To Traffic Officers on M1 Leics-Rugby 1 hour ago ...
Discussion
My apologies for not responding immediately to your bully boy tactics when you wanted to get past at about 9:30 tonight. It was me in the A2 executing a perfectly reasonable overtake of two vehicles in the middle lane, and I'm very sorry that my blocking of the outside lane caused you to have to brake from the excessive speed you were doing. Yes, I did see you flash the first time, but declined to sideswipe the first car I was overtaking. Ditto the second flash. The third flash I saw too, and I did briefly consider moving across to the middle lane, but decided not to risk swerving across in between the two vehicles and slamming on the anchors to avoid rear ending the leading one, on the grounds that I had a small child in the car, as well as my wife. As I passed the second car you seemed a little upset that I covered my brake pedal enough to illuminate the brake lights - you were close enough that I could see your faces after all. Thing is, I didn't really fancy sideswiping the second car either, and you were just a little closer than the recommeded distance there chaps. I liked the quick flash of the blues, followed by a long stare from both of you as you passed when I moved across - I didn't realize you guys had eyes in the top of your head to see where you were going.
Hope you got back for the end of your shift nevertheless. Next time I will have the presence of mind to take your number and we can have a nice chat about driving standards and road safety in the presence of your superiors.
Hope you got back for the end of your shift nevertheless. Next time I will have the presence of mind to take your number and we can have a nice chat about driving standards and road safety in the presence of your superiors.
Perhaps they are just human and frustration crept in because it sounds as if the two cars you overtook were hogging lane 2.
Did they give you sufficient time to pull out of the overtake beore you even began the manouver? Its not quite clear in your post.
Its supervisory officers by the way. We don't and never have had superior officers.
Did they give you sufficient time to pull out of the overtake beore you even began the manouver? Its not quite clear in your post.
Its supervisory officers by the way. We don't and never have had superior officers.
gently bentley said:
Quinny said:
You are a bad lad Victor
Bet you held em up for all of ermmmmmm, let me think 15 seconds.
It could have been a life or death run you know.
Bet you held em up for all of ermmmmmm, let me think 15 seconds.
It could have been a life or death run you know.
Perhaps the delay is not a factor. Perhaps they had to slam on the anchors because somebody was not using the mirrors? Perhaps?
I must say exaclty the same thing has happened to me. Despite the norm nowadays, I am a pretty considerate driver and I dont attempt an overtaking manouvre or move to an outer lane if it means someone has to brake or cut their own speed, or in heavy traffic move into a 'gap' in the outside lane if it only means I am forcing another driver to brake to conserve the correct braking distance between vehicles.
I do this as I am annoyed at the fact that all too often someone in the middle lane doing 55 following two car lengths behind the car in front pulls out without checking their mirrors, or completely misjudging speeds (or just plain not giving a damn), often without indicating so that if a do not brake harshly I would have hit the back of their car even before they would have begun to pull alongside the car they are 'overtaking'.
Towards the end of their dubious manouvre as they flick their eyes up to their mirror to see me close to their back bumper, blissfully unaware of the pain caused by seatbelts contracting into the shoulders of myself and my passengers only 5 seconds ago...
I can just tell they are thinking/saying as they turn to their passenger in disgust..."Look at that impatient **** behind us Mildred... Cant they just wait for us to overtake..."
Please note that I have no proof or implication that this was the case in this scenario, and perhaps the OP knows this too... but I know *exactly* where Gently is coming from...
Quinny said:
They shouldn't have been going so fast then.
If they're highly trained drivers they should have had their speed adjusted to the conditions.
And if it were possible that a car could pull into their lane they should have been ready for it. And driven accordingly.
If they're highly trained drivers they should have had their speed adjusted to the conditions.
And if it were possible that a car could pull into their lane they should have been ready for it. And driven accordingly.
From what we know it seems they did adjust their speed and did drive accordingly when the conditions on the road changed by braking in time to avoid a driver who had pulled into lane 3 when that driver perhaps had the option not to.
Oh and they can drive fast on the road if they choose.
I've had something pretty similar happen. I was in lane 3 doing 80+ overtaking about perhaps five cars in lane 2 doing 70ish. Unmarked plod closes at considerable speed and parks itself on my bumper, sufficiently close that I can see the occupants are police, and they do this in spite of the fact that I clearly have nowhere to go. It is a moronic way to drive. They don't need to get that close to indicate that they wish to get past. That's what the siren and lights are for, which they chose not to use. As soon as I could get out of ther way, I did, and as they accelerated past I got the gestures and stares.
If a fast police car is half a mile back, you are not going to be able to judge their closing speed when you commit to an overtake by moving into lane 3. If they are closing on you at 40mph, they will close that gap in 45 seconds. With a 10mph differential to the cars you're overtaking, you'll travel all of a relative 220yds in the time it takes the police car to reach you. So even if you're overtaking a short queue, you'll end up blocking the police car's progress. Blue lights are easily visible at half a mile in th emirror, so why not switch the damn things on and warn the cars you're approaching rather than park in their boots a few seconds later? It's an idiotic way to drive.
