Discussion
So after seeing a few of these threads, been bitten by a dodgy ebay return..
Sold an old 80's Tamiya RC car on ebay, guy paid by echeque so had to wait nearly 2 weeks for payment to clear before I could post. Listing had a decent description and a stack of photos, and bear in mind the car is nearly 40 years old. However he's now saying its not as described and requested a return.
Ebay have basically said I have no choice but to refund. if I don't they will refund and then the will have the money and the car. Is there anything I can do to avoid this or just capitulate and accept the return.. They have said I can wait until its returned and then if he has done anything to it (which is possible) lodge a counter claim.
Any advice appreciated, and wish I had paid attention to other threads that said not to use ebay anymore!
Cheers
Sold an old 80's Tamiya RC car on ebay, guy paid by echeque so had to wait nearly 2 weeks for payment to clear before I could post. Listing had a decent description and a stack of photos, and bear in mind the car is nearly 40 years old. However he's now saying its not as described and requested a return.
Ebay have basically said I have no choice but to refund. if I don't they will refund and then the will have the money and the car. Is there anything I can do to avoid this or just capitulate and accept the return.. They have said I can wait until its returned and then if he has done anything to it (which is possible) lodge a counter claim.
Any advice appreciated, and wish I had paid attention to other threads that said not to use ebay anymore!
Cheers
How is he saying it's not as described?
If you have photos to prove otherwise you could argue with eBay over it.
What I've done in the past, is say "ok, I'm sorry to hear this, I'm happy to give you a full refund, can you organise a collection, and once I have received it, and checked it against the SN of what was sent to you, I'll refund you, plus your postage.
If you have photos to prove otherwise you could argue with eBay over it.
What I've done in the past, is say "ok, I'm sorry to hear this, I'm happy to give you a full refund, can you organise a collection, and once I have received it, and checked it against the SN of what was sent to you, I'll refund you, plus your postage.
Have done that 3 times and won't say. I've stated there were loads of photos, but he has said photos lie..
Called ebay and they were literally no help. Said best advice was to process refund and issue him a label to return at my cost. If I do nothing they will issue the refund anyway, so he'd have the car and the cash.
Called ebay and they were literally no help. Said best advice was to process refund and issue him a label to return at my cost. If I do nothing they will issue the refund anyway, so he'd have the car and the cash.
You don't need to refund until they return it. Make sure you tell them that you have noted the contents/serial numbers on things in case they have stolen bits and plan to return the parts they don't need (even if you haven't, say you have).
You will have to provide a label unfortunately. They will need to prove it has been delivered back to you, so if they send it themselves non-tracked they are onto a loser. You can also refund them if you have to via e-cheque - a small comfort as it will take ages to clear.
You will have to provide a label unfortunately. They will need to prove it has been delivered back to you, so if they send it themselves non-tracked they are onto a loser. You can also refund them if you have to via e-cheque - a small comfort as it will take ages to clear.
Unfortunately I think eBay sides with the buyer a lot more than the seller. As you've said i would expect ebay whilst doing their investigation to ask the buyer how the item differs from the description, but I doubt they will. I think on this occasion you'd be best to accept the return even though annoyingly it's at your cost...at least the buyer is going to have to re-box it all and have to take himself to a post office to return it.
Ok thanks, the guy obviously knows what he doing and how to exploit ebay rules, not much i can do really. Just hope the car come back in a decent shape and one piece as that seems to be another trick.
What we need is a website where sellers can list problem buyers as ebay feedback means nothing nowadays for sellers.. almost postive he will have done this before given the way he is responding.
What we need is a website where sellers can list problem buyers as ebay feedback means nothing nowadays for sellers.. almost postive he will have done this before given the way he is responding.
what model was it? Is it one with rare hard to find and easily breakable fragile parts, such as an original Wild Willy?
Its possible he has one, got yours, nicked some parts off it and will send yours back with s
tty broken bits.
I've bought and sold lots of 80s Tamiya stuff and never had an issue, but I do always sell them at fair prices and if they seem at all dodgy when communicating prior to shipping, I just cancel the sale. All mine are my models and if I decide to sell, it is not easy to part with, so to lose it is just not worth the risk for a bit of cash. But as I say, so far, all my sales have been ok.
Generally Tamiya collectors are some of the best ebayers / people IME!
