Will and probate - choice of lawyer
Discussion
This is rather a simple question, but I can’t provide all the detail on a public forum for obvious reasons.
I have a relative whose partner died recently of dementia. His partner’s family were not interested in his partner, especially when she got unwell but of course now she has died and the house is up for grabs are starting legal proceedings to force the sale and make my relative homeless. In short, they don’t like him, and are being very nasty and attacking the situation from a lot of angles to satisfy their greed and harboured grudges. Whilst in sound mind, the transfer of the property rights was handled by a solicitor, who I understand required the deceased partner present to assess that they were fit to sign the paperwork (is this a legal requirement that can be relied upon in future?)
On trying to ask a Different legal practice for services, they have refused to accept the case. They asked the question whether the house was in joint tenancy or joint ownership which could not be answered as my relative did not know. I understand that the default on such a transfer is to down the go joint ownership route unless requested differently at the time, so that is likely to be the case but can’t be sure.
So to the main question. The only detail which was exchanged with the prospective solicitor was a response to the ownership option as “don’t know”. Is this a normal thing for a solicitor to refuse to take the case and advise a prospective client to go back to the firm that did the transfer of ownership? There are good reasons to not use that specific solicitor. The relative is in Surrey/Sussex in case anyone wants to consider a recommendation for a good wills and probate lawyer likely to want to help.
TIA.
Kev.
I have a relative whose partner died recently of dementia. His partner’s family were not interested in his partner, especially when she got unwell but of course now she has died and the house is up for grabs are starting legal proceedings to force the sale and make my relative homeless. In short, they don’t like him, and are being very nasty and attacking the situation from a lot of angles to satisfy their greed and harboured grudges. Whilst in sound mind, the transfer of the property rights was handled by a solicitor, who I understand required the deceased partner present to assess that they were fit to sign the paperwork (is this a legal requirement that can be relied upon in future?)
On trying to ask a Different legal practice for services, they have refused to accept the case. They asked the question whether the house was in joint tenancy or joint ownership which could not be answered as my relative did not know. I understand that the default on such a transfer is to down the go joint ownership route unless requested differently at the time, so that is likely to be the case but can’t be sure.
So to the main question. The only detail which was exchanged with the prospective solicitor was a response to the ownership option as “don’t know”. Is this a normal thing for a solicitor to refuse to take the case and advise a prospective client to go back to the firm that did the transfer of ownership? There are good reasons to not use that specific solicitor. The relative is in Surrey/Sussex in case anyone wants to consider a recommendation for a good wills and probate lawyer likely to want to help.
TIA.
Kev.
land registry should tell you. https://eservices.landregistry.gov.uk/eservices/Fi...
speedyman said:
land registry should tell you. https://eservices.landregistry.gov.uk/eservices/Fi...
Thanks for that link. I had a look by postcode and number and there is no information available, also stating that it doesn’t mean it is not registered, just no info.My biggest question is for other reasons, he doesn’t want to go through the same solicitor who did the transfer of ownership. Seems strange for one solicitor to refuse to take the case and direct him back to that one, the logic of which is what I am trying to understand, and if he really has to do so.
SeeFive said:
They asked the question whether the house was in joint tenancy or joint ownership which could not be answered as my relative did not know. I understand that the default on such a transfer is to down the go joint ownership route unless requested differently at the time, so that is likely to be the case but can’t be sure.
As you say the property title was transferred, presumably this took place within the last 20 years or so? If so, the house must be registered at the Land Registry, so I can't understand your comment that there was no information available on the LR site. Are you sure you entered the correct details?When you locate the house at LR you just need to download a copy of the title register. Have a look at the proprietorship register. Assuming it's registered in joint names you need to look for mention of a Restriction.
If there is a Restriction then the house was probably held as tenants-in-common. That means that the deceased's share on the house forms part of her estate.
If there's no mention of a Restriction then the house was owned as joint tenants. Title would therefore have passed automatically to your friend on his partner's death. It seems unlikely that was the case, as otherwise the various vultures would have no interest in the house.
I've no idea why the solicitor refused the case, but the most common reason is that they couldn't see any money to be made out of it.
Did your friend's partner leave a Will?
Pro Bono said:
As you say the property title was transferred, presumably this took place within the last 20 years or so? If so, the house must be registered at the Land Registry, so I can't understand your comment that there was no information available on the LR site. Are you sure you entered the correct details?
When you locate the house at LR you just need to download a copy of the title register. Have a look at the proprietorship register. Assuming it's registered in joint names you need to look for mention of a Restriction.
If there is a Restriction then the house was probably held as tenants-in-common. That means that the deceased's share on the house forms part of her estate.
If there's no mention of a Restriction then the house was owned as joint tenants. Title would therefore have passed automatically to your friend on his partner's death. It seems unlikely that was the case, as otherwise the various vultures would have no interest in the house.
I've no idea why the solicitor refused the case, but the most common reason is that they couldn't see any money to be made out of it.
Did your friend's partner leave a Will?
Thank you for your response. I will respond as best as I can whilst avoiding searchable specifics in the public domain.When you locate the house at LR you just need to download a copy of the title register. Have a look at the proprietorship register. Assuming it's registered in joint names you need to look for mention of a Restriction.
If there is a Restriction then the house was probably held as tenants-in-common. That means that the deceased's share on the house forms part of her estate.
If there's no mention of a Restriction then the house was owned as joint tenants. Title would therefore have passed automatically to your friend on his partner's death. It seems unlikely that was the case, as otherwise the various vultures would have no interest in the house.
I've no idea why the solicitor refused the case, but the most common reason is that they couldn't see any money to be made out of it.
Did your friend's partner leave a Will?
I filled the LR link with the correct house number and postcode. The property has been split from a larger property into multiple units a few decades ago. Apparently when the transfer was done something about an issue like this was noted, but I have not seen the details.
I am told that the solicitor was advised by the applicants to structure it to pass automatically to the surviving partner on demise of the other - both ways. The deceased was adamant that she did not want it to pass to her family and would have expressed that to the solicitor at the time. We have heard that she expressed it to her closer friends for some years. The transfer took place in the last 4 years.
Sadly, there is no will to be found, just like many documents, sets of keys and similar important items she “put safely away” down the loo or somewhere similarly daft as her dementia accelerated. By then, I guess a will could not be redone - unsound mind.
The vulture family are trying to suggest that when the tenancy was transferred, there was cognitive impairment in the deceased, raising questions on the legitimacy of the transfer and enabling them to go for the house. There are a number of other seriously horrible things going on too from the vultures. Sadly they are scum, past behaviour which I cannot currently discuss on a public forum shows it clearly and related false accusations from the past can be evidenced in official documentation. The new stuff will not provide the evidence they need - sorry, can’t say any more on that but it will fail.
Personally, I think it is messy enough and with seriously committed vultures trying all the tricks they can to make a legal representative some reasonable money defending against them. It looks like my relative will speak to the firm tomorrow who did the title transfer about representation despite not really wanting to go through them.
If the people involved are wealthy, try
https://www.mauriceturnorgardner.com/
Or Farrer & Co. I prefer Farrer & co - less shouty. Ask for Adam Carvalho to start with.
https://www.mauriceturnorgardner.com/
Or Farrer & Co. I prefer Farrer & co - less shouty. Ask for Adam Carvalho to start with.
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