New Highway Code

[Salted_Peanut]

In July, the Government proposed changing the Highway Code to introduce a hierarchy of road users, clarify pedestrian and cyclist priority, and establish safer overtaking of cyclists and horse riders. How long do you think it will be before the Code changes?

Gov.uk said:

The main alterations to the code being proposed are:

• introducing a hierarchy of road users which ensures that those road users who can do the greatest harm have the greatest responsibility to reduce the danger or threat they may pose to others
• clarifying existing rules on pedestrian priority on pavements, to advise that drivers and riders should give way to pedestrians crossing or waiting to cross the road,
• providing guidance on cyclist priority at junctions to advise drivers to give priority to cyclists at junctions when travelling straight ahead
• establishing guidance on safe passing distances and speeds when overtaking cyclists and horse riders

[donkmeister]

Salted_Peanut said:

How long do you think it will be before the Code changes?

Why, are you looking to get in some Carmageddon before the HC changes?

[Ian Geary]

Salted_Peanut said:

Gov.uk said:

The main alterations to the code being proposed are:

• introducing a hierarchy of road users which ensures that those road users who can do the greatest harm have the greatest responsibility to reduce the danger or threat they may pose to others

Will be interesting to see how that gets applied to horsey people. They should include the word "themselves" at the end.

And whilst I'm on a roll giving out my blinkered preconceptions, I'll also add that as a cyclist, I'd still be incredibly wary putting myself on the left of any large vehicle at a junction, irrespective of what the new guidance says.

Which leads on to education and enforcement. With large parts of guidance already having blind eyes turned to it, even of the code is updated quickly it will take ages to work it's way through to driving behaviour imo

[mikeveal]

The code is just guidance on interpreting motoring law.
Changing the guidance alone doesn't alter how you are required to behave.

[kestral]

I filled the questionnaire regarding the proposed alterations.

In my opinion it demonstrated a very anti car stance.

It was quite worrying that if the rule changes propsed were brought in the responsibility for most accidents(collisions) would result in the car driver being in the wrong.

An example was the proposition to make it so that a cyclist could use pedestrian crossings and the vehicle was obligated to give way. Having seen many cyclits just ride out off the path onto a pedestrain crossing at speed many times, I was horrified at such a proposal!

Many of the proposels did not take current statutory law or case law into consideration.

I pointed out on the questionnaire that before imposing more responsibility on the motorists it would be prudent to take action to enforce the responsibilities that lay with cyclist at present.

No lights
Going through red lights
Riding on the footpath
Riding whilst using audio equipment
Riding whilst using a mobile phone
Riding with shopping bags hanging from handle bars.

[Your Dad]

kestral said:

it would be prudent to take action to enforce the responsibilities that lay with motorist at present.

No lights
Going through red lights
Driving on the footpath
Driving whilst using a mobile phone

Amazing that a slight edit shows it goes both ways.

[kestral]

Your Dad said:

Amazing that a slight edit shows it goes both ways.

No it does not at all. I think you need to read my post.

The law is enforced on motorists but not enforced on cyclists.

Let us see the current law enforced on cyclists before we put more obligation on the motorist.

The behavior of most cyclist is disgraceful.

[Johnnytheboy]

I think a hierarchy of road users is insane.

I guess I need re-educating.

[Your Dad]

kestral said:

No it does not at all. I think you need to read my post.

The law is enforced on motorists but not enforced on cyclists.

Let us see the current law enforced on cyclists before we put more obligation on the motorist.

The behavior of most cyclist is disgraceful.

Wow, let’s tar them all with the same brush. I suppose they’re also the group of road users responsible for the hundred of deaths every year?

Truth is that it’s the motorist that is the most dangerous, yet entitlement causes them to shift the blame onto the vulnerable road user in an attempt to distract from the real danger.

[320d is all you need]

Your Dad said:

kestral said:

it would be prudent to take action to enforce the responsibilities that lay with motorist at present.

