Mobile Phone Scam but who by?
Discussion
I have been with my mobile provider (without breaking naming rules - two letters that was once a colour!!) so a significant number of years - with grouped together mobile phones -currently me, the wife, son 2 and daughter.
Last month I noticed the accumulated bill to be over double the normal - so investigated the itemised to see a number of "premium texts", both incoming and outgoing on the wifes phone bill.
Now I did quiz her, and she categorically states she did not make these. We are talking at a fair number throughout June that equates to about an extra £150 on a monthly bill.
I phoned EE - who said without even considering any alternative - that these came from my wifes phone. In fact they were extremely patronising when I mentioned calls and they corrected me to state they were texts. Anyway - i discussed with the wife again - she is certain and adamant they were not generated by her.
So I raised a complaint through the two vowel named company.
They emailed me back after a few days to say these charges were correct and the complaint would go no further. I then tried to call to argue, but had to leave a message.
The complaints team just got back to me. The guy stated they had investigated and the texts and charges came from my wifes phone. Now being a technical minded chap, I asked how they investigated - thinking I was going to get the details about the wife not being totally honest.
He stated the proof was because the charges were on the bill, so therefore they must have been made by her! No SIM checks (if that is a thing - i guess it is), just it is on the bill!!
We have been through the "did our daughter do it on the wifes phone" and we are certain she never did. The charges are daily for most days through June so i doubt she will have the stamina and access to do so.
The guy on the phone just now simply wanted me to close the complaint which I refused to do. he did say i need to contact the recipient of the texts (which I think is a HeartFM competition - information provided by my first call with the phone company).
So, cutting the long drivel story short - how do I now proceed, and what is the likely outcome? I have read about ombudsmen and other on line processes (resolve is one I think) but no idea whether these will work. I pay by direct debit - is that anything i can fall back on - the DD guarantee?
Also, I am in contract with my handset - with the new regs can i simply swap from one to another company, or do the new rules only apply to Sim Only deals?
Thanks in advance - thought are appreciated. And yes, I do believe the wife - she most definitely is telling the truth - before we go there!!!!!
Last month I noticed the accumulated bill to be over double the normal - so investigated the itemised to see a number of "premium texts", both incoming and outgoing on the wifes phone bill.
Now I did quiz her, and she categorically states she did not make these. We are talking at a fair number throughout June that equates to about an extra £150 on a monthly bill.
I phoned EE - who said without even considering any alternative - that these came from my wifes phone. In fact they were extremely patronising when I mentioned calls and they corrected me to state they were texts. Anyway - i discussed with the wife again - she is certain and adamant they were not generated by her.
So I raised a complaint through the two vowel named company.
They emailed me back after a few days to say these charges were correct and the complaint would go no further. I then tried to call to argue, but had to leave a message.
The complaints team just got back to me. The guy stated they had investigated and the texts and charges came from my wifes phone. Now being a technical minded chap, I asked how they investigated - thinking I was going to get the details about the wife not being totally honest.
He stated the proof was because the charges were on the bill, so therefore they must have been made by her! No SIM checks (if that is a thing - i guess it is), just it is on the bill!!
We have been through the "did our daughter do it on the wifes phone" and we are certain she never did. The charges are daily for most days through June so i doubt she will have the stamina and access to do so.
The guy on the phone just now simply wanted me to close the complaint which I refused to do. he did say i need to contact the recipient of the texts (which I think is a HeartFM competition - information provided by my first call with the phone company).
So, cutting the long drivel story short - how do I now proceed, and what is the likely outcome? I have read about ombudsmen and other on line processes (resolve is one I think) but no idea whether these will work. I pay by direct debit - is that anything i can fall back on - the DD guarantee?
Also, I am in contract with my handset - with the new regs can i simply swap from one to another company, or do the new rules only apply to Sim Only deals?
Thanks in advance - thought are appreciated. And yes, I do believe the wife - she most definitely is telling the truth - before we go there!!!!!
I'd say that it's very very rare for a SIM to be cloned and if a company had found a way to get someone else to send and receive premium texts without their knowledge, every scammer would be doing it and it would be talked about all over the place!
If you know it's a competition number, I would say look very close to home for the answer. I know you say you have, but seriously, I can't imagine a legitimate number like HeartFM would be some sort of scam - might be worth checking with them for their T&Cs though.
If you know it's a competition number, I would say look very close to home for the answer. I know you say you have, but seriously, I can't imagine a legitimate number like HeartFM would be some sort of scam - might be worth checking with them for their T&Cs though.
MDMA . said:
Sounds like your wife has been entering Heart FM competitions. Have you actually looked at the phone and checked the outgoing/incoming message log?
Yes. The other numbers that she calls etc but not these.Of course she may well be deleting the premium texts but she says not, and she has no reason to lie!!!
mattyn1 said:
MDMA . said:
Sounds like your wife has been entering Heart FM competitions. Have you actually looked at the phone and checked the outgoing/incoming message log?
Yes. The other numbers that she calls etc but not these.Of course she may well be deleting the premium texts but she says not, and she has no reason to lie!!!
I’m coming down on it being unlikely that someone with the expertise to clone a phone is using this knowledge to enter a heart fm competition.
