Wrongly reported by member of public - what to do?
Discussion
I received a letter the other week from Surrey Police, to tell me that a car with my number plate had been involved in an "incident" at 16:44 on Monday the whateverth of October on a certain Plough Road, and that I was being investigated for exceeding 30mph in a 30mph zone and driving without due care and attention.
I returned the enclosed form, filled in with my name and address etc., and a week later received a request for my license and insurance certificate, but still no charge, nor any evidence of any wrongdoing. I duly sent my documents off, and wondered to myself why they were "investigating" rather than just going ahead and charging me with something.
So I thought back to the day concerned and wondered, did I hit a pedestrian or another car? I certainly didn't recall any toddlers ricocheting off my windscreen. So I thought, were there any cameras on that road to capture my heinous crime? No; that road is as devoid of cameras as a Michelle McManus press conference. So I thought, were there any police about? The result of my ponderance, again, was as Sunny Delight*.
So I thought to myself "Aha, in that case I must have been reported by a particularly zealous, community-spirited local old brick, or a stout fellow driver as concerned about my own safety as that of others around me!" Oh, how noble are we Britons - it fair near brought a tear to my eye.
Then I remembered that I don't actually drive down Plough Road on my way home from work - it is simply a road that I cross.
This confused me, I can tell you.
Later that morning as I sat on the kerb eating a bag of inflation-busting Space Raiders and waiting for the off-licence to open, three possibilities occurred to me, each more plausible than the last:
1. I sailed across the crossroads at over 30mph.
This particular crossroads is unsighted, so one has to creep tentatively forward in order not to have one's car smashed up by the seemingly endless parade of rebellious Rav4's and majestic Porsche Cayennes - the only vehicles hardy enough to traverse the treacherous smooth tarmac of the back roads of West Sussex - that travel along Plough Road. To speed across would be sheer madness...so I don't. I stop and wait (quite apart from that, it is rare that there is not a queue of traffic waiting to turn right or go straight on anyway).
Plausibility score: WMDs found in Iraq by Santa Claus
b. I accelerated from 0 to over 30mph over the width of a standard B Road.
Now, I drive a 2002 Merc 230 SLK, but I don't think that even the jaw-dropping acceleration of that wild animal is enough to propel me across the road at that speed from a standing start.
Plausibility score = Liam Gallagher and Damon Albarn making Christmas Number 1 with a duet of "I Got You Babe"
iii. I wasn't actually speeding, and someone has taken my number plate and reported me for nothing.
Plausibility score: Pope spotted wearing a funny hat
This, fair readers, is all that I can see has happened.
I don't know whether some other driver has taken offence at me having a flashier car than him, or whether some embittered local has decided to have a pop at a commuter using a public road that goes past his house, but I do know I haven't actually done anything wrong, in an "incident" where there is no photographic evidence of me having done anything wrong, and where no-one was hurt and no property was damaged.
So (with apologies for the lengthy preamble) has this sort of thing happened to anyone else? If so, what happened? And was there anything you could do about your time (and police time) being wasted sorting out someone maliciously reporting you for nothing?
*Fruitless
I returned the enclosed form, filled in with my name and address etc., and a week later received a request for my license and insurance certificate, but still no charge, nor any evidence of any wrongdoing. I duly sent my documents off, and wondered to myself why they were "investigating" rather than just going ahead and charging me with something.
So I thought back to the day concerned and wondered, did I hit a pedestrian or another car? I certainly didn't recall any toddlers ricocheting off my windscreen. So I thought, were there any cameras on that road to capture my heinous crime? No; that road is as devoid of cameras as a Michelle McManus press conference. So I thought, were there any police about? The result of my ponderance, again, was as Sunny Delight*.
So I thought to myself "Aha, in that case I must have been reported by a particularly zealous, community-spirited local old brick, or a stout fellow driver as concerned about my own safety as that of others around me!" Oh, how noble are we Britons - it fair near brought a tear to my eye.
Then I remembered that I don't actually drive down Plough Road on my way home from work - it is simply a road that I cross.
This confused me, I can tell you.
Later that morning as I sat on the kerb eating a bag of inflation-busting Space Raiders and waiting for the off-licence to open, three possibilities occurred to me, each more plausible than the last:
1. I sailed across the crossroads at over 30mph.
This particular crossroads is unsighted, so one has to creep tentatively forward in order not to have one's car smashed up by the seemingly endless parade of rebellious Rav4's and majestic Porsche Cayennes - the only vehicles hardy enough to traverse the treacherous smooth tarmac of the back roads of West Sussex - that travel along Plough Road. To speed across would be sheer madness...so I don't. I stop and wait (quite apart from that, it is rare that there is not a queue of traffic waiting to turn right or go straight on anyway).
