How can I prove an online car ad actually says what it does?
Discussion
Long story short, I bought a car and it is not as advertised.
The dealer's website states that the car has a particular £2000 part fitted, and now I have the car home and have properly inspected it, I know the car does not have this part fitted.
I know I should have done a proper inspection before handing over my cash, but it involves jacking the car, and I put some faith in the dealer being honest.
Anyway, the dealer's advert is still live now, I have screenshotted it, but is this enough proof if they make things difficult?
Obviously when I complain, they could quickly edit their website to make the description accurate. It would be possible for them to claim that I editted their page myself before taking the screenshot. Something that would be very easy to do using the browser inspector.
The dealer's website states that the car has a particular £2000 part fitted, and now I have the car home and have properly inspected it, I know the car does not have this part fitted.
I know I should have done a proper inspection before handing over my cash, but it involves jacking the car, and I put some faith in the dealer being honest.
Anyway, the dealer's advert is still live now, I have screenshotted it, but is this enough proof if they make things difficult?
Obviously when I complain, they could quickly edit their website to make the description accurate. It would be possible for them to claim that I editted their page myself before taking the screenshot. Something that would be very easy to do using the browser inspector.
I'll be interested to see what responses you get on here. I presume they aren't bound by the ad details and that they'd say you were welcome to carry out an inspection to satisfy yourself as to the spec of the car.
I had this when I bought my Porsche. The ad stated all sorts of things that weren't there - rear parking sensors and "shod with new Pirellis" were the things I remember. When I mentioned the Pirellis, they claimed it was an admin error. Yes, alright. Interestingly, the fact that the tyres weren't as advertised drew my attention to them, so when I went to collect it, the fact that they'd fitted 3 Michelins and a Bridgestone was the first thing I noticed.
IMO car salesmen will try and get away with anything and everything if they think they can. Not to be trusted.
I had this when I bought my Porsche. The ad stated all sorts of things that weren't there - rear parking sensors and "shod with new Pirellis" were the things I remember. When I mentioned the Pirellis, they claimed it was an admin error. Yes, alright. Interestingly, the fact that the tyres weren't as advertised drew my attention to them, so when I went to collect it, the fact that they'd fitted 3 Michelins and a Bridgestone was the first thing I noticed.
IMO car salesmen will try and get away with anything and everything if they think they can. Not to be trusted.
Thanks for the offer Rotrex Kid. Unfortunately, this is was not a factory fit option so it wouldn't be listed. I have HPI'd it myself today and it has no issues listed.
The problem with printing it is the same as screenshotting. It would be extremely easy for anyone (ie me) to edit the page beforehand.
The problem with printing it is the same as screenshotting. It would be extremely easy for anyone (ie me) to edit the page beforehand.
Edited by billbring on Sunday 27th September 20:12
Civil claims are on the balance of probabilities, more likely than not. Don't worry about doctored adverts after the event.
Did you pay more for the car than normal market value especially because there was the special thing fitted? Did you only buy it because of that?
If you approach dealer and tell them special item is not present, what do you want as the outcome?
Did you pay more for the car than normal market value especially because there was the special thing fitted? Did you only buy it because of that?
If you approach dealer and tell them special item is not present, what do you want as the outcome?
billbring said:
Thanks for the offer Rotrex Kid. Unfortunately, this is was not a factory fit option so it wouldn't be listed. I have HPI'd it myself today and it has no issues listed.
The problem with printing it is the same as screenshotting. It would be extremely easy for anyone (ie me) to edit the page beforehand.
Ahhh I see. What is it then?! Interested to know what the part is.The problem with printing it is the same as screenshotting. It would be extremely easy for anyone (ie me) to edit the page beforehand.
Edited by billbring on Sunday 27th September 20:12
There isn’t really any other way apart from printing it, screenshotting it.
Unless you know a lawyer and get them to print it and sign it as 100% legit.
Screenshot should be fine but you could back it up by saving the page etc
I've found most traders very apathetic and regularly place incorrect ads, more from ignorance than intent - in the old days Trading Standards used to keep them in check but they don't seem to any more.
I suspect at best they'll offer your money back - at worst tell you to get lost.
I've found most traders very apathetic and regularly place incorrect ads, more from ignorance than intent - in the old days Trading Standards used to keep them in check but they don't seem to any more.