Is it this?
https://www.heart.co.uk/terms-conditions/jamie-ama...
This doesn’t look like the sort of thing a child would enter. If it is this then it’s also not as straight forward as just texting.
What does your wife do? Does she have access to the radio all day? If you’re going down this route, I would ask do you have joint finances? Do you know why she would be obsessively entering to win £2m?
I hope it’s a mistake with heart as this could be a shocker.
Edited by Flumpo on Tuesday 23 July 18:39
Lol she spends most of the day drinking gin probably! I know, I know it’s likely she has done this but she is very very definite she never did!
So, going back to my original post, how does one challenge the phone company? Their technical investigation amounts to a statement that is “it’s on the bill therefore it must be true” is just w
k. I was expecting some Line of Duty digital forensic that proved my wife was up to ok good!!
So, going back to my original post, how does one challenge the phone company? Their technical investigation amounts to a statement that is “it’s on the bill therefore it must be true” is just w
k. I was expecting some Line of Duty digital forensic that proved my wife was up to ok good!! mattyn1 said:
Lol she spends most of the day drinking gin probably! I know, I know it’s likely she has done this but she is very very definite she never did!
So, going back to my original post, how does one challenge the phone company? Their technical investigation amounts to a statement that is “it’s on the bill therefore it must be true” is just wk. I was expecting some Line of Duty digital forensic that proved my wife was up to ok good!!
So the fact it’s probably her is irrelevant, you just want to know how to overturn the companies decision.So, going back to my original post, how does one challenge the phone company? Their technical investigation amounts to a statement that is “it’s on the bill therefore it must be true” is just w
k. I was expecting some Line of Duty digital forensic that proved my wife was up to ok good!! That’s fine and makes things easier. Just make a fake death certificate and send to them via email. It can’t be her if she’s dead.
who is the premium rate number. You complain to psa, Phone-paid Services Authority,
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers/service-c...
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers/service-c...
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers
Thesprucegoose said:
who is the premium rate number. You complain to psa, Phone-paid Services Authority,
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers/service-c...
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers
Thank you..... on the off chance this is a rogue and she is telling the truth!!https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers/service-c...
https://psauthority.org.uk/for-consumers
I've worked in technical security roles for a number of mobile companies.
The likelihood of a cloned SIM is very small, it isn't common or easy to do. The kind of people with the capability to do that aren't interested in doing it to enter Heart FM competitions.
There is a tiny chance it could be a billing error, but again probably unlikely if it is a series of regular billing items.
The most likely explanation is that your wife did enter the competition.
Does this mobile company have an online portal where you can view all your previous bills and billing data?
The likelihood of a cloned SIM is very small, it isn't common or easy to do. The kind of people with the capability to do that aren't interested in doing it to enter Heart FM competitions.
There is a tiny chance it could be a billing error, but again probably unlikely if it is a series of regular billing items.
The most likely explanation is that your wife did enter the competition.
Does this mobile company have an online portal where you can view all your previous bills and billing data?
spookly said:
I've worked in technical security roles for a number of mobile companies.
The likelihood of a cloned SIM is very small, it isn't common or easy to do. The kind of people with the capability to do that aren't interested in doing it to enter Heart FM competitions.
There is a tiny chance it could be a billing error, but again probably unlikely if it is a series of regular billing items.
The most likely explanation is that your wife did enter the competition.
Does this mobile company have an online portal where you can view all your previous bills and billing data?
Yes of course it does..... hence how I got those quantities. The likelihood of a cloned SIM is very small, it isn't common or easy to do. The kind of people with the capability to do that aren't interested in doing it to enter Heart FM competitions.
There is a tiny chance it could be a billing error, but again probably unlikely if it is a series of regular billing items.
The most likely explanation is that your wife did enter the competition.
Does this mobile company have an online portal where you can view all your previous bills and billing data?
So..... she has an iPhone..... is there a secret back up text list that will not be deleted when she swipes it away?
mattyn1 said:
I know!!!! I have a guilt ploy ongoing now..... telling her we will take them to court etc..... highlighting the under oath bit etc!!
easier just pay up, block premium rate numbers and move on. My old GF used to do those psychic numbers, horoscopes she was embarrassed never admitted, people people addicted to them.Flumpo said:
mattyn1 said:
MDMA . said:
Sounds like your wife has been entering Heart FM competitions. Have you actually looked at the phone and checked the outgoing/incoming message log?
Yes. The other numbers that she calls etc but not these.Of course she may well be deleting the premium texts but she says not, and she has no reason to lie!!!
I’m coming down on it being unlikely that someone with the expertise to clone a phone is using this knowledge to enter a heart fm competition.
Is it this?
https://www.heart.co.uk/terms-conditions/jamie-ama...
This doesn’t look like the sort of thing a child would enter. If it is this then it’s also not as straight forward as just texting.
What does your wife do? Does she have access to the radio all day? If you’re going down this route, I would ask do you have joint finances? Do you know why she would be obsessively entering to win £2m?
I hope it’s a mistake with heart as this could be a shocker.
Edited by Flumpo on Tuesday 23 July 18:39
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