Using the left hand lane to turn right on a roundabout...
Discussion
Ok, very complicated situation on my daily drive. Its a double mini roundabout system (althought, proper roundabouts, not the painted on versions). Heres a google earth image to save me explaining it:
I approach the roundabout from A, having been sat in a long traffic queue. Up to the roundabout, the left hand lane is always a solid slow traffic queue, the right hand lane is normally empty or has one or two cars in it. Now the problem - I need to leave the roundabout system to travel along the road marked B. For an unknown reason, 95% of the other people who leave on road B (which is probably about 40-50% of the traffic in the queue) stay in the left lane, then go right around the first roundabout, then turn left off down road B. The odd person however goes into the right hand lane, cutting out about 3-4 minutes of queueing, goes right around the first roundabout but then is left in the right lane on the 2nd roundabout as often there is someone on their left so they can't merge left to get into the correct lane. As you can see on the picture, there are no road markings on the first junction, but there are on 2nd roundabout. So when someone uses the right lane and then turns left into the right hand lane, people often won't let them merge in easily as they think they have just jumped the queue (road B starts as 2 lanes then quickly merges into one)
So who is right? I genrally stick with the masses and stay in the left lane but now its really annoying me, so would I be in the "right" if I went into the right hand lane?
Hope that all made sense
I approach the roundabout from A, having been sat in a long traffic queue. Up to the roundabout, the left hand lane is always a solid slow traffic queue, the right hand lane is normally empty or has one or two cars in it. Now the problem - I need to leave the roundabout system to travel along the road marked B. For an unknown reason, 95% of the other people who leave on road B (which is probably about 40-50% of the traffic in the queue) stay in the left lane, then go right around the first roundabout, then turn left off down road B. The odd person however goes into the right hand lane, cutting out about 3-4 minutes of queueing, goes right around the first roundabout but then is left in the right lane on the 2nd roundabout as often there is someone on their left so they can't merge left to get into the correct lane. As you can see on the picture, there are no road markings on the first junction, but there are on 2nd roundabout. So when someone uses the right lane and then turns left into the right hand lane, people often won't let them merge in easily as they think they have just jumped the queue (road B starts as 2 lanes then quickly merges into one)
So who is right? I genrally stick with the masses and stay in the left lane but now its really annoying me, so would I be in the "right" if I went into the right hand lane?
Hope that all made sense
IMHO - if I ever had a "humble" opinion
According to Highway Code, at the first roundabout you are taking a turn that is past stright on, you should be in RH lane.
From second roundabout, HWC says be in the first lane.
No marking on first roundabout
Marking on second roundabout comprised of arrows - not marked "must" or "only".
Therefore nothing in legal terms to consider in your question other than DWDCA or Dangerous Driving.
For first roundabout, difficult to say that taking the correct lane per HWC is DWDCA or worse. Once over first roundabout, should move to LH lane, but traffic "blocking" makes that difficult. So exiting exit 1 is potential DWDCA, but so is blocking.
If car merges before the second roundabout and there is a bumb could be 50:50, or could be the one blocking due to aggressive behaviour. If bump on the roundabout then more likely the car leaving exit 1 from RH lane contrary to road markings.
According to Highway Code, at the first roundabout you are taking a turn that is past stright on, you should be in RH lane.
From second roundabout, HWC says be in the first lane.
No marking on first roundabout
Marking on second roundabout comprised of arrows - not marked "must" or "only".
Therefore nothing in legal terms to consider in your question other than DWDCA or Dangerous Driving.
For first roundabout, difficult to say that taking the correct lane per HWC is DWDCA or worse. Once over first roundabout, should move to LH lane, but traffic "blocking" makes that difficult. So exiting exit 1 is potential DWDCA, but so is blocking.
If car merges before the second roundabout and there is a bumb could be 50:50, or could be the one blocking due to aggressive behaviour. If bump on the roundabout then more likely the car leaving exit 1 from RH lane contrary to road markings.
If I'v got this right, get in the right hand lane and go right, then because you need to go left but no one will let you move over just go right round the next roundabout, one and a half times thus claiming right of way and just leave the second roundabout off up route B.
Is that what you mean/.
Is that what you mean/.
This is the best example I have ever seen of a very badly marked junction. Interesting that there would be nothing wrong in driving straight ahead on both lanes from road A. There are no road markings to indicate this would be wrong. So all the cars turning right on the nearside lane would in fact be cutting across those drivers in the offside lane who wish to proceed ahead. If a collision occurred I would be charging the nearside lane driver with a section 3.