If a fast police car is half a mile back, you are not going to be able to judge their closing speed when you commit to an overtake by moving into lane 3. If they are closing on you at 40mph, they will close that gap in 45 seconds. With a 10mph differential to the cars you're overtaking, you'll travel all of a relative 220yds in the time it takes the police car to reach you. So even if you're overtaking a short queue, you'll end up blocking the police car's progress. Blue lights are easily visible at half a mile in th emirror, so why not switch the damn things on and warn the cars you're approaching rather than park in their boots a few seconds later? It's an idiotic way to drive.
i am inclined to beleive that the officers in question were obviously late for their tea break, and if they did not get back to the station quick some one would have eaten all the custard creams.
I had a similar experience on an a road with 3 coppers sat in my boot in a marked t5 pushing me through a village at 70 mph, after i lost them through a series of s bends, they caught up with me pulled me over proceeded to give me a bollocking an basically told me to pi*s off and not to do it again. In my defense i was in my lotus at the time, it was raining and the car had steamed up (not the windscreen)and i could not make out the vehical or its occupants, i assumed it was a couple of boy nobbers trying to annoy me not 3 officers of the law acting like di*ks in the wet, by the way they instigated this situation by driving right up my arse so close i could not see their head lights only the reflection.
I had a similar experience on an a road with 3 coppers sat in my boot in a marked t5 pushing me through a village at 70 mph, after i lost them through a series of s bends, they caught up with me pulled me over proceeded to give me a bollocking an basically told me to pi*s off and not to do it again. In my defense i was in my lotus at the time, it was raining and the car had steamed up (not the windscreen)and i could not make out the vehical or its occupants, i assumed it was a couple of boy nobbers trying to annoy me not 3 officers of the law acting like di*ks in the wet, by the way they instigated this situation by driving right up my arse so close i could not see their head lights only the reflection.
I think maybe some people aren't really sure what they should be doing when they check behind (either rear view mirror, or shoulder check) before moving out for an overtake.
The question you want to be asking yourself is "Can I complete my overtake and return back to the left before cuasing any other vehicle to change direction or speed?" and not "Is there 30' of road for me to use".
I can fully understand why police drivers are irritated by such driving. People have looked (hopefully!) but misjudged the speed of the police vehicle.
It's a good job that the police driver is anticipating such lousy driving and reducing speed accordingly.
The question you want to be asking yourself is "Can I complete my overtake and return back to the left before cuasing any other vehicle to change direction or speed?" and not "Is there 30' of road for me to use".
I can fully understand why police drivers are irritated by such driving. People have looked (hopefully!) but misjudged the speed of the police vehicle.
It's a good job that the police driver is anticipating such lousy driving and reducing speed accordingly.
Had similar experiences, both on the M3.
T'other week I was bimbling along about 85 when I spotted an unmarked in lane 1 which I bimbled past at 75ish, once past I bimbled a little faster and continued on my way.
Shortly after this a VW Toerag went hooning past, predictably followed by the unmarked who was having to do some serious speed to catch up and nick him.
Obviously I was expecting this and made sure not to hold him up.
The Bib's speed was due in part to the people pulling out in front of him and letting the gap increase, causing them to give it some beans to catch up, but presumably they didn't want to use blue lights so as to avoid alerting the Toerag and also to avoid panicking the sheep.
Having had in the past, to catch up with vehicles on a motorway, I know how fast you have to go to close a distance, especially when the car in front isn't hanging about.
And then, this one time, at band camp, I just had an unmarked Volvo come hooning up my backside on the M3 whilst I was overtaking, this was in my Subaru so may have been a bit of gamesmanship by the rozzers to see if I'd boot it whilst they tried to climb up my chutney locker, at the time I wasn't overly impressed by their driving style but it's no worse than I've done in the past before I grew up a bit.
I would say though, that it is hard to judge distance when the car behind is doing c.140MPH and presumably the rozzers appreciate this and where possible use those little blue lights hidden in the dash that the nice taxpayers have bought them .
T'other week I was bimbling along about 85 when I spotted an unmarked in lane 1 which I bimbled past at 75ish, once past I bimbled a little faster and continued on my way.
Shortly after this a VW Toerag went hooning past, predictably followed by the unmarked who was having to do some serious speed to catch up and nick him.
Obviously I was expecting this and made sure not to hold him up.
The Bib's speed was due in part to the people pulling out in front of him and letting the gap increase, causing them to give it some beans to catch up, but presumably they didn't want to use blue lights so as to avoid alerting the Toerag and also to avoid panicking the sheep.
