A couple of questions
Discussion
Some thoughts that popped into my head over the last few days...
If you are on a motorway and the two outside lanes are moving slowly (due to people being in the wrong lane) are you allowed to sit in the inside lane, carry on at 70mph and go past the other traffic? Or is this undertaking?
If I'm driving at 70mph as indicated by my speedo, but the Tomtom says I'm only doing 64mph, can I assume that my speedo is incorrect and use Tomtom? Which reading is closer to the ones taken by Gatso's and other scameras...
If you are on a motorway and the two outside lanes are moving slowly (due to people being in the wrong lane) are you allowed to sit in the inside lane, carry on at 70mph and go past the other traffic? Or is this undertaking?
If I'm driving at 70mph as indicated by my speedo, but the Tomtom says I'm only doing 64mph, can I assume that my speedo is incorrect and use Tomtom? Which reading is closer to the ones taken by Gatso's and other scameras...
theboyfold said:
Some thoughts that popped into my head over the last few days...
If you are on a motorway and the two outside lanes are moving slowly (due to people being in the wrong lane) are you allowed to sit in the inside lane, carry on at 70mph and go past the other traffic? Or is this undertaking?
If I'm driving at 70mph as indicated by my speedo, but the Tomtom says I'm only doing 64mph, can I assume that my speedo is incorrect and use Tomtom? Which reading is closer to the ones taken by Gatso's and other scameras...
If you are on a motorway and the two outside lanes are moving slowly (due to people being in the wrong lane) are you allowed to sit in the inside lane, carry on at 70mph and go past the other traffic? Or is this undertaking?
If I'm driving at 70mph as indicated by my speedo, but the Tomtom says I'm only doing 64mph, can I assume that my speedo is incorrect and use Tomtom? Which reading is closer to the ones taken by Gatso's and other scameras...
There is no specific law againist "undertaking", indeed there is no law to say you have to overtake on the right AFAIK. The highway codes says you should over take on the right but you can overtake on a multilane road in the left lane if you are in traffic and the other lanes are moving more slowly. It doesn't place a figure on the speed of traffic.
The only thing you have to watch out for is the catch all laws of Driving with out due care, dangerous driving and inconsiderate driving which are subjective in their application.
As long as your speed differencial is low, and you are not weaving across lanes to "make progress" then you should be ok
I used to do this all the time on the M3 driving north on a Sunday evening in summer. On one occasion I actually measured it and I drove 15 miles in the left hand lane and I only had to pull out to the middle lane 3 times to overtake. During this whole time the right hand lane was clogged and going about 50mph or slower. I quite enjoyed that drive laughing at the idiots
I undertook a line of cars yesterday that were pootling along the middle and outside lane at... 77mph. I got fed up, moved over to the inside lane and undertook them all.
Then I had to undertake someone else doing 70mph in the outside lane in a crappy clio. When I passed i saw it was some young blonde bint driving, boyfriend as the passenger and what appeared to be a mobile phone in her hand.
Then I had to undertake someone else doing 70mph in the outside lane in a crappy clio. When I passed i saw it was some young blonde bint driving, boyfriend as the passenger and what appeared to be a mobile phone in her hand.
Oakey said:
I undertook a line of cars yesterday that were pootling along the middle and outside lane at... 77mph. I got fed up, moved over to the inside lane and undertook them all.
Then I had to undertake someone else doing 70mph in the outside lane in a crappy clio. When I passed i saw it was some young blonde bint driving, boyfriend as the passenger and what appeared to be a mobile phone in her hand.
Then I had to undertake someone else doing 70mph in the outside lane in a crappy clio. When I passed i saw it was some young blonde bint driving, boyfriend as the passenger and what appeared to be a mobile phone in her hand.
You "HAD" to overtake someone doing 70 in the outside lane? Why? Were you the driver of a Fire Engine, Ambulance, Police car? And, crappy Clio? So, your'e a car snob to boot. Oh, almost forgot, Blonde Bint driving. Jesus, where the F..k do people like you crawl out from?
theboyfold said:
Some thoughts that popped into my head over the last few days...
If you are on a motorway and the two outside lanes are moving slowly (due to people being in the wrong lane) are you allowed to sit in the inside lane, carry on at 70mph and go past the other traffic? Or is this undertaking?
If you are on a motorway and the two outside lanes are moving slowly (due to people being in the wrong lane) are you allowed to sit in the inside lane, carry on at 70mph and go past the other traffic? Or is this undertaking?
Highway Code said:
241: Do not overtake unless you are sure it is safe to do so.
Overtake only on the right. You should
* check your mirrors
* take time to judge the speeds correctly
* make sure that the lane you will be joining is sufficiently clear ahead and behind
* take a quick sideways glance into the blind spot area to verify the position of a vehicle that may have disappeared from your view in the mirror
* remember that traffic may be coming up behind you very quickly. Check your mirrors carefully. When it is safe to do so, signal in plenty of time, then move out
* ensure you do not cut in on the vehicle you have overtaken
* be especially careful at night and in poor visibility when it is harder to judge speed and distance.
242: Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.
243: You MUST NOT use the hard shoulder for overtaking.
theboyfold said:
If I'm driving at 70mph as indicated by my speedo, but the Tomtom says I'm only doing 64mph, can I assume that my speedo is incorrect and use Tomtom? Which reading is closer to the ones taken by Gatso's and other scameras...
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
VH, in your referall to the highway code there it appears to state that if your lane is moving faster (OK, we're talking congestion surely) then it is permissible to overtake traffic in the outer lane, yes?
What about the nowadays common occurrences where traffic is doing the frequent yo yo thing on a motorway? Sometimes the outer lane moves faster, somtimes it's the middle lane, generally at speeds a bit less than the limit.
I get really, really hacked off if I'm sitting in the outer lane with my normal safety zone between me and the vehicle in front and some smart asshole peels off maybe 3 or 4 cars behind me, slips up t5he middle lane then indicates and pulls in front of me. Then, if the oppurtunity presents itself they'll do the same again to make up, what? another 3 carlengths?
Now, to me this isn't simply bad driving. This is Fu..ing rude, impolite and just plain ignorant.
It's only in the last few years that I've really noticed this antisocial and annoying attitude. What are y'all doing about it? This is where it starts man. When Numpties get off with this shit then they believe that they're the ones in the right. I blame you lot because there's not enough of you out there to prevent this moronic behaviour.
What about the nowadays common occurrences where traffic is doing the frequent yo yo thing on a motorway? Sometimes the outer lane moves faster, somtimes it's the middle lane, generally at speeds a bit less than the limit.
I get really, really hacked off if I'm sitting in the outer lane with my normal safety zone between me and the vehicle in front and some smart asshole peels off maybe 3 or 4 cars behind me, slips up t5he middle lane then indicates and pulls in front of me. Then, if the oppurtunity presents itself they'll do the same again to make up, what? another 3 carlengths?
Now, to me this isn't simply bad driving. This is Fu..ing rude, impolite and just plain ignorant.
It's only in the last few years that I've really noticed this antisocial and annoying attitude. What are y'all doing about it? This is where it starts man. When Numpties get off with this shit then they believe that they're the ones in the right. I blame you lot because there's not enough of you out there to prevent this moronic behaviour.
Hemibum said:
VH, in your referall to the highway code there it appears to state that if your lane is moving faster (OK, we're talking congestion surely) then it is permissible to overtake traffic in the outer lane, yes?
What about the nowadays common occurrences where traffic is doing the frequent yo yo thing on a motorway? Sometimes the outer lane moves faster, somtimes it's the middle lane, generally at speeds a bit less than the limit.
I get really, really hacked off if I'm sitting in the outer lane with my normal safety zone between me and the vehicle in front and some smart asshole peels off maybe 3 or 4 cars behind me, slips up t5he middle lane then indicates and pulls in front of me. Then, if the oppurtunity presents itself they'll do the same again to make up, what? another 3 carlengths?
Now, to me this isn't simply bad driving. This is Fu..ing rude, impolite and just plain ignorant.
It's only in the last few years that I've really noticed this antisocial and annoying attitude. What are y'all doing about it? This is where it starts man. When Numpties get off with this shit then they believe that they're the ones in the right. I blame you lot because there's not enough of you out there to prevent this moronic behaviour.
What about the nowadays common occurrences where traffic is doing the frequent yo yo thing on a motorway? Sometimes the outer lane moves faster, somtimes it's the middle lane, generally at speeds a bit less than the limit.
I get really, really hacked off if I'm sitting in the outer lane with my normal safety zone between me and the vehicle in front and some smart asshole peels off maybe 3 or 4 cars behind me, slips up t5he middle lane then indicates and pulls in front of me. Then, if the oppurtunity presents itself they'll do the same again to make up, what? another 3 carlengths?
Now, to me this isn't simply bad driving. This is Fu..ing rude, impolite and just plain ignorant.
It's only in the last few years that I've really noticed this antisocial and annoying attitude. What are y'all doing about it? This is where it starts man. When Numpties get off with this shit then they believe that they're the ones in the right. I blame you lot because there's not enough of you out there to prevent this moronic behaviour.
Sounds like inconsiderate driving to me.
There are only so may hours in the working day.
Of course it's inconsiderate! However, it should be classed as dangerous driving because it's the kind of behaviour that gets the law abiding motorists pissed off. We seem to have a lot of reasonably law abiding drivers on this site, and I believe that we all rightly think that the police are not focusing on the REAL causes of driving behaviour that can lead to accidents.
Please please do what you can to put more marked trafpols on our motorways. I would welcome it and so would any other member here.
Please please do what you can to put more marked trafpols on our motorways. I would welcome it and so would any other member here.
Hemibum said:
I get really, really hacked off if I'm sitting in the outer lane with my normal safety zone between me and the vehicle in front and some smart asshole peels off maybe 3 or 4 cars behind me, slips up t5he middle lane then indicates and pulls in front of me.
We drive on the LEFT.
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Your GPS calculates the exact speed you are travelling, the number is accurate and can be relied upon. If the BIB charge you with exceeding that number it's yet another case of the dodgeyscope and needs to be challenged in court.
Of course, if you wanted to err on the side of caution for some inexplicable reason you should be doing no more than 20mph anywhere, then you'll be very very safe, although your concentration and journey times may suffer.
SM
supermono said:
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Your GPS calculates the exact speed you are travelling, the number is accurate and can be relied upon. If the BIB charge you with exceeding that number it's yet another case of the dodgeyscope and needs to be challenged in court.
Of course, if you wanted to err on the side of caution for some inexplicable reason you should be doing no more than 20mph anywhere, then you'll be very very safe, although your concentration and journey times may suffer.
SM
GPS can't give *exact* speed (no manufacturer is going to guarantee 100% accuracy). Speed readings are smoothed not instantaneous & GPS also suffers from drop out or signal degradation in certain circumstances.
esselte said:
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Are you saying the equipment used by the police and scammeras may not be accurate?
No.
vonhosen said:
esselte said:
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Are you saying the equipment used by the police and scammeras may not be accurate?
No.
He can't admit it, but we all know that various devices may be subject to certain errors from time to time (e.g. slip errors at extreme range on dodgyscope 20-20 for one).
vonhosen said:
supermono said:
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Your GPS calculates the exact speed you are travelling, the number is accurate and can be relied upon. If the BIB charge you with exceeding that number it's yet another case of the dodgeyscope and needs to be challenged in court.
Of course, if you wanted to err on the side of caution for some inexplicable reason you should be doing no more than 20mph anywhere, then you'll be very very safe, although your concentration and journey times may suffer.
SM
GPS can't give *exact* speed (no manufacturer is going to guarantee 100% accuracy). Speed readings are smoothed not instantaneous & GPS also suffers from drop out or signal degradation in certain circumstances.
vonhosen said:
supermono said:
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Your GPS calculates the exact speed you are travelling, the number is accurate and can be relied upon. If the BIB charge you with exceeding that number it's yet another case of the dodgeyscope and needs to be challenged in court.
Of course, if you wanted to err on the side of caution for some inexplicable reason you should be doing no more than 20mph anywhere, then you'll be very very safe, although your concentration and journey times may suffer.
SM
GPS can't give *exact* speed (no manufacturer is going to guarantee 100% accuracy). Speed readings are smoothed not instantaneous & GPS also suffers from drop out or signal degradation in certain circumstances.
At least GPS is designed to be accurate. Speedometer indications on EU cars are designed to be inaccurate.
vonhosen said:
What matters is what the enforcement authorities device records your speed as.
This is getting a bit quantum, isn't it? So the speed of a moving car is determined by the measuring device used? There was me thinking that it was down to delta S over delta T.
You see, I would have thought that what matters is your speed and the accuracy of the measurement of that speed. Now, fixed cameras do a delta S over delta T calculation, the same as the GPS device does, so any problems suffered by GPS speed measurement is also suffered by Gatsos. The smaller the delta T, the less accurately the delta S can be measured, the larger the delta T, the more variation around the calculated mean is possible.
vonhosen said:
If you want to err on the side of caution, be guided by the one that is showing the highest speed to you.
Oh, come on, von. It's statements like that really foster resentment of limits and their manner of enforcement. You make it sound as if there's nothing more important than clamping your speed to a certain number. It's also bl**dy patronising. I'm sure you don't really think that way, but certainly comes across like it sometimes.
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