Speed cameras and the blame game
Discussion
Over on another SM platform it has been suggested that the only reason for Speed Cameras is to turn people against the Police.
Yet no one has yet given a reason for that.
Speed cameras and vans are located based on intelligence, whether that be accident data or community concerns. -
Death or serious injury has occurred at the location.
Speeds in the area have been recorded as significantly high.
Speeding concerns have been raised by residents and those concerns have been corroborated by a traffic speed survey.
Supporting a police enforcement campaign
The sites are risk assessed, so they aren't "hidden" around a corner.
There in big vans with loud colours and identifed as speed cameras, or big posts painted yellow.
A majority of Cameras and vans are funded and run by a Road Partnership, of which the Police are part of.
The decision on placement and use of cameras isn't solely a Police decision.
Any money generated by fines issued go to Mr Sunak, not to the Police, so is it really about "cash cows"?
The majority of these cameras have a buffer of 10% +2mph, so if you do get caught, it's not like you were "just over".
If you do get a fine, it was completely avoidable.
So how do they 'turn people against the Police'?
Yet no one has yet given a reason for that.
Speed cameras and vans are located based on intelligence, whether that be accident data or community concerns. -
Death or serious injury has occurred at the location.
Speeds in the area have been recorded as significantly high.
Speeding concerns have been raised by residents and those concerns have been corroborated by a traffic speed survey.
Supporting a police enforcement campaign
The sites are risk assessed, so they aren't "hidden" around a corner.
There in big vans with loud colours and identifed as speed cameras, or big posts painted yellow.
A majority of Cameras and vans are funded and run by a Road Partnership, of which the Police are part of.
The decision on placement and use of cameras isn't solely a Police decision.
Any money generated by fines issued go to Mr Sunak, not to the Police, so is it really about "cash cows"?
The majority of these cameras have a buffer of 10% +2mph, so if you do get caught, it's not like you were "just over".
If you do get a fine, it was completely avoidable.
So how do they 'turn people against the Police'?
- Edited to included criteria for mobile cameras*
Edited by Nibbles_bits on Thursday 18th March 22:19
Nibbles_bits said:
Speed cameras and vans are located based on intelligence, whether that be accident data or community concerns.
Doesn't seem to be around me at least, they just put them in the middle of dual carriageways, miles away from junctions or people.Nibbles_bits said:
The sites are risk assessed, so they aren't "hidden" around a corner.
Van sites don't have to be risk assessedNibbles_bits said:
There in big vans with loud colours and identifed as speed cameras, or big posts painted yellow.
By the time you see the van, the letter might as well be in the post.Nibbles_bits said:
Any money generated by fines issued go to Mr Sunak, not to the Police, so is it really about "cash cows"?
Police forces can claim back operating costs + they get a cut of SAC revenueI guess a lot of people don’t realise that it’s not police officers in the vans.
People also don’t like being caught doing something wrong.
I do think it’s better when someone is spoken to by someone though. I’ve stopped countless people with the intention of giving them a ticket for the speed they were going. But decided that the five minute chat I had with them was enough to change their ways.
I’ve also gone the other way and given someone a ticket due to their attitude towards the offence (not their attitude towards me).
(As an side note driver awareness courses the force gets some money from them).
People also don’t like being caught doing something wrong.
I do think it’s better when someone is spoken to by someone though. I’ve stopped countless people with the intention of giving them a ticket for the speed they were going. But decided that the five minute chat I had with them was enough to change their ways.
I’ve also gone the other way and given someone a ticket due to their attitude towards the offence (not their attitude towards me).
(As an side note driver awareness courses the force gets some money from them).
Boosted LS1 said:
It's a money making scam and we all nowadays expect a fine/tax every few years. Civvies or police in vans are out to trap many a reasonable driver. I can't stand them. Lowest of the low in my book.
I wouldnt say I'm a paragon of virtue in my car, but I've not been fined since 1993, and that was definitely my fault.I always think its peoples interpretation of what they think should be a crime or not, and most people dont think speeding should be, or dont think that speeding is an issue, the same with parking fines, people tend to think that they have a god given right to park anywhere they choose, and shouldnt have to pay for the privilege.
I often wonder how the people that argue against speed prevention would feel if someone was speeding, and killed a member of their family, would they be happy for the police to disregard the speed factor, because speeding isnt really an issue.
And again, if they lived next to an airport, and someone decided to park on their drive for a few weeks while they went on holiday, would they just be ok with that.
And im not saying I dont speed, and have had my fair share of speeding fines, but accept the fact I am breaking the law, and that is my punishment.
I often wonder how the people that argue against speed prevention would feel if someone was speeding, and killed a member of their family, would they be happy for the police to disregard the speed factor, because speeding isnt really an issue.
