'Discount' if paid within two weeks...
Discussion
Can anyone explain the reasoning behind the 'prompt payment' discount period for FPN type things being 14 days?
I picked up a parking ticket (my own fault, I was driving with the roof down, moved my parking permit off the dash so it didn't blow away, then forgot to put it back when I got home. I don't stick it to the windscreen because it's shared between a couple of cars) on the seventh of the month.
OK, it's annoying, but I'll pay. HOWEVER I am paid on the last working day of the month, and my income is sufficiently low that I have to budget for EVERYTHING in advance or I risk not being able to pay the bills. This means that I have to pay the full £80. For parking outside my own home. Because I am too poor to be able to pay £40 that I wasn't expecting to have to pay.
Now surely I am not an unusual case in that I am paid monthly and live a hand-to-mouth existence, in fact I am fairly sure that my situation is fairly typical of the average worker in today's economic climate.
So bearing in mind that almost everyone is paid MONTHLY how is it at all fair to set the discount at 14 days rather than four working weeks? It strikes me as wrong that even in matters of 'justice', members of the public are PENALISED for not having liquid funds at their disposal.
Much as poor people have to pay more for toilet paper because they can't necessarily afford to buy upfront in bulk, is it now considered failr that the less well-off should pay higher fines for petty misdemeanours, simply because their financial status means they can't settle an unexpected bill before next payday?
Frankly, it boils my piss. One whole month's discount, or none at all please.
[/rant]
I picked up a parking ticket (my own fault, I was driving with the roof down, moved my parking permit off the dash so it didn't blow away, then forgot to put it back when I got home. I don't stick it to the windscreen because it's shared between a couple of cars) on the seventh of the month.
OK, it's annoying, but I'll pay. HOWEVER I am paid on the last working day of the month, and my income is sufficiently low that I have to budget for EVERYTHING in advance or I risk not being able to pay the bills. This means that I have to pay the full £80. For parking outside my own home. Because I am too poor to be able to pay £40 that I wasn't expecting to have to pay.
Now surely I am not an unusual case in that I am paid monthly and live a hand-to-mouth existence, in fact I am fairly sure that my situation is fairly typical of the average worker in today's economic climate.
So bearing in mind that almost everyone is paid MONTHLY how is it at all fair to set the discount at 14 days rather than four working weeks? It strikes me as wrong that even in matters of 'justice', members of the public are PENALISED for not having liquid funds at their disposal.
Much as poor people have to pay more for toilet paper because they can't necessarily afford to buy upfront in bulk, is it now considered failr that the less well-off should pay higher fines for petty misdemeanours, simply because their financial status means they can't settle an unexpected bill before next payday?
Frankly, it boils my piss. One whole month's discount, or none at all please.
[/rant]
I'm sorry to sound harsh but if funds are that tight you have to question whether running a car at all is appropriate. What happens if its a puncture needing a new tyre and not a parking ticket?
Just for next time the best course of action is to launch a "soft" appeal after about 10 days, they'll then reject (buying a week of time) but also extend the discounted period allowing you to settle at the lower rate.
Just for next time the best course of action is to launch a "soft" appeal after about 10 days, they'll then reject (buying a week of time) but also extend the discounted period allowing you to settle at the lower rate.
vsonix said:
Now surely I am not an unusual case in that I am paid monthly and live a hand-to-mouth existence, in fact I am fairly sure that my situation is fairly typical of the average worker in today's economic climate.
So bearing in mind that almost everyone is paid MONTHLY how is it at all fair to set the discount at 14 days rather than four working weeks? It strikes me as wrong that even in matters of 'justice', members of the public are PENALISED for not having liquid funds at their disposal.
Much as poor people have to pay more for toilet paper because they can't necessarily afford to buy upfront in bulk, is it now considered failr that the less well-off should pay higher fines for petty misdemeanours, simply because their financial status means they can't settle an unexpected bill before next payday?
Frankly, it boils my piss. One whole month's discount, or none at all please.
[/rant]
You are penalised because you are poor and rich people get all the breaks - is that the gist?So bearing in mind that almost everyone is paid MONTHLY how is it at all fair to set the discount at 14 days rather than four working weeks? It strikes me as wrong that even in matters of 'justice', members of the public are PENALISED for not having liquid funds at their disposal.
Much as poor people have to pay more for toilet paper because they can't necessarily afford to buy upfront in bulk, is it now considered failr that the less well-off should pay higher fines for petty misdemeanours, simply because their financial status means they can't settle an unexpected bill before next payday?
Frankly, it boils my piss. One whole month's discount, or none at all please.
[/rant]
That you are down trodden and kept under "The Man" cos you are poor?
toilet paper is cheaper if you buy in the hundreds?
We all have to live within our means unless you are an MP clearly.
Perhaps write to your MP about the injustice that you see and find out if you would get his support to change the 14day to 4 weeks? you never know it may work? I can see your point and if you really are hand to mouth any unexpected bill is going to be difficult to deal with. Earn more/spend less that's the only answer I can think of apart from writing to the MP. Edited by superlightr on Tuesday 21st May 14:43
kiethton said:
I'm sorry to sound harsh but if funds are that tight you have to question whether running a car at all is appropriate. What happens if its a puncture needing a new tyre and not a parking ticket?
Just for next time the best course of action is to launch a "soft" appeal after about 10 days, they'll then reject (buying a week of time) but also extend the discounted period allowing you to settle at the lower rate.
I have a friend who owns a tyre shop Just for next time the best course of action is to launch a "soft" appeal after about 10 days, they'll then reject (buying a week of time) but also extend the discounted period allowing you to settle at the lower rate.
And yes that's a good tip, thanks. In the end I just stuck a backdated cheque in the post.
It's the only thing cheques are still good for tbh
It's not a question of if I can afford to pay the bill so much, my question is a more general one - what thought process is it that makes the authorities think that the average person can break a four week budgeting cycle to pay for non-serious 'crimes' when 90% of the population operate off a four-weekly cycle not a fortnightly one. In fact, pretty much the only people on fortnightly cycles are in the benefits system - is it something to do with that, perhaps? i.e. if you're paid fortnightly you must be *really* poor and therefore deserve a break but if you're on monthly PAYE, you can afford full whack?
superlightr said:
toilet paper is cheaper if you buy in the hundreds?
Yes it is significantly so. £8(ish) for two dozen rolls, £4 for half a dozen. As a rough example. As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
Edited by vsonix on Tuesday 21st May 14:59
I’m not trying to aim this at you OP but there’s a difference between being poor and being financially inept.
So long as you clear the balance before the statement date of a credit card you get charged no interest. You can pretty much alsways have a credit credit card with a long interest free period that would allow you to spread a surprise bill over a few pay checks assuming you have been sensible and not maxed every credit line available, which if that’s the case until you reduce outgoings to match income you’ll forever be in the circle.
There’s only one person responsible for your finances and that’s you...
So long as you clear the balance before the statement date of a credit card you get charged no interest. You can pretty much alsways have a credit credit card with a long interest free period that would allow you to spread a surprise bill over a few pay checks assuming you have been sensible and not maxed every credit line available, which if that’s the case until you reduce outgoings to match income you’ll forever be in the circle.
There’s only one person responsible for your finances and that’s you...
Black_S3 said:
I’m not trying to aim this at you OP but there’s a difference between being poor and being financially inept.
I will. Find me a single instance where running a convertible is compatible with buying the cheapest practical car because you're living hand to mouth.You're not poor, IMO that makes you borderline idiot.
In answer to your question, sending you one letter costs an amount of administration. Make that easy for them and you get a discount. Make them send you more letters, try harder and incur more administration and those costs increase.
It's not the man trying to stiff you because you don't have money, it's people trying to not run businesses and departments at a loss to help people who think they're poor because they can't afford to buy bulk toilet roll to put in their convertible BMW.
It's not the man trying to stiff you because you don't have money, it's people trying to not run businesses and departments at a loss to help people who think they're poor because they can't afford to buy bulk toilet roll to put in their convertible BMW.
vsonix said:
Yes it is significantly so. £8(ish) for two dozen rolls, £4 for half a dozen. As a rough example.
As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
You need to stop feeling so sorry for yourself. If you really do have 4 cars as per your garage you’re not poor, you’re living outside of your means.As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
Edited by vsonix on Tuesday 21st May 14:59
vsonix said:
Yes it is significantly so. £8(ish) for two dozen rolls, £4 for half a dozen. As a rough example.
As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
Credit worthiness. Although not sure why the authorities can charge you double for 2 weeks' credit.As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
Black_S3 said:
Wow. I hadn’t looked at the garage... and you’re concerned about bulk buying toilet rolls op? Surely trolling!
Again, I'm not talking about myself. This is something that happened to me and annoyed me, as I said in my OP "I'll pay the fine"
I am now posting a general question about why the powers that be think that a fortnight's discount is fair when people live month to month.
Yes I do own a few vehicles, and yes it does take some effort for me to do that, I keep them all legal, taxed, insured blah blah blah and so what, I don't care, it's my passion and I have to make sacrifices to do it. Same as if I had saved all my money to go travelling or whatever. Still doesn't stop me wondering why certain things are done the way they're done.
Edited by vsonix on Tuesday 21st May 16:24
SAS Tom said:
vsonix said:
Yes it is significantly so. £8(ish) for two dozen rolls, £4 for half a dozen. As a rough example.
As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
You need to stop feeling so sorry for yourself. If you really do have 4 cars as per your garage you’re not poor, you’re living outside of your means.As for life being generally more expensive the lower the income you're on, it's nothing to do with 'The Man'; it's simple economics.
With a bad credit rating, you have to pay for energy through a coin meter, or use a Pay As You Go mobile tariffs rather than the cheaper monthly direct debits. The payment methods available for people on lower incomes tend to mean paying a higher rate for the same services - in effect, a 'poverty premium'.
It's a cycle that perpetuates itself - if your parents are wealthy, you're already at an advantage, you may get support through education, help to buy a home, or being able to afford to work for nothing now in order to earn more later.
At the bottom end of the scale, people get trapped into a spiral of debt, or they're working so hard to stay above water that they can't make plans for the future. Even if you can buy things outright, you're more likely to "buy cheap, buy twice".
If all your time and energy goes on barely pay rent, it's very hard to afford the adult education to better yourself. I'm not saying impossible but very very difficult. Especially if you don't have youth on your side. Plenty of schemes out there to help the young, but by the time you're in your 30s, you're on your own.
Edited by vsonix on Tuesday 21st May 14:59
Also, I was richer last time I updated my garage. I've since had a relationship breakdown, ill health and a number of other issues that mean I am worse off at the moment including people who were supporting my business going under themselves. And guess what, I've not updated my garage since way before all that crap happened. In fact I'm not even sure what cars are 'in' there at the moment. In fact until earlier this week I didn't even sign into PH for a month or two.
Perhaps you could try and be a little less judgemental.
Edited by vsonix on Tuesday 21st May 16:36
OP
Just a question re the parking invoice
When you mentioned that you were outside your house, was this on the road, and therefore a council ticket, or in car park for a block of flats where each flat ha an allocated parking space?
If the later then your lease, will, in 99% of cases, trumps any request for payment by a third party. and I would suggest that you get onto
pepipoo.com and get their view of the situation
Just a question re the parking invoice
When you mentioned that you were outside your house, was this on the road, and therefore a council ticket, or in car park for a block of flats where each flat ha an allocated parking space?
