Possession of sword
Discussion
Background is that in 2004 a film fan might have bought a cheap, blunt replica of Bill's katana sword from the Kill Bill films and had it on display in their home, and then one day put it in a loft and forgot about it.
That person might have recently become aware that the law changed a few years ago making mere ownership of such a thing illegal, then realised with horror that it's still in the loft it was left in.
The questions are:
1) If through no fault of their own the owner was simply unaware of the change in the law, but has now become aware, how should they proceed?
2) If they hand it in to a police station for destruction could they be prosecuted for possession and transporting it in public? .
3) Have I really read the law right and is owning a blunt ornamental replica of a sword actually a crime? It seems a bit of an arse if so, when you can legally buy a sharp one if it's made using traditional methods.
4) Would it be correct to assume that if the blade was removed and cut in half with an angle grinder, then it is no longer illegal to own and throw away because it has stopped being a curved blade over 51cm long?
5) Can the owner then confidently fix the handle to the scabbard and keep it on display without a blade fitted, safe in the knowledge that they are no longer in breach of any laws?
Edit to add: I can't edit the spelling mistake in the title. Don't crucify me.
That person might have recently become aware that the law changed a few years ago making mere ownership of such a thing illegal, then realised with horror that it's still in the loft it was left in.
The questions are:
1) If through no fault of their own the owner was simply unaware of the change in the law, but has now become aware, how should they proceed?
2) If they hand it in to a police station for destruction could they be prosecuted for possession and transporting it in public? .
3) Have I really read the law right and is owning a blunt ornamental replica of a sword actually a crime? It seems a bit of an arse if so, when you can legally buy a sharp one if it's made using traditional methods.
4) Would it be correct to assume that if the blade was removed and cut in half with an angle grinder, then it is no longer illegal to own and throw away because it has stopped being a curved blade over 51cm long?
5) Can the owner then confidently fix the handle to the scabbard and keep it on display without a blade fitted, safe in the knowledge that they are no longer in breach of any laws?
Edit to add: I can't edit the spelling mistake in the title. Don't crucify me.
Edited by BS62 on Wednesday 21st September 11:28
https://www.gov.uk/buying-carrying-knives
As far as I can tell, it would fall under the gloriously vague "Sword" - "A curved blade of 50 centimetres or over, based on the straight-line distance from the top of the handle to the tip of the blade."
I mean, when it's a blunt replica I'd have thought it was an ornament not a sword, but I suppose that's where my third question comes from really..!
As far as I can tell, it would fall under the gloriously vague "Sword" - "A curved blade of 50 centimetres or over, based on the straight-line distance from the top of the handle to the tip of the blade."
I mean, when it's a blunt replica I'd have thought it was an ornament not a sword, but I suppose that's where my third question comes from really..!
BS62 said:
Background is that in 2004 a film fan might have bought a cheap, blunt replica of Bill's katana sword from the Kill Bill films and had it on display in their home, and then one day put it in a loft and forgot about it.
That person might have recently become aware that the law changed a few years ago making mere ownership of such a thing illegal, then realised with horror that it's still in the loft it was left in.
The questions are:
1) If through no fault of their own the owner was simply unaware of the change in the law, but has now become aware, how should they proceed?
2) If they hand it in to a police station for destruction could they be prosecuted for possession and transporting it in public? .
3) Have I really read the law right and is owning a blunt ornamental replica of a sword actually a crime? It seems a bit of an arse if so, when you can legally buy a sharp one if it's made using traditional methods.
4) Would it be correct to assume that if the blade was removed and cut in half with an angle grinder, then it is no longer illegal to own and throw away because it has stopped being a curved blade over 51cm long?
5) Can the owner then confidently fix the handle to the scabbard and keep it on display without a blade fitted, safe in the knowledge that they are no longer in breach of any laws?
2) In theory, yes. If that's the plan, I would suggest some liaison with the non-emergency police, and not carrying it across town undisguised.That person might have recently become aware that the law changed a few years ago making mere ownership of such a thing illegal, then realised with horror that it's still in the loft it was left in.
The questions are:
1) If through no fault of their own the owner was simply unaware of the change in the law, but has now become aware, how should they proceed?
2) If they hand it in to a police station for destruction could they be prosecuted for possession and transporting it in public? .
3) Have I really read the law right and is owning a blunt ornamental replica of a sword actually a crime? It seems a bit of an arse if so, when you can legally buy a sharp one if it's made using traditional methods.
4) Would it be correct to assume that if the blade was removed and cut in half with an angle grinder, then it is no longer illegal to own and throw away because it has stopped being a curved blade over 51cm long?
5) Can the owner then confidently fix the handle to the scabbard and keep it on display without a blade fitted, safe in the knowledge that they are no longer in breach of any laws?
3) Yup. Silly, isn't it?
4) If the blade is less than 51cm, that would be my interpretation, though for the avoidance of doubt, I'd be tempted to make a few more cuts, and make the throwing away more subtle. I'd be amazed if someone finding a chopped up sword in bits could persuade Plod to launch an investigation
5) That's the sort of thing that needs testing in Court. You might not want to be the person that tests it
If you're going down that path, and have an angle grinder, then chopping the blade off and gluing the stub into the scabbard seems more sensible...
If you have a sword you want to hand in then phone non emergency to say so. A local officer might collect it as one option. Your local neighbourhood team could be asked to pick it up or meet you at a station.
If they ask you to take it in then arrange a date/ time and police station. Cover it up and go there.
Bear in mind the police station may not have anyone there if they were called away but there should be an intercom to speak to the ops/ call handlers so it can be sorted.
That was how we dealt with it when I was in the ops room.
If they ask you to take it in then arrange a date/ time and police station. Cover it up and go there.
Bear in mind the police station may not have anyone there if they were called away but there should be an intercom to speak to the ops/ call handlers so it can be sorted.
That was how we dealt with it when I was in the ops room.
Offensive weapons act changed it all for modern swords
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-off...
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-off...
Ziplobb said:
Offensive weapons act changed it all for modern swords
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-off...
Before then, all the drug dealers in my town were duelling with swords. You couldn't move for crackheads slapping each other with gloves and demanding satisfaction...https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-off...
In seriousness though, the intent of the law is to stop hoodlums stabbing and slashing at people with "zombie attack" knives. If you have ornamental swords suitably affixed to your walls, inside your house, and you are not someone who attracts the attention of law enforcement, then it's unlikely (although not impossible) that anything will ever come of it.
The key question I think is whether it's an "offensive weapon":
If it's not made to be an actual sword, but rather, and ornament, then maybe the legislation does not apply. But probably best seek proper legal advice on that.
CPS said:
Section 1(4) defines an offensive weapon as “any article made or adapted for use for causing injury to the person or intended by the person having it with him for such use by him or by some other person”.
CPS ArticleIf it's not made to be an actual sword, but rather, and ornament, then maybe the legislation does not apply. But probably best seek proper legal advice on that.
Amendments to the act were made recently - there are certain items you can no longer possess - even in private - hers an extract. Item r will cover the OP's sword
q) a straight, side-handled or friction-lock truncheon (sometimes known as a baton)
r) a sword with a curved blade of 50 centimetres or over in length; and for the purposes of this sub-paragraph, the length of the blade shall be the straight line distance from the top of the handle to the tip of the blade’
s) the weapon sometimes known as a “zombie knife”, “zombie killer knife” or “zombie slayer knife”, being a blade with — (i) a cutting edge; (ii) a serrated edge; and (iii) images or words (whether on the blade or handle) that suggest that it is to be used for the purpose of violence
q) a straight, side-handled or friction-lock truncheon (sometimes known as a baton)
r) a sword with a curved blade of 50 centimetres or over in length; and for the purposes of this sub-paragraph, the length of the blade shall be the straight line distance from the top of the handle to the tip of the blade’
s) the weapon sometimes known as a “zombie knife”, “zombie killer knife” or “zombie slayer knife”, being a blade with — (i) a cutting edge; (ii) a serrated edge; and (iii) images or words (whether on the blade or handle) that suggest that it is to be used for the purpose of violence
Please check the www.blades-uk.com website for all the legislation and exemptions.
Oceanrower said:
So every antique or historical sword in every private or public collection or museum is now illegal?
That’s nuts!
No. There are a ton of exemptions...That’s nuts!
Anything made before 1954.
Anything made at any time by traditional methods by hand.
Of historical importance.
To be used for historical re-enactments.
To be used for sporting activities.
For use in film and theatre.
Possessed on behalf of a museum or gallery, or lent or hired by a museum or gallery for cultural, artistic or educational purposes.
Possessed for religious reasons.
I wouldn't want to be the test case for whether a replica, decorative sword falls under the definition of an offensive weapon, but neither would I lose sleep over one fixed to my wall or up in the loft.
Bigends said:
Is it ever likely to come to the attention of Police? If not, forget about it or just shorten it.
That can be poor advice.The police might come around for a completely unrelated matter.
Somebody might come into your house and notice the illegal item.
I know people who've had to deal with both of the above, despite in both cases the items in question actually being either benign or completely legal to own. You just don't need the police turning up to argue the point.
Common sense does not apply any more.
What will happen if the drug gangs start attacking one another with garden tools?
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