Police Attendance
Discussion
AdamS said:
Too late now but out of interest....If
I am involved in an accident and not seriously injured can I insist that the police attend if I believe the accident is caused by dangerous/careless driving?
Or is it just a case these days of let the insurance deal?
Well ...... Whose to say how badly injured you are?
I posted the full story in Biker Banter.
I called the police and they refused to attend as I was up and walking and only had a few bruises. They helpfully advised that if it turned out my injuries were bad then I should walk to my local cop shop and report it.
Basically a lorry wanted to turn right on a busy dual carriageway and pulled across the first 2 lanes and stopped causing all traffic to emergency stop (witness stated she slammed on the brakes). In outside lane on bike 150ft away at about 60 hit brakes and decided to go down rather than go heads up into side of lorry, bike hit rear wheels of trailer and i stopped before lorry.
So if could have been DD/DWDC could I have insited they turn up or is it really injury only these days?
I called the police and they refused to attend as I was up and walking and only had a few bruises. They helpfully advised that if it turned out my injuries were bad then I should walk to my local cop shop and report it.
Basically a lorry wanted to turn right on a busy dual carriageway and pulled across the first 2 lanes and stopped causing all traffic to emergency stop (witness stated she slammed on the brakes). In outside lane on bike 150ft away at about 60 hit brakes and decided to go down rather than go heads up into side of lorry, bike hit rear wheels of trailer and i stopped before lorry.
So if could have been DD/DWDC could I have insited they turn up or is it really injury only these days?
Good point, even though I wasnt speeding conversation should have been....
"999 which service"
Me - "police"
Police Op - "police 999"
Me - "I have been involved in an accident with an HGV"
Police Op "Anyone injured"
Me - "I have a few bumps and bruises"
Police Op - "Are you walking and up and around"
Me - "Yes"
Police Op - "We will not attend then"
Me - "I was speeding when i hit the lorry"
Police Op - "we are sending 5 units please dont move"
"999 which service"
Me - "police"
Police Op - "police 999"
Me - "I have been involved in an accident with an HGV"
Police Op "Anyone injured"
Me - "I have a few bumps and bruises"
Police Op - "Are you walking and up and around"
Me - "Yes"
Police Op - "We will not attend then"
Me - "I was speeding when i hit the lorry"
Police Op - "we are sending 5 units please dont move"
If you were injured, then you must exchange insurance details (including showing a certificate) at the scene, or you must report to a police station asap (<24hrs) and report the accident.
It's unclear to me that you had an accident with the lorry - you were off the bike when the collision between bike and lorry occurred. This is a techicality. I wonder what the definition is.
It also sounds like you were going faster than the speed at which you could stop in the distance which would remain clear. Ican't tell from your description whether you could *reasonably have expected* this space to remain clear. It sounds like the lorry driver took "priority by impatience" - not a form of priority the law recognises.
It's unclear to me that you had an accident with the lorry - you were off the bike when the collision between bike and lorry occurred. This is a techicality. I wonder what the definition is.
It also sounds like you were going faster than the speed at which you could stop in the distance which would remain clear. Ican't tell from your description whether you could *reasonably have expected* this space to remain clear. It sounds like the lorry driver took "priority by impatience" - not a form of priority the law recognises.
Tend to agree with your third para 7db....
My day ( oh here we go again..) ALL accidents reported were attended by Police.
Back end of the 80's bit of lattitude brought in regarding non injury accidents, which if minor AND NO OFFENCES DISCLOSED non attendance or name and addresses exchanged. Not so where there was injury and I think this still applies today.
I shake my head when I read posts like this and I can only assume that the reporting call was taken by a civilian employed by the Police, some of which are up to the job but a lot not (personal experience.)
Regards reporting, in the case quoted, the first requirement was for the vehicles involved to STOP, which they apparently did.
Because of the injury to the motor cyclist there was an obligation on the LORRY DRIVER in addition to giving his details, that of the owner and VRM also Insurance details to any person having reasonable grounds. If none of these given then report to the Police as soon as reasonably practicable and within 24 hours.
Regarding the motor cyclist only if damage (presume no injury to driver of lorry) caused to the lorry is the obligation to give personal details, owners details and VRM to any person having reasonable grounds. Again if not done at the scene then report within 24 hours.
dvd
My day ( oh here we go again..) ALL accidents reported were attended by Police.
Back end of the 80's bit of lattitude brought in regarding non injury accidents, which if minor AND NO OFFENCES DISCLOSED non attendance or name and addresses exchanged. Not so where there was injury and I think this still applies today.