And again, if they lived next to an airport, and someone decided to park on their drive for a few weeks while they went on holiday, would they just be ok with that.
And im not saying I dont speed, and have had my fair share of speeding fines, but accept the fact I am breaking the law, and that is my punishment.
When isn't it the driver's fault??
The cameras in my area do risk assess the location, and aren't manned by Police.
I wouldn't say I've ever seen one of our partnership vehicles on a range location (not that I know them all).
I couldn't agree more about speaking with someone. If they don't get a ticket, hopefully they'll remember it, and if they do, at least you can explain it.
If the Police didn't receive anything from them, at all, would it still be cameras "turning people.......'?
The cameras in my area do risk assess the location, and aren't manned by Police.
I wouldn't say I've ever seen one of our partnership vehicles on a range location (not that I know them all).
I couldn't agree more about speaking with someone. If they don't get a ticket, hopefully they'll remember it, and if they do, at least you can explain it.
If the Police didn't receive anything from them, at all, would it still be cameras "turning people.......'?
I'm guessing that since there are no Police to be seen these days.
No Police to attend burglaries, or most other crimes. No Police stations,no real people to speak to.
101 doesn't answer?
But Boatloads of Camera Vans, static cameras, Motorcycle cameras, Car cameras the list goes on.
A64 to York and the East Coast, from Leeds, where I live, there are six, yes six vans every weekend .
In the morning they photograph cars going East.
People off to the coast to spend their money.
After lunchtime, all of the vans are then working Westbound.
Having a second go at the cars coming home.
How on Earth can you expect the public not to think there is not something Fishy going on.
Some of the sites used are very long safe stretches. Certainly not 'Accedent Spots'
They are hated by the General (Motorists) Public, some who have never broken the law but have, by accident hit the Dizzy speed of 35mph. Some of these NIPs drop in within 3 days.
Pretty Slick eh?
No Police to attend burglaries, or most other crimes. No Police stations,no real people to speak to.
101 doesn't answer?
But Boatloads of Camera Vans, static cameras, Motorcycle cameras, Car cameras the list goes on.
A64 to York and the East Coast, from Leeds, where I live, there are six, yes six vans every weekend .
In the morning they photograph cars going East.
People off to the coast to spend their money.
After lunchtime, all of the vans are then working Westbound.
Having a second go at the cars coming home.
How on Earth can you expect the public not to think there is not something Fishy going on.
Some of the sites used are very long safe stretches. Certainly not 'Accedent Spots'
They are hated by the General (Motorists) Public, some who have never broken the law but have, by accident hit the Dizzy speed of 35mph. Some of these NIPs drop in within 3 days.
Pretty Slick eh?
Boosted LS1 said:
It's a money making scam and we all nowadays expect a fine/tax every few years. Civvies or police in vans are out to trap many a reasonable driver. I can't stand them. Lowest of the low in my book.
Can I ask why you think they're out to "trap drivers"?You, as the driver can only get fined if you're speeding.
mickyh7 said:
I'm guessing that since there are no Police to be seen these days.
No Police to attend burglaries, or most other crimes. No Police stations,no real people to speak to.
101 doesn't answer?
But Boatloads of Camera Vans, static cameras, Motorcycle cameras, Car cameras the list goes on.
A64 to York and the East Coast, from Leeds, where I live, there are six, yes six vans every weekend .
In the morning they photograph cars going East.
People off to the coast to spend their money.
After lunchtime, all of the vans are then working Westbound.
Having a second go at the cars coming home.
How on Earth can you expect the public not to think there is not something Fishy going on.
Some of the sites used are very long safe stretches. Certainly not 'Accedent Spots'
They are hated by the General (Motorists) Public, some who have never broken the law but have, by accident hit the Dizzy speed of 35mph. Some of these NIPs drop in within 3 days.
Pretty Slick eh?
Even with reduced numbers of Police there are still an awfult lot more of them than there are cameras & camera vans etc.No Police to attend burglaries, or most other crimes. No Police stations,no real people to speak to.
101 doesn't answer?
But Boatloads of Camera Vans, static cameras, Motorcycle cameras, Car cameras the list goes on.
A64 to York and the East Coast, from Leeds, where I live, there are six, yes six vans every weekend .
In the morning they photograph cars going East.
People off to the coast to spend their money.
After lunchtime, all of the vans are then working Westbound.
Having a second go at the cars coming home.
How on Earth can you expect the public not to think there is not something Fishy going on.
Some of the sites used are very long safe stretches. Certainly not 'Accedent Spots'
They are hated by the General (Motorists) Public, some who have never broken the law but have, by accident hit the Dizzy speed of 35mph. Some of these NIPs drop in within 3 days.
Pretty Slick eh?
