Discussion
I notice that the plod are parked up across the main routes into Manchester with their little cameras poking out the rear window of their Vectras. Nice to see that our ruling political party cares so much about security, etc., in MAnchester.
Isn't there some sort of conference in Manchester this week....?
Isn't there some sort of conference in Manchester this week....?
ANPR is very useful indeed.
Some weeks back I had a repair job to do on a Beds Pol VX Zafira which was kitted out with ANPR. According to it's driver, that car alone took 48 cars off the road which were untaxed, uninsured, no-MOT, or stolen, in two weeks. And they weren't looking for them, they were just riding down the road, and the computer did the rest. The Zafira was used by those nice people who knock on your door at crack of sparrow with their little toffee hammers.
Cambs is gradually fitting all of their traffic cars with it as they are replaced. They have fitted all of their marked firearms vehicles too.
The only problem comes when the car is driven/owned by pikeys from a site. They are more difficult to get rid of. If they confiscate them for a trip to the crusher, the pikeys will just go and nick another one, or buy another car and not register it, tax it, insure it, as we all know that pikeys are exempt from requiring tax/mot/insurance on vehicles!
Rob.
Some weeks back I had a repair job to do on a Beds Pol VX Zafira which was kitted out with ANPR. According to it's driver, that car alone took 48 cars off the road which were untaxed, uninsured, no-MOT, or stolen, in two weeks. And they weren't looking for them, they were just riding down the road, and the computer did the rest. The Zafira was used by those nice people who knock on your door at crack of sparrow with their little toffee hammers.
Cambs is gradually fitting all of their traffic cars with it as they are replaced. They have fitted all of their marked firearms vehicles too.
The only problem comes when the car is driven/owned by pikeys from a site. They are more difficult to get rid of. If they confiscate them for a trip to the crusher, the pikeys will just go and nick another one, or buy another car and not register it, tax it, insure it, as we all know that pikeys are exempt from requiring tax/mot/insurance on vehicles!
Rob.
mrs doyle said:
its not so much as they are exempt, its just that even if they wanted to, with no fixed abode it's impossible to get Tax or Insurance without it!
is that their fault?
is that their fault?
Do you honestly think that our 'travelling friends' actually want to buy road tax/insurance but are prohibited by their lifetyle choice? Just a thought on ANPR....
I sat on an A road yesterday with my team of 6 officers, I worked the van (my turn) and they drove the (3) stopping cars.
I read 11,642 index plates in 4hr 30m.
The alarm went off 127 times that the car passing was of some interest in some way. (We have all sorts of databases)
I dispatched the stopping cars to look at a total of 17 of those 127 and from it:-
The 1st car arrested a male who gave false details and who it turned out was Disqualfied (and thus obviously uninsured)
The 2nd car stopped a car stolen by means of a duplicated credit card, the driver still had the credit card on them would you believe !
The 3rd car stoppped a van with various reports, it was running red diesel so was impounded for Customs to look at Monday and on the way back they watched another van drive through a red light, a breath test showed he was over the limit.
I have to say, it is not the answer to everything and does not replace the way officers have worked in the past but it does add a very efficient policing tool to stop criminals using the road and yes it does come across the "lower" end of the scale, people with No Tax Etc but the main aim is the to fight crime. (Although I pay my road tax and loose no sleep about people going to court for using their cars without any)
The vans that you saw were no doubt loaded with databases of certain people of interest but would also be given a free reign to deal with anything else the turn up, all indexes get recorded in case there is an incident.
I would be talking out of turn if I mentioned specific cases but suffice to say some VERY high profile arrests have come from studying ANPR data.
I sat on an A road yesterday with my team of 6 officers, I worked the van (my turn) and they drove the (3) stopping cars.
I read 11,642 index plates in 4hr 30m.
The alarm went off 127 times that the car passing was of some interest in some way. (We have all sorts of databases)
I dispatched the stopping cars to look at a total of 17 of those 127 and from it:-
The 1st car arrested a male who gave false details and who it turned out was Disqualfied (and thus obviously uninsured)
The 2nd car stopped a car stolen by means of a duplicated credit card, the driver still had the credit card on them would you believe !
