Threat of a non molestation order Divorce
Discussion
Hi! My wife took my children from the family home to the in-laws while I was working at our home on 19th aug. I received emails from her and her solicitor saying that she was divorcing me and that I should get out of the jointly owned home within 48 hrs otherwise NMO and occupancy orders would be raised citing controlling and coercive behaviour. I don’t recognise this. We’ve had arguments but certainly nothing physical and she says it’s the way I make her feel stressed, anxious and threatened. She probably has written things down over the years as I believe she has been planning this for some time, but I don't think there is anything bad. Sure we've had our disagreements and arguments over the years but nothing crazy.
I sought legal advice and delayed moving out. However as the days rolled by and she refused to come home, one of my children had migraines and was stressed, running out of clothes and was starting a new school the following week. For the sake of my kids I agreed to leave the home around a week after the original threats were made. We drew up some terms and conditions between us (not legally binding) but basically me agreeing to leave the home by 27 Aug and being able to contact my wife wife on WhatsApp only for collecting belongings and access to kids.
Roll fwds 12 days to today and rather than pacifying and de escalating the situation, my wife has made it quite difficult to see my kids (1hr in 2 weeks down the park with her and them), removed other pre agreed times to punish me and said the kids only want to see me once every 3 weeks. Then she’s asking me to do x3 transport runs per week for their extra curricular activities which I’m fine with but seems unfair to reduce proper parenting time. She says they’re too busy at other times.
She also moved a lot of my stuff out of the home into the garage already. I asked my solicitor whether I can return home and he says yes I’m not breaking any law. He says go back home when she is out and move back in. But im concerned that this will escalate things and she will continue down the threat of nmo etc. however on the flip side by her removing me from the home she has also massive control over me and will use this in negotiations as she knows I’m suffering being apart from the kids and living in less than ideal accommodation.
Help what should I do? Should I try to move back and risk her wrath? Or am I better off capitulating and being screwed? What would you do?
I sought legal advice and delayed moving out. However as the days rolled by and she refused to come home, one of my children had migraines and was stressed, running out of clothes and was starting a new school the following week. For the sake of my kids I agreed to leave the home around a week after the original threats were made. We drew up some terms and conditions between us (not legally binding) but basically me agreeing to leave the home by 27 Aug and being able to contact my wife wife on WhatsApp only for collecting belongings and access to kids.
Roll fwds 12 days to today and rather than pacifying and de escalating the situation, my wife has made it quite difficult to see my kids (1hr in 2 weeks down the park with her and them), removed other pre agreed times to punish me and said the kids only want to see me once every 3 weeks. Then she’s asking me to do x3 transport runs per week for their extra curricular activities which I’m fine with but seems unfair to reduce proper parenting time. She says they’re too busy at other times.
She also moved a lot of my stuff out of the home into the garage already. I asked my solicitor whether I can return home and he says yes I’m not breaking any law. He says go back home when she is out and move back in. But im concerned that this will escalate things and she will continue down the threat of nmo etc. however on the flip side by her removing me from the home she has also massive control over me and will use this in negotiations as she knows I’m suffering being apart from the kids and living in less than ideal accommodation.
Help what should I do? Should I try to move back and risk her wrath? Or am I better off capitulating and being screwed? What would you do?
Cheers. Just wondered if anyone else had a similar experience and what their course of action was and the outcome.
I'm not disagreeing with my solicitor in that I'm not breaking any laws, but does this set me up to fall? She will most likely pack her bags and leave with the kids making me out to be the bad guy. I get it, it's her choice / her reaction. I'm not forcing her to do anything, but she is forcing me. So perhaps that it is the answer.
I'm not disagreeing with my solicitor in that I'm not breaking any laws, but does this set me up to fall? She will most likely pack her bags and leave with the kids making me out to be the bad guy. I get it, it's her choice / her reaction. I'm not forcing her to do anything, but she is forcing me. So perhaps that it is the answer.
Oh, one constructive point - document everything. Emails, messages, calls, everything. Create an dossier.
And change your passwords in case she has them.
If you have any joint credit cards, accounts, etc then talk to the bank about what checks you can put on them, if any.
Set up a credit score monitor - she has enough info about you to apply for loans etc.
See if you can agree one single point - this is about you and her - a mutual line for the kids, no "weaponising."
And change your passwords in case she has them.
If you have any joint credit cards, accounts, etc then talk to the bank about what checks you can put on them, if any.
Set up a credit score monitor - she has enough info about you to apply for loans etc.
See if you can agree one single point - this is about you and her - a mutual line for the kids, no "weaponising."
pb63 said:
Yes I could afford to stay somewhere else but not indefinitely, but this doesnt solve the issue. She's moved me out under threat of court orders. How successful are these?? I continue to pay for everything...
At some stage it looks like you will be moving out.So if it was me I'd be sorting myself out and getting on the front foot with your own solicitor to agree proper access to the children and start setting the financial expectations going forward.