I suspect at best they'll offer your money back - at worst tell you to get lost.
Does your phone have the ability to record the screen?
If so, set it to record, start on your home screen, open browser, open advert, there you go.
Far more difficult to edit a video if you are worried about them accusing you of that.
As had been said though, a screenshot should be more than enough.
If so, set it to record, start on your home screen, open browser, open advert, there you go.
Far more difficult to edit a video if you are worried about them accusing you of that.
As had been said though, a screenshot should be more than enough.
Monkeylegend said:
How easy would it be for them to argue you must have removed it after you bought the car?
I guess it's possible, but I think it's generally evident when parts have been very recently swapped.RonaldMcDonaldAteMyCat said:
Did you pay more for the car than normal market value especially because there was the special thing fitted? Did you only buy it because of that?
If you approach dealer and tell them special item is not present, what do you want as the outcome?
Yes, I bought this particular car due to the spec it had. The ideal resolution would be for the dealer to refund me £2000 and I get the part fitted myself, since this is what I would have done if I'd bought another, cheaper car. This does represent 15% of the purchase price though so quite significant.If you approach dealer and tell them special item is not present, what do you want as the outcome?
CoreyDog said:
If so, set it to record, start on your home screen, open browser, open advert, there you go.
Great idea! Thank you.citizensadvice.org.uk said:
You’re legally entitled to your money back or a repair if the car is faulty
‘Faulty’ means the car is not:
‘of satisfactory quality’ - it should do what you’d expect for its age, mileage, price and type
‘fit for purpose’ - eg if you asked for a car that would pull a caravan, it has to be able to do that
‘as described’ - it has to match the advert or the description the trader gave you
If the problem fits into at least one of these categories, take it back to the trader before 23 October 2020 to get a full refund. You have longer if you only want a repair - and if the trader takes too long (or it causes you too much inconvenience), you’ll still be entitled to a refund.
This advice seems to be fairly explicit. I'm hoping that worse case is that I return the car for a full refund. But I'd rather the dealer just refunded me £2000 tbh since I am otherwise satisfied with the car and it would be a lot of hassle to have to find another one. Especially since I would then have no transport for myself.‘Faulty’ means the car is not:
‘of satisfactory quality’ - it should do what you’d expect for its age, mileage, price and type
‘fit for purpose’ - eg if you asked for a car that would pull a caravan, it has to be able to do that
‘as described’ - it has to match the advert or the description the trader gave you
If the problem fits into at least one of these categories, take it back to the trader before 23 October 2020 to get a full refund. You have longer if you only want a repair - and if the trader takes too long (or it causes you too much inconvenience), you’ll still be entitled to a refund.
dredge said:
That link doesn’t work for me, but I had an issue in the past where a website was updated. This was during litigation where the burden of proof is on the ‘balance of probabilities’, so more likely than not/51%+.I already had a print out of what the website said, so added a print out of the changed website, and a witness statement setting out the background. The latter incorporated reference to a website which gave times and dates when the ‘offending’ website was last updated. I don’t recall the exact website I used to demonstrate this, but IIRC there were quite a few that did it - perhaps including the URL above?
Anyway, this is obviously a lot further down the line and hopefully way further than you would need ever go. But is to demonstrate what was acceptable in this particular case (ie absent any evidence to the contrary - each case would turn on it’s own facts, eg the opposing party may try and produce counter evidence, but nothing was forthcoming from the defendant in the case I dealt with, thus demonstrating sufficiently to the judge that, on the balance of probabilities, my account was likely correct - which it was
).CoreyDog said:
Does your phone have the ability to record the screen?
If so, set it to record, start on your home screen, open browser, open advert, there you go.
Far more difficult to edit a video if you are worried about them accusing you of that.
As had been said though, a screenshot should be more than enough.
Much easier to edit the source code of the web page than an image though.If so, set it to record, start on your home screen, open browser, open advert, there you go.
Far more difficult to edit a video if you are worried about them accusing you of that.
As had been said though, a screenshot should be more than enough.
There’s not doubting that the LSD costs £2k however in my experience, modifications never hold their value once fitted to the vehicle. Maybe it makes the vehicle more saleable on the used market or adds an extra grand in value but I doubt you’d have any joy in getting the full £2k back.
Regardless, best of luck OP and keep us updated.
Regardless, best of luck OP and keep us updated.
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