Its possible he has one, got yours, nicked some parts off it and will send yours back with s
tty broken bits. I've bought and sold lots of 80s Tamiya stuff and never had an issue, but I do always sell them at fair prices and if they seem at all dodgy when communicating prior to shipping, I just cancel the sale. All mine are my models and if I decide to sell, it is not easy to part with, so to lose it is just not worth the risk for a bit of cash. But as I say, so far, all my sales have been ok.
Generally Tamiya collectors are some of the best ebayers / people IME!
Camelot1971 said:
You don't need to refund until they return it. Make sure you tell them that you have noted the contents/serial numbers on things in case they have stolen bits and plan to return the parts they don't need (even if you haven't, say you have).
You will have to provide a label unfortunately. They will need to prove it has been delivered back to you, so if they send it themselves non-tracked they are onto a loser. You can also refund them if you have to via e-cheque - a small comfort as it will take ages to clear.
I think you will find it does not have to be returned before a refund can be claimed.You will have to provide a label unfortunately. They will need to prove it has been delivered back to you, so if they send it themselves non-tracked they are onto a loser. You can also refund them if you have to via e-cheque - a small comfort as it will take ages to clear.
Hi, yes it's an original swb wild willy. I dont have a huge connection to it, was going to sell on to swap for a 959. Should have spotted the warning signs of in his messages but thought I should complete the sale. Annoying thing is he paid by echeque so I've been waiting for payment for ages and lost the 959 I wanted..
Assume he is a tamiya guy as had a clodbuster for sale..
Assume he is a tamiya guy as had a clodbuster for sale..
kestral said:
Camelot1971 said:
You don't need to refund until they return it. Make sure you tell them that you have noted the contents/serial numbers on things in case they have stolen bits and plan to return the parts they don't need (even if you haven't, say you have).
You will have to provide a label unfortunately. They will need to prove it has been delivered back to you, so if they send it themselves non-tracked they are onto a loser. You can also refund them if you have to via e-cheque - a small comfort as it will take ages to clear.
I think you will find it does not have to be returned before a refund can be claimed.You will have to provide a label unfortunately. They will need to prove it has been delivered back to you, so if they send it themselves non-tracked they are onto a loser. You can also refund them if you have to via e-cheque - a small comfort as it will take ages to clear.
I've had this exact same scenario with 80's RC parts and cars. I had one idiot lodge a claim where the he expected a working car when my advert was listed as a box of various parts, no mention of a car - there wasn't even a chassis included.
I no longer sell them on Ebay.
Best thing is to get it returned, check for any missing bits or damage, then refund.
I no longer sell them on Ebay.
Best thing is to get it returned, check for any missing bits or damage, then refund.
Haves1979 said:
Hi, yes it's an original swb wild willy. I dont have a huge connection to it, was going to sell on to swap for a 959. Should have spotted the warning signs of in his messages but thought I should complete the sale. Annoying thing is he paid by echeque so I've been waiting for payment for ages and lost the 959 I wanted..
Assume he is a tamiya guy as had a clodbuster for sale..
it will probably come back as a LWB with broken steering uprights / top mounts! Assume he is a tamiya guy as had a clodbuster for sale..
Is the echeque payment definitely clean now. There's no way you will refund him then somehow you lose the payment too?
Edited by poo at Paul's on Wednesday 6th November 17:39
It's a shame the way eBay has gone.... I still sell a fair bit but anything over £50 is cash on collection only and I only list on £1 FFV deals. Yes it takes longer to sell stuff but it does eventually sell you see the buyer face to face so they are happy with the item and most importantly you have the cash in hand so there is nothing eBay or Paypal can do …..
So many absolute nutters messing people around with impunity these days it’s quite incredible.
They know that ebay will always side with the buyer, so they simply can’t lose.
A friend of mine who doesn’t use ebay much asked me to list a double stack bass guitar speaker cabinet and amp unit for him a couple of months ago.
I’m always quite thorough with my adverts, plenty of photos, lengthy description etc.
The cabinets and amp sold for near enough what was expected, the buyer paid via PayPal, and then sent a snotty message saying that the ‘postage better be fast’ as in his opinion he had ‘paid top dollar for it’.
We boxed up the gear well and had it collected by Parcelforce the next day. It was quite large and heavy as you can imagine and the postage was quite expensive, about £55 but that was priced and charged for in the sale.
The next message off the buyer was an angry one saying that he was ‘disgusted’ that Parcelforce tried to deliver the stuff while he was ‘at work’ and we should have arranged an evening delivery for him (?!?).