I shake my head when I read posts like this and I can only assume that the reporting call was taken by a civilian employed by the Police, some of which are up to the job but a lot not (personal experience.)
Regards reporting, in the case quoted, the first requirement was for the vehicles involved to STOP, which they apparently did.
Because of the injury to the motor cyclist there was an obligation on the LORRY DRIVER in addition to giving his details, that of the owner and VRM also Insurance details to any person having reasonable grounds. If none of these given then report to the Police as soon as reasonably practicable and within 24 hours.
Regarding the motor cyclist only if damage (presume no injury to driver of lorry) caused to the lorry is the obligation to give personal details, owners details and VRM to any person having reasonable grounds. Again if not done at the scene then report within 24 hours.
dvd
The wording is something like, "Owing to the presence of a motor vehicle on a road, an accident occurs......."
So basically, you should be excahanging details with the lorry driver, the woman who slammed her brakes on and anyone else that was affected and stopped due to the lorry performing an idiotic manoevre. Exchanging details doen't necessarily mean that you are going to claim against each other, it just helps the insurance companies sort the facts out.
So basically, you should be excahanging details with the lorry driver, the woman who slammed her brakes on and anyone else that was affected and stopped due to the lorry performing an idiotic manoevre. Exchanging details doen't necessarily mean that you are going to claim against each other, it just helps the insurance companies sort the facts out.
Thanks for the input guys.
In my view, and I dont know how to explain it without sitting you down in front of me at the scene, is that I would in all reasonable anticipation have expected the road ahead to remain clear. In any reasonable judgment I would have anticipated a vehicle moving from the inside line to the outside lane as both lanes contained dc speed traffic. if such a manouvre occurred I could have stopped.
I could never have reasonably anticipated an HGv pulling out to block both lanes resulting in a stationary object.
if it helps and I dont know how to access directly the junction is at 51degrees24minues31seconds70Northe and 1Degree07Minues39Seconds43West on Google Earth near the Comfort Inn at Padworth
In my view, and I dont know how to explain it without sitting you down in front of me at the scene, is that I would in all reasonable anticipation have expected the road ahead to remain clear. In any reasonable judgment I would have anticipated a vehicle moving from the inside line to the outside lane as both lanes contained dc speed traffic. if such a manouvre occurred I could have stopped.
I could never have reasonably anticipated an HGv pulling out to block both lanes resulting in a stationary object.
if it helps and I dont know how to access directly the junction is at 51degrees24minues31seconds70Northe and 1Degree07Minues39Seconds43West on Google Earth near the Comfort Inn at Padworth
Will have a peek at that Adam. Re-reading my post, it lacked sympathy. Sorry about that. I hate hearing about these accidents, and I hope you are up and running again soon. I hope your confidence isn't knocked.
I watched a biker getting lifter off the tarmac into an ambulance on Thursday morning and it all makes me angry that so many of these things are avoidable.
I watched a biker getting lifter off the tarmac into an ambulance on Thursday morning and it all makes me angry that so many of these things are avoidable.
AdamS
The thing to bear in mind is that you constantly have to be reviewing what is going on around you.
An example of commentary would be:
Dual carriageway, vehicles ahead and to rear. Artic at junction on left, looking to turn right. Brake lights on. Check mirror, check speed. Brake lights off, lorry starts to move. Check mirror. Lose speed. Can I stop in the distance I can see to be clear? Lose speed. Will artic have to stop to block carriageway? Expect to have to stop but be ready to continue if artic clears.
Lose more speed. Consider hazards. Look for escape route.
etc.. etc...
I think the issue is that the problem didn't occur when you suddenly found the road ahead blocked, the problem occured when the artic started to move as, at that point, he was potentially going to be in conflict with you. He could have stalled it half-way across.
As I said in the other thread over in Bikers it is no comfort being in the right if you end up embedded in the side of the artic or, as in your case, you went down.
Again, please don't think I am trying to teach you how to suck eggs.
I think it is very rare that collisions occur that are genuinely unavoidable. Often one person makes a mistake and another road user fails to appreciate the implications of that mistake.
The thing to bear in mind is that you constantly have to be reviewing what is going on around you.
An example of commentary would be:
Dual carriageway, vehicles ahead and to rear. Artic at junction on left, looking to turn right. Brake lights on. Check mirror, check speed. Brake lights off, lorry starts to move. Check mirror. Lose speed. Can I stop in the distance I can see to be clear? Lose speed. Will artic have to stop to block carriageway? Expect to have to stop but be ready to continue if artic clears.
