Sold a car. Buyer wants to sue...
Discussion
Usual tale. Sold a car via Ebay. Buyer wants to sue.
Chap chipped me down from £5,750 to £5,000 over messages.
The advert said.
This is our family vehicle which we have owned for 3 years. The car is in good condition and drives very nicely.
It has a full MOT to June 2021
I have had a few Range Rovers (its a hard disease to get rid of!) and this one has had a number of common defects that affect ones of this age sorted.
After 3 years, I will be sad to see it go, but it's time for the new kid on the block.
Feel free to call or message me with any questions.
While there the car would not start with it taking a few goes to recognise the key. I believed this to be a low key battery, as the car has been standing for the best part of a year other than the drive to the MOT station and back. We agreed another £200 off and he drove away.
Had a message later that day telling me it was not the key, but the ignition barrel which was a dash out job. This was followed by some discussion, and after some internet research from me, him coming back to to tell me it was the Key and was going to cost £250. (Keys can be bought and programmed for substantially less that this).
Today (3-4 weeks later) he has decided that it a sticky solenoid in the ignition and that it requires a second hand steering column. £750, which he tells me he will pursue through the small claims court.
This is on the basis that my advert did not disclose a faulty steering column (which I did not know about to disclose), and because my attempt at assistance showed that I knew about the fault (which I did not - I just googled the symptoms),
I think I'm clear - but would be grateful for any backup!
Chap chipped me down from £5,750 to £5,000 over messages.
The advert said.
This is our family vehicle which we have owned for 3 years. The car is in good condition and drives very nicely.
It has a full MOT to June 2021
I have had a few Range Rovers (its a hard disease to get rid of!) and this one has had a number of common defects that affect ones of this age sorted.
After 3 years, I will be sad to see it go, but it's time for the new kid on the block.
Feel free to call or message me with any questions.
While there the car would not start with it taking a few goes to recognise the key. I believed this to be a low key battery, as the car has been standing for the best part of a year other than the drive to the MOT station and back. We agreed another £200 off and he drove away.
Had a message later that day telling me it was not the key, but the ignition barrel which was a dash out job. This was followed by some discussion, and after some internet research from me, him coming back to to tell me it was the Key and was going to cost £250. (Keys can be bought and programmed for substantially less that this).
Today (3-4 weeks later) he has decided that it a sticky solenoid in the ignition and that it requires a second hand steering column. £750, which he tells me he will pursue through the small claims court.
This is on the basis that my advert did not disclose a faulty steering column (which I did not know about to disclose), and because my attempt at assistance showed that I knew about the fault (which I did not - I just googled the symptoms),
I think I'm clear - but would be grateful for any backup!
ktAs above. I’d also block him so you’re not bothered by those mithering messages. If he does take you to small claims, usual applies (not a trader/pointed out known faults/sold as seen/adequate opportunity to inspect)
Don’t pay it another thought. Chancers like this everywhere these days.
Don’t pay it another thought. Chancers like this everywhere these days.
Sheepshanks said:
Muzzer79 said:
Just ignore him. Literally, don't communicate.
What car manufacturers customer services do, quite effectively, is string people along for a couple of months until they give up.Maybe try the same thing? Send holding replies every couple of weeks mentioning Coronavirus.
OP block there number and move on, sold as seen, buyer beware, inspection etc
Mobilecommute said:
Not relevant as OP isn't a trader.
What's that got to do with stringing someone along? Anyone can do it, you don't need to be a pro.Blocking the number risks winding them up so they react by issuing a small claims case. It's super easy and the outcome is so random, it's worth a punt. We've seen bizarre cases where they've won.
Sheepshanks said:
Mobilecommute said:
Not relevant as OP isn't a trader.
What's that got to do with stringing someone along? Anyone can do it, you don't need to be a pro.Blocking the number risks winding them up so they react by issuing a small claims case. It's super easy and the outcome is so random, it's worth a punt. We've seen bizarre cases where they've won.
Both could result in a small claims, but blocking would surely be less stress.
Caveat emptor isn’t an immutable get out clause, even in a private sale.
A private sale where the seller is a bonafide private individual starts from a stronger place, but all litigation has risk.
You can be taken to court on the basis of misrepresentation, which doesn’t sound like what’s happened here.
You can also still be taken all the way to court, with all that entails, even if at the end the judge rules in your favour.
Make sure you record everything now - a copy of the advert, all correspondence, etc. Ideally you should write everything down with dates and times if possible so that you don’t forget the details if/when you get a claim form in the post.
