66 in a 50 and cocked up insurance
Discussion
Hi
I have just been pulled over by the police and given a fixed penalty notice for driving at 66mph on a 50 limit road. I am happy to take my punishment like a man - 3 points and £60 I think BUT my worries are about having to produce my insurance details at a police station within 7 days.
I changed cars from an MX5 to a Peugeot 205 GTi two months ago. I am sure I phoned Elephant to update them on that day but when I got home after being pulled I discovered that I was still insured on the Mazda not the Peugeot. I have now updated the insurance online.
Does this mean that I was technically uninsured and what can I expect to happen when I turn up at the police station?
I have always been insured, have no convictions and have only 3 pts from a speed camera 4 years ago
Help
I have just been pulled over by the police and given a fixed penalty notice for driving at 66mph on a 50 limit road. I am happy to take my punishment like a man - 3 points and £60 I think BUT my worries are about having to produce my insurance details at a police station within 7 days.
I changed cars from an MX5 to a Peugeot 205 GTi two months ago. I am sure I phoned Elephant to update them on that day but when I got home after being pulled I discovered that I was still insured on the Mazda not the Peugeot. I have now updated the insurance online.
Does this mean that I was technically uninsured and what can I expect to happen when I turn up at the police station?
I have always been insured, have no convictions and have only 3 pts from a speed camera 4 years ago
Help
andyuk911 said:
Some policies will cover you 3rd party on another car, provided you have the owners permission to drive.
As long as the vehicle is not yours, or leased to you (or a company car) - so I don't think it will help in this instance.
It's a simple mistake - but I've no idea how the BiB would react to that. Hopefully someone with some knowledge/experience will come along and help.
K
I'm guessing when you pitch up at your local nick the front desk staff will complete the HORT2 (form that records what you produce) and note that valid insurance has not been provided. The process unit (people who deal with the paperwork) might then issue a NIP. At some point you could write to them and explain that there seems to have been an admin error with your policy which was still showing you insured on a car you've sold. Maybe include a copy of the DVLA paperwork acknowledging the change of ownership - they might have a heart and not prosecute...
julianhj said:
I'm guessing when you pitch up at your local nick the front desk staff will complete the HORT2 (form that records what you produce) and note that valid insurance has not been provided. The process unit (people who deal with the paperwork) might then issue a NIP. At some point you could write to them and explain that there seems to have been an admin error with your policy which was still showing you insured on a car you've sold. Maybe include a copy of the DVLA paperwork acknowledging the change of ownership - they might have a heart and not prosecute...
NIP is not required.
Expect when you turn up to produce your documents that you will be reported for the offence of no insurance & summonsed. Get together all documentation that supports what you are saying (perhaps a letter from your insurance company confirming that you hadn't cancelled/amended the policy after the date you have proof of selling the Mazda & a quote for the effect that the change of vehicle would have on the premium (hopefully not big further illustrating it's not to avoid payment)), then throw yourself at the mercy of the court explaining it was a simple administrative error on your part, no intention to avoid payment for insurance.
Edited by vonhosen on Saturday 30th December 19:15
Opps, I stand corrected.Thanks for the moral support and advice. Hopefully they will be sympathetic as it is a genuine administrative error on my part and the mazda is still insured by me even though I sold it two months ago.
BTW the peugeot costs only an extra £9.53 insurance!
BTW the peugeot costs only an extra £9.53 insurance!
Edited by RZSupra on Saturday 30th December 19:52
RZSupra said:
Thanks for the moral support and advice. Hopefully they will be sympathetic as it is a genuine administrative error on my part and the mazda is still insured by me even though I sold it two months ago.
BTW the peugeot costs only an extra £9.53 insurance!
BTW the peugeot costs only an extra £9.53 insurance!
The station you produce at won't have a lot of choice, they should report you for the offence.
The summons will be then issued from the officer who originally stopped you or station covering the area where the speeding offence was committed. They have the choice over case disposal & you can try contacting the officer in charge there to explain the situation & stave off the prosecution. If they prosecute though then it's appeal for clemency at court time.
The money along with the other evidence should just support your submission that it's an admin error.
If you were insured to drive the mazda wouldn't it allow you to drive third party in the peugeot? Who actually owns the peugeot? The registered keeper isn't always the owner so you may be able to argue that you had some cover in place whilst then paperwork was being sorted.
A nice letter from your insurers would be the best course of action though.
Boosted.
A nice letter from your insurers would be the best course of action though.
Boosted.