Lose more speed. Consider hazards. Look for escape route.
etc.. etc...
I think the issue is that the problem didn't occur when you suddenly found the road ahead blocked, the problem occured when the artic started to move as, at that point, he was potentially going to be in conflict with you. He could have stalled it half-way across.
As I said in the other thread over in Bikers it is no comfort being in the right if you end up embedded in the side of the artic or, as in your case, you went down.
Again, please don't think I am trying to teach you how to suck eggs.
I think it is very rare that collisions occur that are genuinely unavoidable. Often one person makes a mistake and another road user fails to appreciate the implications of that mistake.
AdamS
The thing to bear in mind is that you constantly have to be reviewing what is going on around you.
An example of commentary would be:
Dual carriageway, vehicles ahead and to rear. Artic at junction on left, looking to turn right. Brake lights on. Check mirror, check speed. Brake lights off, lorry starts to move. Check mirror. Lose speed. Can I stop in the distance I can see to be clear? Lose speed. Will artic have to stop to block carriageway? Expect to have to stop but be ready to continue if artic clears.
Lose more speed. Consider hazards. Look for escape route.
etc.. etc...
I think the issue is that the problem didn't occur when you suddenly found the road ahead blocked, the problem occured when the artic started to move as, at that point, he was potentially going to be in conflict with you. He could have stalled it half-way across.
As I said in the other thread over in Bikers it is no comfort being in the right if you end up embedded in the side of the artic or, as in your case, you went down.
Again, please don't think I am trying to teach you how to suck eggs.
I think it is very rare that collisions occur that are genuinely unavoidable. Often one person makes a mistake and another road user fails to appreciate the implications of that mistake.
The thing to bear in mind is that you constantly have to be reviewing what is going on around you.
An example of commentary would be:
Dual carriageway, vehicles ahead and to rear. Artic at junction on left, looking to turn right. Brake lights on. Check mirror, check speed. Brake lights off, lorry starts to move. Check mirror. Lose speed. Can I stop in the distance I can see to be clear? Lose speed. Will artic have to stop to block carriageway? Expect to have to stop but be ready to continue if artic clears.
Lose more speed. Consider hazards. Look for escape route.
etc.. etc...
I think the issue is that the problem didn't occur when you suddenly found the road ahead blocked, the problem occured when the artic started to move as, at that point, he was potentially going to be in conflict with you. He could have stalled it half-way across.
As I said in the other thread over in Bikers it is no comfort being in the right if you end up embedded in the side of the artic or, as in your case, you went down.
Again, please don't think I am trying to teach you how to suck eggs.
I think it is very rare that collisions occur that are genuinely unavoidable. Often one person makes a mistake and another road user fails to appreciate the implications of that mistake.
VolvoT5
Agree with your position completely and I thought I was doing as you have written but obviously got caught out. If I hadn't anticipated the lorry and slowed accordingly I probably wouldnt be here typing this now.
Done the reading, the on road traing, practiced what was preached etc but still ended up on my arse in the road!!
Agree with your position completely and I thought I was doing as you have written but obviously got caught out. If I hadn't anticipated the lorry and slowed accordingly I probably wouldnt be here typing this now.
Done the reading, the on road traing, practiced what was preached etc but still ended up on my arse in the road!!
a Friend of the Wifes was Sexually assaulted in her local Park while walking her Dog last November (2004) knows where the Bloke lives and she is still waiting for the Police to arrive to interview her a they are too busy doing more important things still (aparrently) to visit her, she is too Traumatised to Work since BTW!, is this disgusting or what? and the BIB wonder why the MOP have no faith in them?, I wonder why
And yet...
When a bib lost his rag with the driver of a bin lorry a bit back (and discussed here on PH) several cop cars turned out to arrest driver.
A Chief Constable was in a boundary dispute with his neighbour. He had his neighbour arrested, several cars turned out.
A woman was arrested recently at the cenotaph in London when she read out the names of those killed in the Iraq conflict. I beleve some 14-15 police turned out to arrest her.
They never have trouble finding vehicles or manpower when they want to.
When a bib lost his rag with the driver of a bin lorry a bit back (and discussed here on PH) several cop cars turned out to arrest driver.
A Chief Constable was in a boundary dispute with his neighbour. He had his neighbour arrested, several cars turned out.
A woman was arrested recently at the cenotaph in London when she read out the names of those killed in the Iraq conflict. I beleve some 14-15 police turned out to arrest her.
They never have trouble finding vehicles or manpower when they want to.
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