Plausibility score: WMDs found in Iraq by Santa Claus
b. I accelerated from 0 to over 30mph over the width of a standard B Road.
Now, I drive a 2002 Merc 230 SLK, but I don't think that even the jaw-dropping acceleration of that wild animal is enough to propel me across the road at that speed from a standing start.
Plausibility score = Liam Gallagher and Damon Albarn making Christmas Number 1 with a duet of "I Got You Babe"
iii. I wasn't actually speeding, and someone has taken my number plate and reported me for nothing.
Plausibility score: Pope spotted wearing a funny hat
This, fair readers, is all that I can see has happened.
I don't know whether some other driver has taken offence at me having a flashier car than him, or whether some embittered local has decided to have a pop at a commuter using a public road that goes past his house, but I do know I haven't actually done anything wrong, in an "incident" where there is no photographic evidence of me having done anything wrong, and where no-one was hurt and no property was damaged.
So (with apologies for the lengthy preamble) has this sort of thing happened to anyone else? If so, what happened? And was there anything you could do about your time (and police time) being wasted sorting out someone maliciously reporting you for nothing?
*Fruitless
Why if you think that you did 'nothing wrong' did you fill in the form and return these items back to Surrey police?
If I had not doing anything wrong, or even been on that 'said' road, then I'd have been on the blower, asking what this was all about...surely you have the right to know?
Has the fact that you have filled in this paperwork, 'suggested' to the BiB, that you may be guilty of some misdemeanour?
If I had not doing anything wrong, or even been on that 'said' road, then I'd have been on the blower, asking what this was all about...surely you have the right to know?
Has the fact that you have filled in this paperwork, 'suggested' to the BiB, that you may be guilty of some misdemeanour?
satman said:
Why if you think that you did 'nothing wrong' did you fill in the form and return these items back to Surrey police?
If I had not doing anything wrong, or even been on that 'said' road, then I'd have been on the blower, asking what this was all about...surely you have the right to know?
Has the fact that you have filled in this paperwork, 'suggested' to the BiB, that you may be guilty of some misdemeanour?
I don't remember the form exactly, and I don't have it to hand, but I think it said that failure to return the form would incur some kind of nastiness.
I always thought if you were requested to do something by the police you should do it (within reason); I thought if I went along with it they'd work out they had nothing on me and it'd just fizzle out. I assumed that being belligerent wouldn't do me any good. Plus I don't actually know my rights where this kind of thing is concerned. Can you help?
>> Edited by Ecks Ridgehead on Thursday 13th October 21:18
Lovely bit of prose there! 
Have to agree though - would be demanding to know just what I was supposed to have done. These things have a habit of escalating and the next thing you know you get your docs back with a demand for 500 quid and 6 points on your licence.
Find out what's going on now.
And given how many "sorry sir, no witnesses to your car being keyed" threads are running at the moment I will be upset if the police have decided that they don't need to worry about little things like witnesses, just untrained opinion...
>> Edited by NiceCupOfTea on Thursday 13th October 21:18
Have to agree though - would be demanding to know just what I was supposed to have done. These things have a habit of escalating and the next thing you know you get your docs back with a demand for 500 quid and 6 points on your licence.
Find out what's going on now.
And given how many "sorry sir, no witnesses to your car being keyed" threads are running at the moment I will be upset if the police have decided that they don't need to worry about little things like witnesses, just untrained opinion...
>> Edited by NiceCupOfTea on Thursday 13th October 21:18
That first 'bit of paper' that you signed and sent back can you remember if it had reference to Section 172 Road Traffic Act 1988 asking to name driver of your cars Reg.No? and a bit of paper to the effect that the driver of motor car ABC 123 of which you are the Reg Keeper is being reported for the consdieration of the question of prosecution for exceeding a speed limit and for driving without due care and attention or reasonmable consideration for other persons using the road. Was it received by you within 14 days of the date of the alleged incident?.
Noooo....... we don't want to know......... we know what it means.........
Your a patient man but time now to do some digging. You may wish to consider contacting the Police Station/Officer involved (should be on the correspondence) to find out what it is all about without admitting anything other that the Reg No refered to you car and its details. Does it match that reported involved in the incident?
Once you have the details of the alleged complaint your method of attack should become apparent.
dvd
Noooo....... we don't want to know......... we know what it means.........
Your a patient man but time now to do some digging. You may wish to consider contacting the Police Station/Officer involved (should be on the correspondence) to find out what it is all about without admitting anything other that the Reg No refered to you car and its details. Does it match that reported involved in the incident?