Boosted LS1 said:
If you were insured to drive the mazda wouldn't it allow you to drive third party in the peugeot? Who actually owns the peugeot? The registered keeper isn't always the owner so you may be able to argue that you had some cover in place whilst then paperwork was being sorted.
A nice letter from your insurers would be the best course of action though.
Boosted.
A nice letter from your insurers would be the best course of action though.
Boosted.
Be very careful about going down the route of claiming you are not the owner if you are.
If you are looking to minimise the damage, trying to have the Police & courts over is not going to be the best way. If you try to have the same officer over that you are planning on looking for clemency from, they are not going to like you trying to take them for a mug & will start looking for information that may support more serious charges.
Attempting to pervert the course the justice is not a good choice trying to cover what started as a simple admin error (IMHO).
Edited by vonhosen on Saturday 30th December 20:25
Kinky said:
andyuk911 said:
Some policies will cover you 3rd party on another car, provided you have the owners permission to drive.
As long as the vehicle is not yours, or leased to you (or a company car) - so I don't think it will help in this instance.
Plus it is a usual stipulation (in my experience) that the vehicle must have its own outright policy.
Like others have said, produce the documents and hope for the best, if not:
Always worth a shot!!
It may be that the Police decide that you're an honourable chap and have just cocked up. It wouldn't be the first time that the Force has let someone off for a reasonable mistake. It is almost certainly best to be straight, honest and pleasant. In my experience, the vast majority of Police officers are reasonable people and won't go after you just for the hell of it.
vonhosen said:
Boosted LS1 said:
If you were insured to drive the mazda wouldn't it allow you to drive third party in the peugeot? Who actually owns the peugeot? The registered keeper isn't always the owner so you may be able to argue that you had some cover in place whilst then paperwork was being sorted.
A nice letter from your insurers would be the best course of action though.
Boosted.
A nice letter from your insurers would be the best course of action though.
Boosted.
Be very careful about going down the route of claiming you are not the owner if you are.
If you are looking to minimise the damage, trying to have the Police & courts over is not going to be the best way. If you try to have the same officer over that you are planning on looking for clemency from, they are not going to like you trying to take them for a mug & will start looking for information that may support more serious charges.
Attempting to pervert the course the justice is not a good choice trying to cover what started as a simple admin error (IMHO).
Edited by vonhosen on Saturday 30th December 20:25
whats the worst case then?
3points speeding
5-8 points no insurance???
If the guy has points already, could be a short term ban, or, totting up 6 months ban!!!
I am not scare mongering, but make sure if you go to court go armed with all the evidence you need and have at your diposal, and make sure you cough up for a solicitor, dont try and do it on your own if you are in a position for a short term ban. I made the mistake of being at the mercy of the court, but the opening sentence from one of the mags was "what do you have to say in your defence, as we are looking at a short term ban for these offence". so for me, they had made thier mind up before i entered the court.
I had clean licence for 14 years, had a speeding (92 in a 70) and one other charge and the banned me. Saying that the person who was before me had NO insurance, had expired 2 days before, and 94, in a 70, had 6 points already, and they just gave him 5 more, so he had 11 on his licence and a big fine!!!!
I wish you the best of luck, I hope the officers are fair. Also, most insurance companys have to record all their calls, so you can Ask elephant to go back over their call logger and find the call you had, this would stick up in court, and show, that the admin error was with elephant.
Best of luck
Mr F
a magistrate said:
what do you have to say in your defence, as we are looking at a short term ban for these offences
Could the bench actually see you, being so far up their own arse? Not untypical sadly, justice by the yard is par for the course.
Those phone calls where they say 'this may be recorded for training purposes', a similar approach might make magistrates realise how pompous and prejudicial they sound. Maybe it's a defence mechanism for some. Any PH mags wish to comment on that opening gambit in the national poker game that passes for justice in a magistrates court?
turbobloke said:
a magistrate said:
what do you have to say in your defence, as we are looking at a short term ban for these offences
Could the bench actually see you, being so far up their own arse? Not untypical sadly, justice by the yard is par for the course.
Those phone calls where they say 'this may be recorded for training purposes', a similar approach might make magistrates realise how pompous and prejudicial they sound. Maybe it's a defence mechanism for some. Any PH mags wish to comment on that opening gambit in the national poker game that passes for justice in a magistrates court?
Nope, I got a 4 week ban, and I had my healivy pregant wife with me, so I needed the car for hospital appointments.
I sat in on a couple of cases on the same day, guy who already had a short term ban for 112mph, and was up for 116mph this time. He got a 2 week ban
Amazing, just amazing!
Mr F
Forums | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff