Lease variation - self managed company, recommend solicitor?

[TonyRPH]

The initial message was deleted from this topic on 20 May 2022 at 17:07

[trevalvole]

Are you also looking to extend the term of the lease?

[trevalvole]

TonyRPH said:

trevalvole said:

Are you also looking to extend the term of the lease?

There is no term to the lease as such (which I suppose doesn't really make it a lease) it more a 'rules and conditions' document than a lease as such.

We (self-managed flats) recently undertook a lease extension. That was £600 inc VAT per flat without a mortgage and £600 plus VAT for those with. The lease extension document, though, was based on a legal template and I presume much of the work was done by clerks, not the solicitor, whereas it looks like you are after something bespoke. I'm not sure I can recommend the solicitor concerned, so I won't.

One thing to watch out for is anything (this is the case for a lease extension) that involves the surrender of the existing lease and a re-grant. This is because the surrender, which is viewed as a disposal, could create a CGT liability for those who aren't exempt.

Also, I presume all the leaseholders (including any changes of leaseholder while this is progressing) are 100% behind this initiative, as I guess everyone would have to sign up for the changes to take effect.

[trevalvole]

TonyRPH said:

I would have thought that any document is bespoke? Because surely there isn't a one size fits all type of agreement for everyone?

Ours simply states things such as the responsibilities of the management company to the owners, and the owners responsibility to the management company.

It also covers such things as repairs (responsibilities of both owner and management company) and lays out a few ground rules regarding behaviour (this is more to cover us as there are two rented flats in the block, and previously we've had issues with anti-social behaviour).

So in essence, it's to let flat owners know what the management company expects of them, and in turn what they can expect from the management company.

All quite straightforward really - however we just want to ensure that the legal terms used are correct, and that our terms are enforceable.

We are also self managed by the way.

No, not all of them are bespoke. For a lease extension they just plug a few details into a WORD template and for the unchanged detail just refer to the previous lease. I fully expect that there are templates for whole leasehold agreements - it must be more risky and expensive to start from scratch. Our leases cover similar subjects to yours. I suspect that if you revise your leases you will need to amend their land registrations.

[trevalvole]

TonyRPH said:

That's an interesting comment (in bold) because as far as I know - in recent years (the last 10 at least) - I don't believe the agreement was ever given to any new flat owners (we certainly didn't get a copy and we bought ours early last year (2020).

I'm unsure as to whether this should be called a 'lease' agreement!

With no lease term etc, I wonder if what you have is something like a Commonhold https://www.law.ox.ac.uk/research-and-subject-grou...

[Ken Figenus]

I manage something like this. Not sure how you can change a lease without consent of all mind - big legal job requiring consent. In fact just did that granting us al 999 years and a nice bonus when selling :-) Do you all hold the share of freehold in a company? If so sounds like you are adapting the rules to be part of that company? Or is it a non legal doc to bind people to principles of shared ownership when they first buy a flat?

I've learnt tons here when buying the freehold - the hard way - as solicitors aren't geared for a small bunch of leaseholder/freeholder really. Happy to help with what I can.

[Wings]

As a leaseholder and director of a self management company, I was once approached by a solicitor acting for a potential leaseholder, for a variation of a Lease on an intended purchase of that same Lease. I and the other directors, both due to the administration costs and the time involved, informing Land Registry, mortgage providers etc. etc., refused the request.

I was then, and since, always been grateful to the Leasehold Advisory Service for their online, and telephone advice services. Naomi Raymond is a solicitor with the same, and holds vast experience in all aspects of property law. I am listing below a link to their webinar dated December 2016, the same covering aspects of variation of lease, together with case laws etc.

As a footnote, copies of Leases etc can be downloaded from the Land Registry web site, copies of Article of Association etc. for the management company, can be downloaded from the Companies house web site.

https://www.lease-advice.org/webinar/variation-of-...