No lights
Going through red lights
Driving on the footpath
Driving whilst using a mobile phone

Amazing that a slight edit shows it goes both ways.

Except none of those , if carried out by a bicycle, result in any fine, penalty points or training.

We all need to share the roads but I see a much higher % proportion of cyclists being dippy than I do car drivers.

I hate the idea that a car driver is automatically at fault for an accident with a cyclist. I am just grateful for my dash camera in such an event

[Your Dad]

320d is all you need said:

We all need to share the roads but I see a much higher % proportion of cyclists being dippy than I do car drivers.

Interesting, as at the weekend when I was out I didn’t see a single cyclist ignore traffic lights, speed limits, use a mobile phone, close pass other road users, tailgate or road rage. Saw plenty of motorists do it though.

[andrew]

please can we a have a law that if your horse takes a ginormous dump in the middle of the road, then you're obliged to scoop it up ?
cheers

no problem here reciprocating as either a driver, cyclist or pedestrian

[mybrainhurts]

Your Dad said:

kestral said:

No it does not at all. I think you need to read my post.

The law is enforced on motorists but not enforced on cyclists.

Let us see the current law enforced on cyclists before we put more obligation on the motorist.

The behavior of most cyclist is disgraceful.

Wow, let’s tar them all with the same brush. I suppose they’re also the group of road users responsible for the hundred of deaths every year?

Truth is that it’s the motorist that is the most dangerous, yet entitlement causes them to shift the blame onto the vulnerable road user in an attempt to distract from the real danger.

Wow, let's tar them all with the same brush.

[320d is all you need]

Your Dad said:

320d is all you need said:

We all need to share the roads but I see a much higher % proportion of cyclists being dippy than I do car drivers.

Interesting, as at the weekend when I was out I didn’t see a single cyclist ignore traffic lights, speed limits, use a mobile phone, close pass other road users, tailgate or road rage. Saw plenty of motorists do it though.

Are you a cyclist? You sound like one

I cycle fairly regularly. I am ashamed to say, especially the "road bike strava" lot, in their lycra and aerodynamic helmets are generally the problem . I see them often riding 2, or 3 abreast on 50mph/National speed limit roads, without a care in the world.
That, and the younger kids on Mountain bikes with hoodies up, late in the evening and at night, without lights.

I also worked in London for a while.
While I did see car drivers VERY occasionally jumping red lights, this was very rare. I could say less than 1 in 100 cars. Where as in my personal experience, 1 in 10 cyclists did. Or they'd hop on the path, and ride around, and then back on the road.

As I said, I am not looking to get into a tittle tattle argument about car v cyclist.
I'm just explaining that from what the OP has said, the HC seems to get too "Anti-car", some cyclists do often push their luck knowing full well they are generally immune from any sort of financial recompense or penalty, and in most cases, if there is an accident, they will be cleared of any blame.

Of course, they are at higher risk of physical damage, but that is their choice.

Of course not all cyclists are like this, and many cyclists and car users can happily co-exist. The problem is when knob heads from either side meet, generally, another knob head.

Would I like to see all cyclists on the road have some sort of formal training or proficiency test, and have suitable insurance?
Yes .

But , I am not silly enough to recognise the above would be practically unenforceable let alone very difficult to implement.

I had a child ride his push bike into my parked car once. I say child, he was 14 or 15. So really a young man.
I saw him make contact.
I ran out into the road (had to go out of my gate in the garden and such), just as he got back on his bike and rode away.

A lovely £400 repair bill for me.
And no way to trace the cyclist.


The joys.

[donkmeister]

kestral said:

I pointed out on the questionnaire that before imposing more responsibility on the motorists it would be prudent to take action to enforce the responsibilities that lay with cyclist at present.

No lights
Going through red lights
Riding on the footpath
Riding whilst using audio equipment
Riding whilst using a mobile phone
Riding with shopping bags hanging from handle bars.