Once you have the details of the alleged complaint your method of attack should become apparent.
dvd
satman said:
Why if you think that you did 'nothing wrong' did you fill in the form and return these items back to Surrey police?
If I had not doing anything wrong, or even been on that 'said' road, then I'd have been on the blower, asking what this was all about...surely you have the right to know?
Has the fact that you have filled in this paperwork, 'suggested' to the BiB, that you may be guilty of some misdemeanour?
I agree. I have been unfortunately been on the opposite end of false allogations, unfortunately by police officers, and the first thing I did was protest against the charges quite strongly.
I would contact them, as I believe that to gather information about you they should have charged you with something.
It may be the situation that a local busybody has exaggerated greatly about 'the raft of fast cars outside my house' and got your plate. Perhaps the police have felt that they had a moral obligation to investigate.
If it were me, I would not stand for it. I would turn up at the place I had sent my driving licence to and demand that:
It was given back,
That I am allowed to see the case file which has been brought against me,
and obviously vociferously defend your innocence and maybe even;
imply that malicious allogations had been made against you.
That should sort it. A very interesting case though, I have never heard one like this, please let us know how it goes!
Just dug out the first letter. It said that "proceedings are being considered against the driver of...", but later, in big bold letters It does NOT necessarily mean that a prosecution will follow.
I saw those big bold letters and thought I was just helping them out, and that they'd find out in due course that I hadn't done anything.
Was I being naive in being helpful and co-operative?
I saw those big bold letters and thought I was just helping them out, and that they'd find out in due course that I hadn't done anything.
Was I being naive in being helpful and co-operative?
Second letter asks me to send the documents in order to "facilitate prompt investigation of this matter."
I just thought that they'd end up wasting their time finding out it was nothing, rather than me having to waste my time explaining it to them.
Am I really so hopelessly naive?
I think I'll give them a call tomorrow...!
I just thought that they'd end up wasting their time finding out it was nothing, rather than me having to waste my time explaining it to them.
Am I really so hopelessly naive?
I think I'll give them a call tomorrow...!
Not personnally experienced this but a friend has had a similar problem. She received a congestion charge for a day she was in school teaching in the Shires not London. It turned out that a.n.other driving the same type of car as her had cloned her license plate. The police became involved after a second incident involving this cloned car occurred. She has now changed to a different countries plate but continues to have problems with the old plate. Despite the DVLA being notified of her change of plate and letters from employers stating she was at work at the time, the computer system continues to churn out all manner of driving offences. Get it sorted with the Police asap before you find yourself getting tickets for all sorts of stuff you didn't do!! Good luck.
pbsaxman said:Personally I would love it if I had some proof of a cloned plate. "Get out of jail free card" springs to mind. So long as there is reasonable doubt, then camera convictions can be wriggled out of, I would have thought....
Despite the DVLA being notified of her change of plate and letters from employers stating she was at work at the time, the computer system continues to churn out all manner of driving offences.
streaky said:
I wondered why Surrey Police were contacting you in reference to something that happened in West Sussex - since that's where you appear to describe Plough Road as being located ... or did I miss something? - Streaky
Artistic licence...or me not really knowing where the boundary twixt Surrey and Sussex is...
Bit of fog lifted now so to calm justinp1 et al...
Plod on duty wherever and received complaint (if speeding involved from 2 people - remember corroboration)and which outlines also piece of bad driving that appears to infringe S 3 RTA 88 due care.
Maybe problem in arranging statements from complainant and his witnesses in 14 days. Maybe another sections area where papers may well have to be passed to and which may temprary disappear in the sea of paperwork.
Now you all are aware that if proceedings are to be taken in the future then if Plod doesn't serve NOIP then if the complaint is genuine and backed up with hard evidence he cannot take it further to Court. Exit disgruntled complainant who talks to his friend who fires off a tirade against Plod on Pistonheads.
As stated above the fact that a person gets a NOIP does not mean that he WILL be prosecuted. It is to draw his attention to a matter so that he can recall the incident.
No doubt Plod will be working away gathering his evidence and should in the fullness of time approach the person to whom the complaint is addressed to get his version of events. In my day this usually occured
within days but what with pressures from other sources seems now can take weeks. To cut this time I would be making noises to find out what is happening.
I cannot see the relevance of asking for Driving Licence and Insurance to be sent to Plod by post unless this is a new way of dealing with matters by paper only. Tis usual to send DL in if Court case pending and points to be awarded which does not seem to be the case here.
