"He Was Speeding .. They All Do!"
Discussion
Such was the comment my sister-in-law heard after a Fatal near where she lives.
This incident occurred about two car lengths or so beyond the pelican crossing (should be in Bolton Press on Monday as reporter did ask questions of those around) Sis-in law say people do not cross at the pelican.. but leave the bank's cash point where the central reserve of the dual carriageway end und saunter across road here. Have asked for photos from her to clarify to me. She say I should know this road as driven it when visiting her. I probably do.. A575 in Walkden - but I seem to think there are two pelicans und two sets of traffic lights on this stretch.
I cannot rightly recall now..
Elderly chap stepped off kerb... into path of a Vauxhall Astra. Nearside windscreen smashed. Poor old bloke died. Ist a tragedy.
Driver in severe shock.
This ist at mouth of a dual carriageway. 30 mph. Always has been since built. Only fatals since building in mid-60s involved woman running for a bus and stepping into traffic without looking und one bloke mounting kerb when having heart attack. He was the deceased. Truvelo erected a mile away to clock the blips on a gradient.
Single carriageway at this point.
Sis-in-law had parked up in the car park opposite und returned from her shopping trek to find road closed to her. So she went out to the main road to see what was happening. Police had closed the road in each direction.. for rest of day. Sis-in-law unable to drive away from car park as a result of this as route out was in the "forensic area" She decided to ask some questions from the onlookers. No one she spoke to saw it.. apart from one woman who said the pedestrian was elderly und he never moved at all - which seem to suggest to in-law that this was big tragic death. The other thing that struck her was the silence of those watching the police und paramedics at the time.
Road closed for 5 hours.
As Mad Doc's second youngest sister asks the onlookers what happened - as she says her experience tell her that this pelican ist always mis-used as people use the bank und cash machine .. then cross road without using the pelican to reach the side street where there ist convenient free parking .. but using the pelican means walking 10 yard to pelican und then 10 yard back again to reach the path to the car park und a housing estate. Her view ist that the pelican should be located where the man actually chose to cross und not at the T-junction which can make right und left turns a bit tricksy for driver und cyclist alike. (She ist IAM trained und a teacher.. she ist no numpty driver
)
But.. from some onlookers .. she got the comments of
1. The driver was speeding. They turn out of Cecil Street und accelerate.
Mad Doc's sister tell us that the pelican ist immediately to the left of the T-junction where this residential street meet main A575.
She also ask if person saw the incident .. und got
All drivers speed. He was speeding .. they all speed. The driver who killed on the High Street was over the speed limit..the driver told the inquest that she was pregnant und that her GPS said the speed was 31 mph!
When asked if she had seen the incident... she had not seen it at all. But was convinced that "the driver must have been speeding as this ist how accidents happen!" (which ist really the point I am making in normal long-winded fashion . You blame speed often enough und no one look for any other explanation
2. The 80 year old who was killed on the nearby High Street happened to be the father of one of her many pals. He was hit by two vehicles. The car which impacted on him had been shunted into him by another car. She had stopped at the pelican. He did not .. collided with her year und the poor man's head hit the kerb side awkwardly und he died two hours later. It was a real tragedy. Sis-in-law says the chap was really a lovely gentleman.. in every way .. und the family just so polite und pleasant too.
Ironically this ist a new pelican und NO ACCIDENTS ever occurred prior to its appearance .. but residents report several near misses since as this ist about 300 yards from the traffic lights. .. und traffic will be accelerating und people (pedestrians) are as impatient these days as anyone else on the roads.
Police want witnesses to this latest fatal which occur on A575 directly opposite the Nat West bank und at the T junction with Cecil Street.
This incident occurred about two car lengths or so beyond the pelican crossing (should be in Bolton Press on Monday as reporter did ask questions of those around) Sis-in law say people do not cross at the pelican.. but leave the bank's cash point where the central reserve of the dual carriageway end und saunter across road here. Have asked for photos from her to clarify to me. She say I should know this road as driven it when visiting her. I probably do.. A575 in Walkden - but I seem to think there are two pelicans und two sets of traffic lights on this stretch.
I cannot rightly recall now.. Elderly chap stepped off kerb... into path of a Vauxhall Astra. Nearside windscreen smashed. Poor old bloke died. Ist a tragedy.
Driver in severe shock.
This ist at mouth of a dual carriageway. 30 mph. Always has been since built. Only fatals since building in mid-60s involved woman running for a bus and stepping into traffic without looking und one bloke mounting kerb when having heart attack. He was the deceased. Truvelo erected a mile away to clock the blips on a gradient.
