstructing the road at busy times would cause it to be more dangerous. But you do it anyway.

Surely single yellows are more about forcing people into paid for parking bays than preventing obstruction, or blue badge holders would not be allowed to park on them?

Still,whatever they are for, I agree, if it were visible, I wouldn't park on it.

[anonymous-user]

Phhht you should park in Manchester then, they paint the lines properly here

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/great...

[TVR1]

TROOPER88 said:

KungFuPanda said:

I'd formally appeal that. It's more road than line!

My thoughts, but....

I reside in Surrey, I would assume that if I need to attend a hearing that this would take place in the Gloucestershire area.

I could just pay it, but as I say, it is the principle.

Which principle? That YOUR lack of observation failed to notice very clear ‘no parking between the hours of 8.00am-6.30pm? Signs

But you now, looking back, notice some fairly clear’ish yellow lines?

WTF do you think yellow lines are for?

[S11Steve]

If it complies with Schedule 7 of TSRGD 2016 then it's not gong to fly as an appeal at the tribunal -https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/traffic-signs-regulations-and-general-directions-2016-an-overview

Damaged or broken lines or missing end markers were a valid appeal in the past, but a provision was made in an update in 2008 ish.

It may be worth checking the other parts of that scuttle to see if everything else complies, but it's not an exciting read. Perhaps pay £35 to save yourself the tedium.

[vonhosen]

S11Steve said:

If it complies with Schedule 7 of TSRGD 2016 then it's not gong to fly as an appeal at the tribunal -https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/traffic-signs-regulations-and-general-directions-2016-an-overview

Damaged or broken lines or missing end markers were a valid appeal in the past, but a provision was made in an update in 2008 ish.

It may be worth checking the other parts of that scuttle to see if everything else complies, but it's not an exciting read. Perhaps pay £35 to save yourself the tedium.

No end 'T' markings is a valid variation in the current regs.

Also

https://www.monckton.com/court-appeal-applies-prin...

[Countdown]

speedyguy said:

Phhht you should park in Manchester then, they paint the lines properly here

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/great...

The depressing thing is that people actually NEED to have SYLs or DYLs to know where it is and isn’t appropriate to park, and they STILL choose to ignore them. There are countless alleyways throughout the Northern Quarter just like the one in the pic where people will quite happily park up and fk anybody who needs to get through. PLAC is becoming endemic.

[TROOPER88]

TVR1 said:

Which principle? That YOUR lack of observation failed to notice very clear ‘no parking between the hours of 8.00am-6.30pm? Signs

But you now, looking back, notice some fairly clear’ish yellow lines?

WTF do you think yellow lines are for?

Thanks to all who have taken the time to reply offering sound advice with regard to my original question, ‘does anyone know the law regarding the need for single yellow lines to be continuous and have a T bar’.

The thread is not a poll as to whether you would park there or whether i should have parked there.

Also if like TVR1, you need clarification with regard why single yellow lines are employed, please carry out reserarch.

If, as in this case, I have breached a parking law, I will pay the charge.

But, before I pay I wanted to enquire as to whether said PCN was issued lawfully and if said local authority employ the useage of yellow lines as one means to control parking, then I believe that these yellow lines should be fit for purpose.

[Riley Blue]

What happens when yellow lines are covered by snow? Aren't PCNs that are issued still valid because of the signs?

[sgtBerbatov]

TROOPER88 said:

TVR1 said:

Which principle? That YOUR lack of observation failed to notice very clear ‘no parking between the hours of 8.00am-6.30pm? Signs

But you now, looking back, notice some fairly clear’ish yellow lines?

WTF do you think yellow lines are for?

Thanks to all who have taken the time to reply offering sound advice with regard to my original question, ‘does anyone know the law regarding the need for single yellow lines to be continuous and have a T bar’.

The thread is not a poll as to whether you would park there or whether i should have parked there.

Also if like TVR1, you need clarification with regard why single yellow lines are employed, please carry out reserarch.

If, as in this case, I have breached a parking law, I will pay the charge.

But, before I pay I wanted to enquire as to whether said PCN was issued lawfully and if said local authority employ the useage of yellow lines as one means to control parking, then I believe that these yellow lines should be fit for purpose.

Was there a sign near where you parked the car? I can't tell that from the pics of your car.

It might be worth requesting photos of your car being there from the council. Because in any appeal, whether you follow through with it or not, will use the photos from the council in their decision. Plus, if you do this, you extend your grace period with them so, after you get the photos and decide not to proceed, you'll still pay the smaller fine.

Personally, I'd contest it as the law might say the line doesn't have to be unbroken it must at least resemble some sort of line. And from your photos, like another commenter said, it's more tarmac than line. But the sign might be pivitol on this I'd say.

ETA: Sorry, I thought you were driving the red car.

Where was that sign in relation to your Porsche?

[vonhosen]

sgtBerbatov said:

TROOPER88 said:

TVR1 said:

Which principle? That YOUR lack of observation failed to notice very clear ‘no parking between the hours of 8.00am-6.30pm? Signs

But you now, looking back, notice some fairly clear’ish yellow lines?

WTF do you think yellow lines are for?

Thanks to all who have taken the time to reply offering sound advice with regard to my original question, ‘does anyone know the law regarding the need for single yellow lines to be continuous and have a T bar’.

The thread is not a poll as to whether you would park there or whether i should have parked there.

Also if like TVR1, you need clarification with regard why single yellow lines are employed, please carry out reserarch.

If, as in this case, I have breached a parking law, I will pay the charge.

But, before I pay I wanted to enquire as to whether said PCN was issued lawfully and if said local authority employ the useage of yellow lines as one means to control parking, then I believe that these yellow lines should be fit for purpose.

Was there a sign near where you parked the car? I can't tell that from the pics of your car.

It might be worth requesting photos of your car being there from the council. Because in any appeal, whether you follow through with it or not, will use the photos from the council in their decision. Plus, if you do this, you extend your grace period with them so, after you get the photos and decide not to proceed, you'll still pay the smaller fine.

Personally, I'd contest it as the law might say the line doesn't have to be unbroken it must at least resemble some sort of line. And from your photos, like another commenter said, it's more tarmac than line. But the sign might be pivitol on this I'd say.

ETA: Sorry, I thought you were driving the red car.

Where was that sign in relation to your Porsche?

There doesn't need to be a sign near where you actually park if you are in a CPZ.

[TooLateForAName]

If you'd been in the red car you might have a case, but those pics look to show that the lines were perfectly obvious where you parked.