The nearside lane of road A is for those drivers wishing to turn left or proceed ahead. The offside lane is for those drivers wishing to proceed ahead or turn right. Its that simple. Now due to the way the vast majority of drivers use this junction it has turned into a mess.
In fact on reflection its not a badly marked junction at all its just a bunch of drivers making the rules up as they go along.
Good post.
The nearside lane of road A is for those drivers wishing to turn left or proceed ahead. The offside lane is for those drivers wishing to proceed ahead or turn right. Its that simple. Now due to the way the vast majority of drivers use this junction it has turned into a mess.
In fact on reflection its not a badly marked junction at all its just a bunch of drivers making the rules up as they go along.
Good post.
sheetstabuer said:
RH lane then LH lane, whats hard about that?
You can't normally go into the left hand lane as the guy who was on your left at the junction from road A onto roundabout 1 has also gone right, so is in the way. And you're then stuck in the right hand lane, and if you try and merge left people assume you are trying to kill puppies so try and force you off the road into oncoming traffic...
southpaw said:
sheetstabuer said:
RH lane then LH lane, whats hard about that?
You can't normally go into the left hand lane as the guy who was on your left at the junction from road A onto roundabout 1 has also gone right, so is in the way. And you're then stuck in the right hand lane, and if you try and merge left people assume you are trying to kill puppies so try and force you off the road into oncoming traffic...
Then they are all numpties and need to buy a copy of the highway code
gently bentley said:
Interesting that there would be nothing wrong in driving straight ahead on both lanes from road A.
Yep. If southpaw is using lane 2 to turn right, he is correct. Anyone using lane 1 to turn right is in the wrong. And as GB has said, you could go straight ahead from either lane, so if you do this from lane 2 and someone is right turning from lane 1, you end up with a collision. The bottom line here is dead simple, this is a roundabout, thats all, and it has four points on it, not exactly rocket science.
Balmoral Green said:
towie said:
but there are two lanes on road B, why not turn left from the offside at the roundabout?
Well, you could, once you get there. But we are talking about starting from 'A' though.
Right lane at first junction into offside for 2nd roundabout, turn left into offside at B. No problem. Ignore the road grafitti - it has no legal implications (unless you hit something!)
You would be correct to use the right lane for the first approach, but then you ideally want the left lane for the second roundabout. In heavy traffic I would not fancy trying the lane change on such a short stretch, and I guess everyone else has come to the same conclusion.
Do whatever you have to, just to get around without a collision. Nasty junction.
Do whatever you have to, just to get around without a collision. Nasty junction.
andmole said:
Just as a matter of interest where is that? Just so that I know to NEVER EVER drive there, you have my sympathy mate, that looks like a bloody awful concoction.
Its in Newcastle, and I have to navigate round it twice a day 
. It was awful in winter when it was cold and icy, especially as the gaps to get out onto the first roundabout are quite small so you have to move fast. Its easier now its light and a bit warmer, less chance of losing traction booting it off the line 
towie said:
Interstingly, the Ped Xing at B sems to have two lanes on entry and one on exit - bet that is fun!
Its actually traffic lights, not sure if thats better or worse than just a ped x-ing. If you're in the right hand lane there, often a queue of cars builds up on your left and NONE of them want to let you in...
towie said:
Balmoral Green said:
towie said:
but there are two lanes on road B, why not turn left from the offside at the roundabout?
Well, you could, once you get there. But we are talking about starting from 'A' though.
Right lane at first junction into offside for 2nd roundabout, turn left into offside at B. No problem. Ignore the road grafitti - it has no legal implications (unless you hit something!)
If I understand you right that would be an illegal turn. Bear in mind that traffic in the left hand lane between roundabouts may not be going to B. They might be going straight on at 2nd roundabout---> you collide with them and are in wrong
chris_tivver said:
towie said:
Balmoral Green said:
towie said:
but there are two lanes on road B, why not turn left from the offside at the roundabout?
Well, you could, once you get there. But we are talking about starting from 'A' though.
Right lane at first junction into offside for 2nd roundabout, turn left into offside at B. No problem. Ignore the road grafitti - it has no legal implications (unless you hit something!)
If I understand you right that would be an illegal turn. Bear in mind that traffic in the left hand lane between roundabouts may not be going to B. They might be going straight on at 2nd roundabout---> you collide with them and are in wrong
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