The 3rd car stoppped a van with various reports, it was running red diesel so was impounded for Customs to look at Monday and on the way back they watched another van drive through a red light, a breath test showed he was over the limit.
I have to say, it is not the answer to everything and does not replace the way officers have worked in the past but it does add a very efficient policing tool to stop criminals using the road and yes it does come across the "lower" end of the scale, people with No Tax Etc but the main aim is the to fight crime. (Although I pay my road tax and loose no sleep about people going to court for using their cars without any)
The vans that you saw were no doubt loaded with databases of certain people of interest but would also be given a free reign to deal with anything else the turn up, all indexes get recorded in case there is an incident.
I would be talking out of turn if I mentioned specific cases but suffice to say some VERY high profile arrests have come from studying ANPR data.
It depends on what / how the data was gathered, for instance, normal day to day work or a specific deployment in relation to a specific operation. (It's no secret that we have been deployed to airports within hours of security incidents)
There are national standards agreed and from an -on the ground- viewpoint, I just plug into the data socket and all the info flows up the pipe into our server however I have been involved in ANPR for several years now and have been involved in the process of agreeing many of the policies now in place and the starting point was always the need to balance the desire to retain the information to investigate crimes/criminals that come to light some time after the event versus the moral need to never become big brother.
I know people will have views on that final aspect and I can only state mine, the data is currently used in a VERY honourable manner for the VERY best reasons.
The rules appear to be here....
www.spy.org.uk/spyblog/acpo_anpr_hra_dpa_ripa/EHCR%20DP%20&%20RIPA%20Oct%202004.doc
There are national standards agreed and from an -on the ground- viewpoint, I just plug into the data socket and all the info flows up the pipe into our server however I have been involved in ANPR for several years now and have been involved in the process of agreeing many of the policies now in place and the starting point was always the need to balance the desire to retain the information to investigate crimes/criminals that come to light some time after the event versus the moral need to never become big brother.
I know people will have views on that final aspect and I can only state mine, the data is currently used in a VERY honourable manner for the VERY best reasons.
The rules appear to be here....
www.spy.org.uk/spyblog/acpo_anpr_hra_dpa_ripa/EHCR%20DP%20&%20RIPA%20Oct%202004.doc
mrs doyle said:
its not so much as they are exempt, its just that even if they wanted to, with no fixed abode it's impossible to get Tax or Insurance without it!
is that their fault?
is that their fault?
don't make us all laugh again, at the continual sniping at our
thieving pikey scum friends
I don't think my sides will take the mirth
bunyarra said:
Perhaps our own insurance might one day go down as a result ... err ... darn. Dreaming again.
I do believe that we will have some impact in the long term although like most businesses, they never rush to save you money and I can't see premiums coming down as quickly as uninsured drivers are removed from the roads LOL
But to put it in perspective, one day we took 14 cars from drivers who were uninsured on one road in 4 hours ! and we only stopped 23 cars, and we wern't hunting for them, we were hunting for vehicles used in a pattern of burglaries and these just were to make sure the team were not wasting time sitting doing nothing.
My main relief at having this sort of impact is that neither you nor I want anything to do with the grief of a collision with an uninsured driver and every one more taken is one less chance.
justin1230smith said:
bunyarra said:
Perhaps our own insurance might one day go down as a result ... err ... darn. Dreaming again.
I do believe that we will have some impact in the long term although like most businesses, they never rush to save you money and I can't see premiums coming down as quickly as uninsured drivers are removed from the roads LOL
But to put it in perspective, one day we took 14 cars from drivers who were uninsured on one road in 4 hours ! and we only stopped 23 cars, and we wern't hunting for them, we were hunting for vehicles used in a pattern of burglaries and these just were to make sure the team were not wasting time sitting doing nothing.
My main relief at having this sort of impact is that neither you nor I want anything to do with the grief of a collision with an uninsured driver and every one more taken is one less chance.
Ive got no specific problems with it being used for these purposes, and its a dam good thing too to get uninsured slime off the streets. Carry on with it. My only concern is if its operational all the time on every road in every place, big brother really will have arrived then. Cheers for the info tho.
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