If the later then your lease, will, in 99% of cases, trumps any request for payment by a third party. and I would suggest that you get onto
pepipoo.com and get their view of the situation
vsonix said:
Again, I'm not talking about myself.
This is something that happened to me and annoyed me, as I said in my OP "I'll pay the fine"
I am now posting a general question about why the powers that be think that a fortnight's discount is fair when people live month to month.
Yes I do own a few vehicles, and yes it does take some effort for me to do that, I keep them all legal, taxed, insured blah blah blah and so what, I don't care, it's my passion and I have to make sacrifices to do it. Same as if I had saved all my money to go travelling or whatever. Still doesn't stop me wondering why certain things are done the way they're done.
I guess because even living pay check to pay check you’re half way through the longest pay check if you get hit at the absolute worst possible time & if you genuinely can’t afford it two weeks into the month the likelyhood is you’ll be one of the people that costs them money to chase.This is something that happened to me and annoyed me, as I said in my OP "I'll pay the fine"
I am now posting a general question about why the powers that be think that a fortnight's discount is fair when people live month to month.
Yes I do own a few vehicles, and yes it does take some effort for me to do that, I keep them all legal, taxed, insured blah blah blah and so what, I don't care, it's my passion and I have to make sacrifices to do it. Same as if I had saved all my money to go travelling or whatever. Still doesn't stop me wondering why certain things are done the way they're done.
Edited by vsonix on Tuesday 21st May 16:24
silverfoxcc said:
OP
Just a question re the parking invoice
When you mentioned that you were outside your house, was this on the road, and therefore a council ticket, or in car park for a block of flats where each flat ha an allocated parking space?
If the later then your lease, will, in 99% of cases, trumps any request for payment by a third party. and I would suggest that you get onto
pepipoo.com and get their view of the situation
Council ticket, unfortunately. Just a question re the parking invoice
When you mentioned that you were outside your house, was this on the road, and therefore a council ticket, or in car park for a block of flats where each flat ha an allocated parking space?
If the later then your lease, will, in 99% of cases, trumps any request for payment by a third party. and I would suggest that you get onto
pepipoo.com and get their view of the situation
Honestly I'm not even massively annoyed at the ticket, it was totally my fault on this occasion.
It did, however, catch me out at a time when I was unprepared for it, and made me wonder how other people whose situations are more precarious than mine manage to avoid serious disruption to their lifestyles. Obviously the whole point of a fine is to inconvenience people so does it seem fair that the people who can afford it more easily suffer less inconvenience... OR are we as a society OK with the fact that the people who are least well off have to pay greater penalties for exactly the same misdemeanour?
vsonix said:
HOWEVER I am paid on the last working day of the month, and my income is sufficiently low that I have to budget for EVERYTHING in advance or I risk not being able to pay the bills. This means that I have to pay the full £80. For parking outside my own home. Because I am too poor to be able to pay £40 that I wasn't expecting to have to pay.
Now surely I am not an unusual case in that I am paid monthly and live a hand-to-mouth existence, in fact I am fairly sure that my situation is fairly typical of the average worker in today's economic climate.
[/rant]
Now surely I am not an unusual case in that I am paid monthly and live a hand-to-mouth existence, in fact I am fairly sure that my situation is fairly typical of the average worker in today's economic climate.
[/rant]
vsonix said:
Again, I'm not talking about myself.
This is something that happened to me and annoyed me, as I said in my OP "I'll pay the fine"
Yes I do own a few vehicles, and yes it does take some effort for me to do that, I keep them all legal, taxed, insured blah blah blah and so what, I don't care, it's my passion and I have to make sacrifices to do it.
So which is it????This is something that happened to me and annoyed me, as I said in my OP "I'll pay the fine"
Yes I do own a few vehicles, and yes it does take some effort for me to do that, I keep them all legal, taxed, insured blah blah blah and so what, I don't care, it's my passion and I have to make sacrifices to do it.
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