He then messaged again saying he was thinking about sending an invoice for the ‘inconvenience’ at having to drive to his local Parcelforce depot to collect it.
Then 3 days later he messaged again to complain it wasn’t as described and that he wanted to return it.
Absolutely nothing we could do. He wouldn’t say what wasn’t as described and just then made up something about ‘finding a scratch on it’. It was certainly described as used/gigged with age related marks.
So essentially my mate ended up £110 out of pocket as he had to refund the guy his original payment and £55 postage, plus then pay another £55 to have the gear picked up and returned.
Because I was pissed off at the whole thing I sent the guy a message saying he was just a timewaster and he replied saying the only reason he returned it is because he plugged his guitar in and played it for a few days and it just wasn’t quite the sound he was looking for, and that I was the mug for giving him his money back, laughing about it etc.
wker.
They know that ebay will always side with the buyer, so they simply can’t lose.
A friend of mine who doesn’t use ebay much asked me to list a double stack bass guitar speaker cabinet and amp unit for him a couple of months ago.
I’m always quite thorough with my adverts, plenty of photos, lengthy description etc.
The cabinets and amp sold for near enough what was expected, the buyer paid via PayPal, and then sent a snotty message saying that the ‘postage better be fast’ as in his opinion he had ‘paid top dollar for it’.
We boxed up the gear well and had it collected by Parcelforce the next day. It was quite large and heavy as you can imagine and the postage was quite expensive, about £55 but that was priced and charged for in the sale.
The next message off the buyer was an angry one saying that he was ‘disgusted’ that Parcelforce tried to deliver the stuff while he was ‘at work’ and we should have arranged an evening delivery for him (?!?).
He then messaged again saying he was thinking about sending an invoice for the ‘inconvenience’ at having to drive to his local Parcelforce depot to collect it.
Then 3 days later he messaged again to complain it wasn’t as described and that he wanted to return it.
Absolutely nothing we could do. He wouldn’t say what wasn’t as described and just then made up something about ‘finding a scratch on it’. It was certainly described as used/gigged with age related marks.
So essentially my mate ended up £110 out of pocket as he had to refund the guy his original payment and £55 postage, plus then pay another £55 to have the gear picked up and returned.
Because I was pissed off at the whole thing I sent the guy a message saying he was just a timewaster and he replied saying the only reason he returned it is because he plugged his guitar in and played it for a few days and it just wasn’t quite the sound he was looking for, and that I was the mug for giving him his money back, laughing about it etc.
w
ker.When I worked in Police Ops room I had a call from a small company making child's cots/beds. They sold one on their ebay site. Value approx £1000.It was despatched, signed for by the buyer. There was a slight delay of a couple of days and a £200 discount agreed ( it was in their T&C’s). Couple of weeks later, after emails exchanged, the buyers claimed no delivery and complained via ebay. The sellers sent ALL evidence of delivery, subsequent emails but ebay said it was policy to side with the buyer! They then took the FULL amount (not discounted by £200) back. The buyer therefore had the bed plus an extra £200.
With all the evidence of the buyer’s scam I advised a letter to ebay re making an unauthorised withdrawal from seller and log a complaint about the total lack of ebay’s investigation despite clear evidence. It appeared they couldn’t be bothered to deal with it or show any form of investigative procedures. I advised a deadline before a solicitor would be involved to gee them up. The buyer was from Liverpool so out of our area but no big deal to pass details to them.
Unfortunately I don’t know the outcome...GRRR.
With all the evidence of the buyer’s scam I advised a letter to ebay re making an unauthorised withdrawal from seller and log a complaint about the total lack of ebay’s investigation despite clear evidence. It appeared they couldn’t be bothered to deal with it or show any form of investigative procedures. I advised a deadline before a solicitor would be involved to gee them up. The buyer was from Liverpool so out of our area but no big deal to pass details to them.
Unfortunately I don’t know the outcome...GRRR.
Haha who knows, I'll maybe not be laughing soon.. If it come back in any other state then it was sent, then not sure what happens..
Got another ebayer (who seems very genuine) keen to buy it so not the end if the world. Also ebay have said they will pay for the return so 'only' out of pocket 18 quid for postage I hope.
Got another ebayer (who seems very genuine) keen to buy it so not the end if the world. Also ebay have said they will pay for the return so 'only' out of pocket 18 quid for postage I hope.
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