Single carriageway at this point. Sis-in-law had parked up in the car park opposite und returned from her shopping trek to find road closed to her. So she went out to the main road to see what was happening. Police had closed the road in each direction.. for rest of day. Sis-in-law unable to drive away from car park as a result of this as route out was in the "forensic area" She decided to ask some questions from the onlookers. No one she spoke to saw it.. apart from one woman who said the pedestrian was elderly und he never moved at all - which seem to suggest to in-law that this was big tragic death. The other thing that struck her was the silence of those watching the police und paramedics at the time.
Road closed for 5 hours.
As Mad Doc's second youngest sister asks the onlookers what happened - as she says her experience tell her that this pelican ist always mis-used as people use the bank und cash machine .. then cross road without using the pelican to reach the side street where there ist convenient free parking .. but using the pelican means walking 10 yard to pelican und then 10 yard back again to reach the path to the car park und a housing estate. Her view ist that the pelican should be located where the man actually chose to cross und not at the T-junction which can make right und left turns a bit tricksy for driver und cyclist alike. (She ist IAM trained und a teacher.. she ist no numpty driver
) But.. from some onlookers .. she got the comments of
1. The driver was speeding. They turn out of Cecil Street und accelerate.
Mad Doc's sister tell us that the pelican ist immediately to the left of the T-junction where this residential street meet main A575. She also ask if person saw the incident .. und got
onlooker said:
All drivers speed. He was speeding .. they all speed.
The driver who killed on the High Street was over the speed limit..the driver told the inquest that she was pregnant und that her GPS said the speed was 31 mph! When asked if she had seen the incident... she had not seen it at all. But was convinced that "the driver must have been speeding as this ist how accidents happen!"
(which ist really the point I am making in normal long-winded fashion . You blame speed often enough und no one look for any other explanation 2. The 80 year old who was killed on the nearby High Street happened to be the father of one of her many pals. He was hit by two vehicles. The car which impacted on him had been shunted into him by another car. She had stopped at the pelican. He did not .. collided with her year und the poor man's head hit the kerb side awkwardly und he died two hours later. It was a real tragedy. Sis-in-law says the chap was really a lovely gentleman.. in every way .. und the family just so polite und pleasant too.
Ironically this ist a new pelican und NO ACCIDENTS ever occurred prior to its appearance .. but residents report several near misses since as this ist about 300 yards from the traffic lights. .. und traffic will be accelerating und people (pedestrians) are as impatient these days as anyone else on the roads.
Police want witnesses to this latest fatal which occur on A575 directly opposite the Nat West bank und at the T junction with Cecil Street.
The dual carriageway that runs around the centre of Bury town centre was 40mph for many, many years. Then they built a supermarket next to it. The a little girl ran across all 4 lanes, and was killed.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
Parrot of Doom said:
The dual carriageway that runs around the centre of Bury town centre was 40mph for many, many years. Then they built a supermarket next to it. The a little girl ran across all 4 lanes, and was killed.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
But there were no longer any 40 signs.
Drive to what you can see today, not what was present yesterday.
Use historical experience of a road to help your planning around safety, but don't bank on it for realising progress.
Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 4th March 19:59
vonhosen said:
Parrot of Doom said:
The dual carriageway that runs around the centre of Bury town centre was 40mph for many, many years. Then they built a supermarket next to it. The a little girl ran across all 4 lanes, and was killed.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
Drive to what you can see today, not what was present yesterday.
Use historical experience of a road to help your planning around safety, but don't bank on it for realising progress.
Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 4th March 19:59
good point von. With catch-em out road "planning" you have to be ever watchful that a safe road is not downlimited.
The average numpty is heavily propagandised about 'speeding' so nothig too surprising there. Also the average numpty equates a high revving engine (about to change up from first to second) as speeding. D'oh. BiB are aware at least they are round here since contrary to some opinions they aren't stupid The back of the fag packet at the garage will show a low speed...if it was low, which seems very likely.
The back of the fag packet at the garage will show a low speed...if it was low, which seems very likely. Sometimes, just sometimes, accidents just happen.
Happened to me at 20mph when some old giffer ran directly in front of me.
Unless you are going to put all pedestrians in big puffy suits and helmets, some will die.
The onus needs to be on the soft squidgy one to be a bit more careful of the big metal thing and vice versa.
Would drivers eyes straying to a big yellow box encourage observation of soft squidgy ones and their pre-occupied ways?
Are there any studies to show what fatalities occur in built up areas vis a vis DC/MW roads, and what the speed of the vehicles were at the time (I guess the Police will have to investigate the speeds?)
Happened to me at 20mph when some old giffer ran directly in front of me.
Unless you are going to put all pedestrians in big puffy suits and helmets, some will die.