A private sale where the seller is a bonafide private individual starts from a stronger place, but all litigation has risk.
You can be taken to court on the basis of misrepresentation, which doesn’t sound like what’s happened here.
You can also still be taken all the way to court, with all that entails, even if at the end the judge rules in your favour.
Make sure you record everything now - a copy of the advert, all correspondence, etc. Ideally you should write everything down with dates and times if possible so that you don’t forget the details if/when you get a claim form in the post.
surveyor said:
While there the car would not start with it taking a few goes to recognise the key. I believed this to be a low key battery, as the car has been standing for the best part of a year other than the drive to the MOT station and back. We agreed another £200 off and he drove away.
I think I'm clear - but would be grateful for any backup!
Did you say to the buyer you believed it to be just a low key battery?I think I'm clear - but would be grateful for any backup!
And then agreed a discount of £200 to fix the "low key battery" ??
I got taken to court fairly recently under much the same circumstances, although in my case the car was to both of us apparently in perfect working order, and had a full main dealer service history, maintained regardless of cost. It later transpired that there was the beginnings of wear to the rear diff.
The buyer sued for a replacement diff (several thousand pounds) and tried to use the fact that I had said that he wouldn’t need to spend any money on it in the short term to be some kind of unilateral guarantee that nothing would ever go wrong, when I simply meant that it had recently had a service, 4 new tyres and MOT, so not scheduled maintenance was due.
He also tried to twist me saying that he should take it to a dealer to get diagnosed (rather than just speculating about the fault) to mean that I was agreeing to shoulder the cost of repairs.
In my case mine got pretty much all the way to a court date, but it collapsed due to the fact that the buyer was rather hopeless at following directions from the Judge, so eventually he struck it out.
It still cost me a considerable amount of time, and some expense (sending various documents via recorded delivery, etc), and were it not for the fact that a paralegal decided on a whim to help me pro-bono, giving my documents a once over etc, it would’ve been a lot more stressful than it was, and it was still pretty stressful.
The point being - even if you’re in the right you can still be taken to court, and in small claims there’s no recovery of legal costs (which is both good and bad) and unless the Claimant acts very poorly (a failed claim is not bad behaviour) you aren’t likely to get costs awarded either.
Since small claims has been mentioned I’d strongly advise you to be very guarded about what you say, and to make sure you document everything you can, while you can.
The buyer sued for a replacement diff (several thousand pounds) and tried to use the fact that I had said that he wouldn’t need to spend any money on it in the short term to be some kind of unilateral guarantee that nothing would ever go wrong, when I simply meant that it had recently had a service, 4 new tyres and MOT, so not scheduled maintenance was due.
He also tried to twist me saying that he should take it to a dealer to get diagnosed (rather than just speculating about the fault) to mean that I was agreeing to shoulder the cost of repairs.
In my case mine got pretty much all the way to a court date, but it collapsed due to the fact that the buyer was rather hopeless at following directions from the Judge, so eventually he struck it out.
It still cost me a considerable amount of time, and some expense (sending various documents via recorded delivery, etc), and were it not for the fact that a paralegal decided on a whim to help me pro-bono, giving my documents a once over etc, it would’ve been a lot more stressful than it was, and it was still pretty stressful.
The point being - even if you’re in the right you can still be taken to court, and in small claims there’s no recovery of legal costs (which is both good and bad) and unless the Claimant acts very poorly (a failed claim is not bad behaviour) you aren’t likely to get costs awarded either.
Since small claims has been mentioned I’d strongly advise you to be very guarded about what you say, and to make sure you document everything you can, while you can.
Edited by Durzel on Friday 21st August 20:43
Boosted LS1 said:
Ask him specifically what his complaint is and what he expects from you. He will set out his stall and later on if it goes to court you can deal with it. Don't engage with lengthy replies.
Isn't that going to raise his expectations though? If someone asked me that and then told me that they're not doing anything, it would just antagonize me.The buyer already has the OP down as a soft touch, so If I was in his position, I would consider sending one final text summing up what has happened and why he isn't giving him any more money and that he will defend any court action.
catman said:
Boosted LS1 said:
Ask him specifically what his complaint is and what he expects from you. He will set out his stall and later on if it goes to court you can deal with it. Don't engage with lengthy replies.
Isn't that going to raise his expectations though? If someone asked me that and then told me that they're not doing anything, it would just antagonize me.The buyer already has the OP down as a soft touch, so If I was in his position, I would consider sending one final text summing up what has happened and why he isn't giving him any more money and that he will defend any court action.
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