It's a s
t situation and if she already threatened a court order then why run the risk when you can retreat in the short term to move forward from firmer ground?It's difficult when your own living arrangements are suddenly up in the air and your stress load is high, but I would be seeking advice about formalising children's arrangements sooner rather than later. How old are they? It's not reasonable for her to dictate that you'll act as a taxi driver but only spend a short amount of quality time with them every 3 weeks. The risk is of existing arrangements getting set in stone.
Keep your contact absolutely clean, brief, child focussed and documented (WhatsApp only as agreed) as another poster said above. Anything you say wrong now will be used against you so just don't go there.
If she's been planning this for some time as you suspect, she'll be executing a well-planned strategy most likely leaning on support from a family and friends' network, whilst you're reacting to events as they unfold in real time. Something to remind yourself if she seems unreasonably calm and collected whilst you feel like a headless chicken.
I started a thread 10 years ago in my matrimonial car crash and it was valuable to me. Of course you don't just act blindly on the advice of strangers, but the quality of solicitor advice varies enormously too. I wouldn't be trying to move back in personally - you moved out to de-escalate so don't re-escalate. I think your solicitor is advising you on what you're legally entitled to do there; it might be strategically disastrous. Good luck.
Keep your contact absolutely clean, brief, child focussed and documented (WhatsApp only as agreed) as another poster said above. Anything you say wrong now will be used against you so just don't go there.
If she's been planning this for some time as you suspect, she'll be executing a well-planned strategy most likely leaning on support from a family and friends' network, whilst you're reacting to events as they unfold in real time. Something to remind yourself if she seems unreasonably calm and collected whilst you feel like a headless chicken.
I started a thread 10 years ago in my matrimonial car crash and it was valuable to me. Of course you don't just act blindly on the advice of strangers, but the quality of solicitor advice varies enormously too. I wouldn't be trying to move back in personally - you moved out to de-escalate so don't re-escalate. I think your solicitor is advising you on what you're legally entitled to do there; it might be strategically disastrous. Good luck.
theboss said:
It's difficult when your own living arrangements are suddenly up in the air and your stress load is high, but I would be seeking advice about formalising children's arrangements sooner rather than later. How old are they? It's not reasonable for her to dictate that you'll act as a taxi driver but only spend a short amount of quality time with them every 3 weeks. The risk is of existing arrangements getting set in stone.
Keep your contact absolutely clean, brief, child focussed and documented (WhatsApp only as agreed) as another poster said above. Anything you say wrong now will be used against you so just don't go there.
If she's been planning this for some time as you suspect, she'll be executing a well-planned strategy most likely leaning on support from a family and friends' network, whilst you're reacting to events as they unfold in real time. Something to remind yourself if she seems unreasonably calm and collected whilst you feel like a headless chicken.
I started a thread 10 years ago in my matrimonial car crash and it was valuable to me. Of course you don't just act blindly on the advice of strangers, but the quality of solicitor advice varies enormously too. I wouldn't be trying to move back in personally - you moved out to de-escalate so don't re-escalate. I think your solicitor is advising you on what you're legally entitled to do there; it might be strategically disastrous. Good luck.
Thanks that's good advice. Kids are 11 and 14. Yes agree re my solicitor's advice. It does feel a bit extreme, but given how ive been treated with ultimatums and threats which I don't agree with I feel why should I make her life easy when she's turning thumb screws on me everyday and weaponising and alienating me from my children and then expecting me to work her schedules when it suits her. Feels totally unfair.Keep your contact absolutely clean, brief, child focussed and documented (WhatsApp only as agreed) as another poster said above. Anything you say wrong now will be used against you so just don't go there.
If she's been planning this for some time as you suspect, she'll be executing a well-planned strategy most likely leaning on support from a family and friends' network, whilst you're reacting to events as they unfold in real time. Something to remind yourself if she seems unreasonably calm and collected whilst you feel like a headless chicken.
I started a thread 10 years ago in my matrimonial car crash and it was valuable to me. Of course you don't just act blindly on the advice of strangers, but the quality of solicitor advice varies enormously too. I wouldn't be trying to move back in personally - you moved out to de-escalate so don't re-escalate. I think your solicitor is advising you on what you're legally entitled to do there; it might be strategically disastrous. Good luck.
MDMA . said:
Anecdotal, but this happened to a friend. He didn t move out. Said there was no proof and no order would be granted. Only you would know if she has the proof or not for an order to be granted. She can t just kick you out because she wants a divorce.
Thanks. I don't believe there is any substantial evidence. My solicitor has asked her solicitor to produce the evidence so we can substantiate it. Nothing has been produced to date. Everything the now ex has said is it's the way I've made her feel. But there's 2 sides to that. Also if I'm a threat to her and the children, why is she asking me to do multiple extracurricular drop off and pickups each week? Surely if she's going to accuse me of abusing my family then this is a bit of a contradiction??
Edited by pb63 on Tuesday 8th September 23:12
pb63 said:
Thanks. I don't believe there is any substantial evidence. My solicitor has asked her solicitor to produce the evidence so we can substantiate it. Nothing has been produced to date. Everything the now ex has said is it's the way I've made her feel. But there's 2 sides to that.
Also if I'm a threat to her and the children, why is she asking me to do multiple extracurricular drop off and pickups each week? Surely if she's going to accuse me of abusing my family then this is a bit of a contradiction??
I suppose you need to decide what your priorities are and act accordingly.Also if I'm a threat to her and the children, why is she asking me to do multiple extracurricular drop off and pickups each week? Surely if she's going to accuse me of abusing my family then this is a bit of a contradiction??
Edited by pb63 on Tuesday 8th September 23:12
Theboss gave some good advice in the post above I think
Taking your first post at face value I personally wouldn’t have moved out and therefore would echo your solicitors advice to move back in but that’s easy to say.
Whatever happens all the best.
Your wife thus far appears to be thinking she is “ winning “ the battle though and also wants her cake and is eating it in terms of still “ needing “ you to assist with your children.
Two sides to every story but certainly she appears to have been in planning mode for sometime and you need to catch up to that level.
But listen to your Solicitor.
Again , all the best.
Whatever happens all the best.
Your wife thus far appears to be thinking she is “ winning “ the battle though and also wants her cake and is eating it in terms of still “ needing “ you to assist with your children.
Two sides to every story but certainly she appears to have been in planning mode for sometime and you need to catch up to that level.
But listen to your Solicitor.
Again , all the best.
I am not an expert - but would contribute a couple of things - in no particular order.
I think moving out is a bad idea, you will lose control of your house (you own half) and become a passenger in the process. Possession being 9/10s of the law etc. So I would avoid doing that.... you have as much right to live there as she does.
Is there a chance of mediation?
Ultimately she may actually get the house as the courts will regard her needs as greater than yours because of 2 children that she will have a greater custody of etc.
Sorry you're going through it, I have a couple of mates in the midst of divorce.
I think moving out is a bad idea, you will lose control of your house (you own half) and become a passenger in the process. Possession being 9/10s of the law etc. So I would avoid doing that.... you have as much right to live there as she does.
Is there a chance of mediation?
Ultimately she may actually get the house as the courts will regard her needs as greater than yours because of 2 children that she will have a greater custody of etc.
Sorry you're going through it, I have a couple of mates in the midst of divorce.
NDA said:
I am not an expert - but would contribute a couple of things - in no particular order.
I think moving out is a bad idea, you will lose control of your house (you own half) and become a passenger in the process. Possession being 9/10s of the law etc. So I would avoid doing that.... you have as much right to live there as she does.
Is there a chance of mediation?
Ultimately she may actually get the house as the courts will regard her needs as greater than yours because of 2 children that she will have a greater custody of etc.
Sorry you're going through it, I have a couple of mates in the midst of divorce.
The problem is he's already moved out, albeit under a temporary agreement.I think moving out is a bad idea, you will lose control of your house (you own half) and become a passenger in the process. Possession being 9/10s of the law etc. So I would avoid doing that.... you have as much right to live there as she does.
Is there a chance of mediation?
Ultimately she may actually get the house as the courts will regard her needs as greater than yours because of 2 children that she will have a greater custody of etc.
Sorry you're going through it, I have a couple of mates in the midst of divorce.
pb63 said:
Cheers. Just wondered if anyone else had a similar experience and what their course of action was and the outcome.
I'm not disagreeing with my solicitor in that I'm not breaking any laws, but does this set me up to fall? She will most likely pack her bags and leave with the kids making me out to be the bad guy. I get it, it's her choice / her reaction. I'm not forcing her to do anything, but she is forcing me. So perhaps that it is the answer.
My ex wife tried this and I stayed in the house. She actually went through with the NMO and Occupation order even though by that point I had been given full custody of our son. Female judge clearly thought she was lying and threw both orders out and banned her from contacting me for 12 months for anything other than child visits etc. It's a shame you moved out but if the advice you are getting is to move back in, then you can follow that. I stayed until I had somewhere for me and my son but it was very awkward for us and you may be better off avoiding the confrontation its going to cause if you go back....I'm not disagreeing with my solicitor in that I'm not breaking any laws, but does this set me up to fall? She will most likely pack her bags and leave with the kids making me out to be the bad guy. I get it, it's her choice / her reaction. I'm not forcing her to do anything, but she is forcing me. So perhaps that it is the answer.
Too many women are abusing these orders just to get men out of the house, the courts are getting wise to it. Just keep your cool, keep a detailed diary of her behaviour especially in regard to her being difficult over you seeing the kids. Coercive control works both ways and some of the things in your original post seem like she's the controlling one and not you!
Good Luck
Oh and get the best solicitor you can, they are worth every penny. Mine was spectacular
Edited by flasher on Wednesday 9th September 11:14
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