The onus needs to be on the soft squidgy one to be a bit more careful of the big metal thing and vice versa.
Would drivers eyes straying to a big yellow box encourage observation of soft squidgy ones and their pre-occupied ways?
Are there any studies to show what fatalities occur in built up areas vis a vis DC/MW roads, and what the speed of the vehicles were at the time (I guess the Police will have to investigate the speeds?)
A local crossing to me has so far killed 2 people. The council set up two crossing points controlled by one set of lights. The effect being that it is possible to drive through one set of lights on green, go past the first crossing and by the time you go through the second the lights have changed and people on the second crossing have started to cross. On both occassions the local rag sang out to the cry of "speeding drivers" The offending crossing was re-egineered with set of lights per crossing. The stupidity of the local authority killed a woman in her late 30s and a 13 year old school boy, not to mention the distress to the drivers. The local SCP lap up the statistics to add to their camera portfolio and nothing related to real safety gets done!
The offending crossing was re-egineered with set of lights per crossing. The stupidity of the local authority killed a woman in her late 30s and a 13 year old school boy, not to mention the distress to the drivers. The local SCP lap up the statistics to add to their camera portfolio and nothing related to real safety gets done! vonhosen said:
Parrot of Doom said:
The dual carriageway that runs around the centre of Bury town centre was 40mph for many, many years. Then they built a supermarket next to it. The a little girl ran across all 4 lanes, and was killed.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
But there were no longer any 40 signs.
Drive to what you can see today, not what was present yesterday.
Use historical experience of a road to help your planning around safety, but don't bank on it for realising progress.
Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 4th March 19:59
True, but once I've driven down a road enough times, I don't bother looking at the speed limit signs any more, there are more important things to be looking for.
Parrot of Doom said:
vonhosen said:
Parrot of Doom said:
The dual carriageway that runs around the centre of Bury town centre was 40mph for many, many years. Then they built a supermarket next to it. The a little girl ran across all 4 lanes, and was killed.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
But there were no longer any 40 signs.
Drive to what you can see today, not what was present yesterday.
Use historical experience of a road to help your planning around safety, but don't bank on it for realising progress.
Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 4th March 19:59
True, but once I've driven down a road enough times, I don't bother looking at the speed limit signs any more, there are more important things to be looking for.
That's true. Like it or not, people will automatically drive with the speed limit the road was yesterday in their minds. I doubt many of us check the speed limit signs every day on our daily drive to work
vonhosen said:
Parrot of Doom said:
The dual carriageway that runs around the centre of Bury town centre was 40mph for many, many years. Then they built a supermarket next to it. The a little girl ran across all 4 lanes, and was killed.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
The only fatality on that road ever.
Few weeks later, new 30mph limit imposed. Speed camera erected. Many many motorists caught out, as there were no 'new speed limit' signs erected.
But there were no longer any 40 signs.
Drive to what you can see today, not what was present yesterday.
Use historical experience of a road to help your planning around safety, but don't bank on it for realising progress.
Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 4th March 19:59
You ( und even you Liebchen could fall foul of this one .. as no one ist really a robot 24/7
associate the roads you drive on each day as having a certain speed limit. So there ist a degree of habit or automation. Drive on that road to go to work in the local town every day for just a couple of years .. und local driver can be "copped out" by the reduced limit. There ist one from two year ago... red oblong was only at the "mouth" of this road... but not repeated. Two days into lowered limit.. the talivan appeared. Lots of letters from extremely irate drivers were published in local press at the time.. Parrot of Doom said:
True, but once I've driven down a road enough times, I don't bother looking at the speed limit signs any more, there are more important things to be looking for.
Totally agree. Things like white vans with little windows and yellow boxes.
Doesn't seem to matter if you plough through peds, as long as you don't trigger the camera you're a safe driver.
BB
lostusernamedamn said:
The speed camera justification industry is driven in much the same way as the green taxation industry...lies, hysteria, brainwashing, easily-led / gullible people / people searching for a cause...
Its worse than the green taxation industry - it is the tactic of Nazi Germany!
1) Confirm to the public there is a problem - Many people die on the roads/ The German public are financially destitute
2) Offer to solve the problem - You and your friends and family wont die / The German public will have enough food to eat.
3) Put forward the solution with a highly visible solution for the 'menace' - We need more speed cameras / We must stop the Jews taking your money.
4) Back up the solution with misleading statistics - Speed cameras work, see? / Look how much money the Jews are taking from you!?
5) Gather public support for the 'movement' - BRAKE, Ladyman, funded SCPs / Public funded propaganda leaflets and posters.
I am not using the emotional connotations to this - the propaganda process is the same regardless of the issue.
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