I feel sure that if whoever is dealing came on and gave their side we would all be re assured....
dvd
Plod on duty wherever and received complaint (if speeding involved from 2 people - remember corroboration)and which outlines also piece of bad driving that appears to infringe S 3 RTA 88 due care.
Maybe problem in arranging statements from complainant and his witnesses in 14 days. Maybe another sections area where papers may well have to be passed to and which may temprary disappear in the sea of paperwork.
Now you all are aware that if proceedings are to be taken in the future then if Plod doesn't serve NOIP then if the complaint is genuine and backed up with hard evidence he cannot take it further to Court. Exit disgruntled complainant who talks to his friend who fires off a tirade against Plod on Pistonheads.
As stated above the fact that a person gets a NOIP does not mean that he WILL be prosecuted. It is to draw his attention to a matter so that he can recall the incident.
No doubt Plod will be working away gathering his evidence and should in the fullness of time approach the person to whom the complaint is addressed to get his version of events. In my day this usually occured
within days but what with pressures from other sources seems now can take weeks. To cut this time I would be making noises to find out what is happening.
I cannot see the relevance of asking for Driving Licence and Insurance to be sent to Plod by post unless this is a new way of dealing with matters by paper only. Tis usual to send DL in if Court case pending and points to be awarded which does not seem to be the case here.
I feel sure that if whoever is dealing came on and gave their side we would all be re assured....
dvd
So, before I phone them I want to know what I am and am not within my rights to do. I tried to find out a bit on the internet last night, but I couldn't find much. Just a bit on NIPs and things. I did find out on one website that apparently the moon landings were fake, though. Amazing.
Anyway, the "incident" took place more than 14 days ago, and they haven't issued a NIP - does that mean that I am not going to be charged with anything? And if so, can I simply refuse to do anything else? I mean, I don't have to help them to investigate me if they have no evidence of any wrongdoing and they are not going to charge me, do I?
This really is a waste of police time and resources, time and resources that would clearly be better spent upholding our precious freedoms by hauling cantankerous 80-year-old Germans out of open political conferences.
Anyway, the "incident" took place more than 14 days ago, and they haven't issued a NIP - does that mean that I am not going to be charged with anything? And if so, can I simply refuse to do anything else? I mean, I don't have to help them to investigate me if they have no evidence of any wrongdoing and they are not going to charge me, do I?
This really is a waste of police time and resources, time and resources that would clearly be better spent upholding our precious freedoms by hauling cantankerous 80-year-old Germans out of open political conferences.
Your post E.R. of yesterday 2122 indicates to me that piece of paper you mention was in fact a NOIP and should have indicated time, date and place where offences supposed to have been committed.
Had I been in the same situation that you find yourself then by now I, and from above like others, would be contacting whoever sent the NOIP to find out what the allegation against me is and in fact was it my vehicle and whether or not someone is going to come and interview you.
I note from the above post that it appears you are no longer a young Sir and like me maybe prone to senior moments so maybe better to get a young wippersnapper in the family to make enquiries and make notes on your behalf. he won't be able to drop you in the more for he will not be aware of the incident....
Dont forget that he who asserts (the complainant) must prove...
We all now wait with baited breath the outcome of your endeavours.
GO FOR IT as Henry Root would say.
dvd
PS. Just read your Blogspot ER and note you are of the
same persuation as Captain Blyth:
"50 lashes Mr Christian"
"But Sir the man is dead"
"Carry out my orders."
Don't tell me that you have cast your line and I have snapped hook line and sinker. Is it all real or are you trawling for info for a new tombe.
dvd agin
>> Edited by Dwight VanDriver on Friday 14th October 09:04
Had I been in the same situation that you find yourself then by now I, and from above like others, would be contacting whoever sent the NOIP to find out what the allegation against me is and in fact was it my vehicle and whether or not someone is going to come and interview you.
I note from the above post that it appears you are no longer a young Sir and like me maybe prone to senior moments so maybe better to get a young wippersnapper in the family to make enquiries and make notes on your behalf. he won't be able to drop you in the more for he will not be aware of the incident....
Dont forget that he who asserts (the complainant) must prove...
We all now wait with baited breath the outcome of your endeavours.
GO FOR IT as Henry Root would say.
dvd
PS. Just read your Blogspot ER and note you are of the
same persuation as Captain Blyth:
"50 lashes Mr Christian"
"But Sir the man is dead"
"Carry out my orders."
Don't tell me that you have cast your line and I have snapped hook line and sinker. Is it all real or are you trawling for info for a new tombe.
dvd agin
>> Edited by Dwight VanDriver on Friday 14th October 09:04
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