Fair point. I'm a sensible careful driver, but as soon as I get on my bike (did you know I don't pay road tax on it) I turn into a phone-using cretin who jumps red lights.

I'm obviously being facetious, but apart from hanging shopping bags from the steering wheel can you honestly say you don't see people doing the above whilst driving a car? If so I want to live where you are as it sounds brilliant.

The fact is, most people get away with doing dumb stuff whilst driving or cycling and only face the music if they do it in front of a police car or have an accident that causes severe injuries and are witnessed to have done those stupid things. It's not a case of the Police hiding around every corner watching out for it but only stopping cars.

[Fastpedeller]

It looks like the recommendations are aimed at those with the vehicles MOST LIKELY TO DAMAGE THE MORE vulnerable are being urged to drive properly, and carefully - seems like a reasonable aim.
Last Sunday I was cycling (alone, so single-file ) at about 10-12 MPH around a tight LH 90 degree bend, when a car driver decided to overtake (albeit giving me plenty of room). Unfortunately, she failed to anticipate that there may be another vehicle approaching which would come around the next blind bend 20 metres away - Almost a head-on crash on a country lane with just enough room for a car width either way! Good and swift braking by the oncoming motorist!
I was fortunate not to be hit, but I guess some here would blame me just for being there.

[Solocle]

Fastpedeller said:

It looks like the recommendations are aimed at those with the vehicles MOST LIKELY TO DAMAGE THE MORE vulnerable are being urged to drive properly, and carefully - seems like a reasonable aim.
Last Sunday I was cycling (alone, so single-file ) at about 10-12 MPH around a tight LH 90 degree bend, when a car driver decided to overtake (albeit giving me plenty of room). Unfortunately, she failed to anticipate that there may be another vehicle approaching which would come around the next blind bend 20 metres away - Almost a head-on crash on a country lane with just enough room for a car width either way! Good and swift braking by the oncoming motorist!
I was fortunate not to be hit, but I guess some here would blame me just for being there.

Funny, I managed to avoid any overtaking into oncoming traffic for a little bit on Sunday
Video

Edited by Solocle on Thursday 26th November 19:03

[Foss62]

Your Dad said:

320d is all you need said:

We all need to share the roads but I see a much higher % proportion of cyclists being dippy than I do car drivers.

Interesting, as at the weekend when I was out I didn’t see a single cyclist ignore traffic lights, speed limits, use a mobile phone, close pass other road users, tailgate or road rage. Saw plenty of motorists do it though.

Anyone who really puts any thought into it would know your comment reflects reality. Most motorists break the law every time they go out. I doubt that is true of most cyclists.

[Fastpedeller]

Fastpedeller said:

It looks like the recommendations are aimed at those with the vehicles MOST LIKELY TO DAMAGE THE MORE vulnerable are being urged to drive properly, and carefully - seems like a reasonable aim.
Last Sunday I was cycling (alone, so single-file ) at about 10-12 MPH around a tight LH 90 degree bend, when a car driver decided to overtake (albeit giving me plenty of room). Unfortunately, she failed to anticipate that there may be another vehicle approaching which would come around the next blind bend 20 metres away - Almost a head-on crash on a country lane with just enough room for a car width either way! Good and swift braking by the oncoming motorist!
I was fortunate not to be hit, but I guess some here would blame me just for being there.

Here's a (very poor) image of the road

[jondude]

Maybe it depends where you live but I do not meet too many cyclists on the roads here (East England).

When I do, no matter what the old or new HC says I always cut them some serious slack as even the most 'professional' of them can still wobble, hit potholes and be blown off course by the wind.

While the government is doing all it can to promote cycling it does seem they forgot two very important issues with the UK.

1. Our climate.
2. Hills.

Mind you, once the new taxes are dished out because of covid it could be many car drivers opt for an electric bicycle. Very unlikely fuel duty, VAT and all car ownership taxes won't be raised, maybe dramatically as the government will be losing billions if it keeps over promoting milk float cars, too.