Requesting photographic evidence - challanging a NIP
Discussion
Gone down the PACE route and offered 3 pts and £60. 38 in a 30 at 6.15am on a very quiet road, a speed that I dispute anyway as I'd seen the signs and was crawling along looking for the camera (hidden behind signage)
Question is where to go from here? I have 28 days to respond and want to see the evidence.
Do I simply write and request the photos, ignoring the request for a cheque and my licence, (within the 28 days of course) or is there a more appropriate course of action?
Also I'd like to see the calibration certificate for the camera.. Advice welcome please.
Of course if all the above is forthcoming and I'm in the wrong I'll pay up and take the points but I take offence at being assumed guilty until proven innocent!
>> Edited by Shake me up Judy on Sunday 19th February 20:54
Question is where to go from here? I have 28 days to respond and want to see the evidence.
Do I simply write and request the photos, ignoring the request for a cheque and my licence, (within the 28 days of course) or is there a more appropriate course of action?
Also I'd like to see the calibration certificate for the camera.. Advice welcome please.
Of course if all the above is forthcoming and I'm in the wrong I'll pay up and take the points but I take offence at being assumed guilty until proven innocent!
>> Edited by Shake me up Judy on Sunday 19th February 20:54
You would almost certainly have had more luck getting the photo(s) if you had written to the SCP before sending a PACE statement. The purpose of that request being to 'assist in identification of the driver'.
Your PACE statement has nominated you as the driver at the time of the alleged offence in accordance with the requirements of Section 172. As such, there is no mileage in requesting photographic evidence to identify the driver now, IMHO.
Unfortunately, I suspect the only way you will get to see any photos, cal certs etc now is to ignore the CoFP and reminders, wait for a summons to arrive and then plead not guilty. Then, and only then, are there any legal obligations for the evidence against you to be disclosed...
Fight or fold ? Your decision..
If you view the evidence against you and decide it is damning, bear in mind you can change a not guilty plea to guilty at any time and, chances are, you would only be liable for an additional 35 quid court costs over and above the CoFP..
>> Edited by SS2. on Sunday 19th February 21:58
Your PACE statement has nominated you as the driver at the time of the alleged offence in accordance with the requirements of Section 172. As such, there is no mileage in requesting photographic evidence to identify the driver now, IMHO.
Unfortunately, I suspect the only way you will get to see any photos, cal certs etc now is to ignore the CoFP and reminders, wait for a summons to arrive and then plead not guilty. Then, and only then, are there any legal obligations for the evidence against you to be disclosed...
Fight or fold ? Your decision..
If you view the evidence against you and decide it is damning, bear in mind you can change a not guilty plea to guilty at any time and, chances are, you would only be liable for an additional 35 quid court costs over and above the CoFP..
>> Edited by SS2. on Sunday 19th February 21:58
Sorry to hear about this but you will be aware that you are not the first 
. This sort of thing always prompts righteous indignation and a whole lot of other emotions. Unfortunately, at the end of the day you will have to decide whether to fight it or (like most of us) just cough up the dough and take the 3 points on the nose (licence). If you want to fight there is lots of good advice on pepipoo where the principle seems to be that the more people who protest and take their right to be heard in court, then the more cluttered the system becomes and the process grinds to a halt. We all know it is completely unfair and unreasonable and that cameras are only their to collect taxes but at the moment there is no other way to fight them - and the scamera vans are even worse because there is said to be a "human" hand directing the beam - at least the Gatsos are impersonal. You could be lucky and find they made a mistake or that the fixed penalty office burns down - playing for time gives them every opportunity to get it wrong but in my experience the process is conducted by jobsworths who seem to relish the paperwork - nonetheless you can at least make them earn the £60!
. This sort of thing always prompts righteous indignation and a whole lot of other emotions. Unfortunately, at the end of the day you will have to decide whether to fight it or (like most of us) just cough up the dough and take the 3 points on the nose (licence). If you want to fight there is lots of good advice on pepipoo where the principle seems to be that the more people who protest and take their right to be heard in court, then the more cluttered the system becomes and the process grinds to a halt. We all know it is completely unfair and unreasonable and that cameras are only their to collect taxes but at the moment there is no other way to fight them - and the scamera vans are even worse because there is said to be a "human" hand directing the beam - at least the Gatsos are impersonal. You could be lucky and find they made a mistake or that the fixed penalty office burns down - playing for time gives them every opportunity to get it wrong but in my experience the process is conducted by jobsworths who seem to relish the paperwork - nonetheless you can at least make them earn the £60!To stop the scammers getting the cash you have to go to court. If you ignore theFPN and wait for the summons there is always the chance, however remote, that they will make an error and serve it too late. Then, when you get the summons you need not reply, just turn up at the court, having requested all their evidence to be with you at least 7 days before the hearing.
If you used the PACE letter when notifying the driver details you can plead not guilty and challenge the right to use the letter as evidence. That takes some level of courage which you may or may not have.
But if you then turn up and plead guilty you can ask present any mitigating circumstances, apologise to the court and take the fine, which will almost certainly be £60 and 3 points plus £35 costs. Then the nasty scammers get nothing and you've had your day in court as everyone is entitled.
If everyone did this the cash-camera scandal would end overnight.
If you used the PACE letter when notifying the driver details you can plead not guilty and challenge the right to use the letter as evidence. That takes some level of courage which you may or may not have.
But if you then turn up and plead guilty you can ask present any mitigating circumstances, apologise to the court and take the fine, which will almost certainly be £60 and 3 points plus £35 costs. Then the nasty scammers get nothing and you've had your day in court as everyone is entitled.
If everyone did this the cash-camera scandal would end overnight.
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