35mph in a 30mph is breaking the law, if you've done that you can't claim to have never broken the law (& I doubt anyone can claim to have never broken a law). However 35 in a 30 is low level offending.
Boosted LS1 said:
It's a money making scam and we all nowadays expect a fine/tax every few years. Civvies or police in vans are out to trap many a reasonable driver. I can't stand them. Lowest of the low in my book.
+1Enforcement of the speeding tax has got massively out of control in recent years. Back in the old days you might get pulled in and a brief talking to or a fine for doing very high speeds but now it is all about discouraging motoring and car use generally and by any means necessary. A production line of issuing tickets for such minor infractions as 35 in a 30 was implemented in the late 90s under Bliar and all this anti speeding hysteria is just another component in the war on the motorist.
Unfortunately this forum has also been taken over by Brake aficionados as will no doubt be evident by some of the responses on here.
Schmed said:
Boosted LS1 said:
It's a money making scam and we all nowadays expect a fine/tax every few years. Civvies or police in vans are out to trap many a reasonable driver. I can't stand them. Lowest of the low in my book.
+1Enforcement of the speeding tax has got massively out of control in recent years. Back in the old days you might get pulled in and a brief talking to or a fine for doing very high speeds but now it is all about discouraging motoring and car use generally and by any means necessary. A production line of issuing tickets for such minor infractions as 35 in a 30 was implemented in the late 90s under Bliar and all this anti speeding hysteria is just another component in the war on the motorist.
Unfortunately this forum has also been taken over by Brake aficionados as will no doubt be evident by some of the responses on here.
Speeding is an endorsable offence & only 6% of drivers have penalty points on their licences from any endorsable offences, not just speeding.
Schmed said:
+1
Enforcement of the speeding tax has got massively out of control in recent years. Back in the old days you might get pulled in and a brief talking to or a fine for doing very high speeds but now it is all about discouraging motoring and car use generally and by any means necessary. A production line of issuing tickets for such minor infractions as 35 in a 30 was implemented in the late 90s under Bliar and all this anti speeding hysteria is just another component in the war on the motorist.
Unfortunately this forum has also been taken over by Brake aficionados as will no doubt be evident by some of the responses on here.
Cant argue with this. They are even swopping out Camera's in my area with 'Better ones. Vulture cameras they are called!Enforcement of the speeding tax has got massively out of control in recent years. Back in the old days you might get pulled in and a brief talking to or a fine for doing very high speeds but now it is all about discouraging motoring and car use generally and by any means necessary. A production line of issuing tickets for such minor infractions as 35 in a 30 was implemented in the late 90s under Bliar and all this anti speeding hysteria is just another component in the war on the motorist.
Unfortunately this forum has also been taken over by Brake aficionados as will no doubt be evident by some of the responses on here.
They seem to find money to do this.
Nibbles_bits said:
Boosted LS1 said:
It's a money making scam and we all nowadays expect a fine/tax every few years. Civvies or police in vans are out to trap many a reasonable driver. I can't stand them. Lowest of the low in my book.
Can I ask why you think they're out to "trap drivers"?You, as the driver can only get fined if you're speeding.
(a) a lot are in locations which aren't accident blackspots, whilst blackspots which aren't likely to make much money have no cameras
(b) manipulation of speed limits to be artificially low
(c) Locations where drivers' speed might creep up slightly (especially in 20s and 30s)
Examples from round here:
A camera half way down a very steep hill in a 30, facing downhill. Very easy to creep up to 35.
A camera half-hidden behind a road sign on a rural DC that goes into a 50 limit from 70 for no apparent reason
A regular camera van location, hidden round a corner and trained on the exact point that a NSL turns into a 30, despite the village that the 30 is protecting still being half a mile away.
Yeah, you still shouldn't get caught. But you can see why people think it's cynical.
vonhosen said:
Schmed said:
Boosted LS1 said:
It's a money making scam and we all nowadays expect a fine/tax every few years. Civvies or police in vans are out to trap many a reasonable driver. I can't stand them. Lowest of the low in my book.
+1Enforcement of the speeding tax has got massively out of control in recent years. Back in the old days you might get pulled in and a brief talking to or a fine for doing very high speeds but now it is all about discouraging motoring and car use generally and by any means necessary. A production line of issuing tickets for such minor infractions as 35 in a 30 was implemented in the late 90s under Bliar and all this anti speeding hysteria is just another component in the war on the motorist.
Unfortunately this forum has also been taken over by Brake aficionados as will no doubt be evident by some of the responses on here.
Speeding is an endorsable offence & only 6% of drivers have penalty points on their licences from any endorsable offences, not just speeding.
I think we’ve covered this previously. Is that 6% of total licence holders or 6% of people who actually drive regularly ..?
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