Having had in the past, to catch up with vehicles on a motorway, I know how fast you have to go to close a distance, especially when the car in front isn't hanging about.
And then, this one time, at band camp, I just had an unmarked Volvo come hooning up my backside on the M3 whilst I was overtaking, this was in my Subaru so may have been a bit of gamesmanship by the rozzers to see if I'd boot it whilst they tried to climb up my chutney locker, at the time I wasn't overly impressed by their driving style but it's no worse than I've done in the past before I grew up a bit.
I would say though, that it is hard to judge distance when the car behind is doing c.140MPH and presumably the rozzers appreciate this and where possible use those little blue lights hidden in the dash that the nice taxpayers have bought them .
Edited by DJFish on Monday 16th April 07:42
gently bentley said:
Quinny said:
You are a bad lad Victor
Bet you held em up for all of ermmmmmm, let me think 15 seconds.
It could have been a life or death run you know.
Bet you held em up for all of ermmmmmm, let me think 15 seconds.
It could have been a life or death run you know.
Perhaps the delay is not a factor. Perhaps they had to slam on the anchors because somebody was not using the mirrors? Perhaps?
But he does not say he pulled out. He say he in the process of the overtake when this car closed in on him und behaved in a manner not far removed from "road rage"
You see car ahead in completing an overtake. You adjust accordingly.. ready to go when he move back afterwards. Ist about COAST und keeping eye on the limit points und horizons ahead .. und anticipation
Perhaps if they had not been speeding in the first place
Don't they know that they have to drive at 70 mph because everyone else ist .. because it ist the law
Und if they were sorting out an unexploded jam doughnut.. then they should have have the lights und the sirens on so that people would just make the space und open up the road for them
I do not subscribe to the view that police never make mistakes. I have been on a track day with my cousin BiBs after all
gently bentley said:
Its supervisory officers by the way. We don't and never have had superior officers.
Typical statement that from someone that is 'cannon fodder'! Now if you were to ask a DCI then I'm sure it would be classed as Superior.
Just a general observation......I've been there and done that! Definitely prefer your take on it though!
Edited by dasherdiablo1 on Monday 16th April 08:33
GreenV8S said:
gently bentley said:
Oh and they can drive fast on the road if they choose.
Do they have an exemption from speed limits?
Sometimes yes....but what annoys me is the manner in which they will tail-gate you to push you out the way. I have often considered taking a photo out of my back window when it happens....but my wife never lets me!
As always with driving there are safe time to drive fast and unsafe times to drive at the NSL. Unfortunately mant RATS/PDs feel that because they have had special training it means they can do whatever they think is right.....what they can't do is second guess how other road users are going to react to their driving.
ipsg.glf said:
I think maybe some people aren't really sure what they should be doing when they check behind (either rear view mirror, or shoulder check) before moving out for an overtake.
The question you want to be asking yourself is "Can I complete my overtake and return back to the left before cuasing any other vehicle to change direction or speed?" and not "Is there 30' of road for me to use".
I can fully understand why police drivers are irritated by such driving. People have looked (hopefully!) but misjudged the speed of the police vehicle.
It's a good job that the police driver is anticipating such lousy driving and reducing speed accordingly.
The question you want to be asking yourself is "Can I complete my overtake and return back to the left before cuasing any other vehicle to change direction or speed?" and not "Is there 30' of road for me to use".
I can fully understand why police drivers are irritated by such driving. People have looked (hopefully!) but misjudged the speed of the police vehicle.
It's a good job that the police driver is anticipating such lousy driving and reducing speed accordingly.
And what if there closing speed means you can't anticipate that? Do you recommend we open the sun roof, stand up and take a look with a telescope and a range finder before pulling out?
If i'm travelling on the motorway and i saw a car in my mirror approaching from a distance but obviously travelling at a high speed, i'd spend maybe an extra couple of seconds trying to judge thier speed before i pulled out, though i'd probably still take the overtake anyway. If however i looked in the mirror and saw a police car in the distance approaching at speed with blues on, i'd stay in the inside lane until they were passed, even if i think i could be past the car in front before they got behind me.
I don't understand why they don't use blue lights when travelling at high speed, it would make decisions for the drivers in front easier to make further in advance about possible overtakes, rather than guessing who it is coming steaming up behind them at 140. It has to be safer for the general public to know if its a police car possibly travelling at high speed, therefore they can make desicions based on that information. All it would need is for a Speed Vigilante to decide that he wasn't happy about somebody travelling much faster than him to pull out into thier path, if he saw the blues would he do it? i don't think so.
I understand it may at times be preferable to travel at speed without using blues, but it has to be weighed against the safety of other road users, bearing in mind there are some right muppets out there!
I don't understand why they don't use blue lights when travelling at high speed, it would make decisions for the drivers in front easier to make further in advance about possible overtakes, rather than guessing who it is coming steaming up behind them at 140. It has to be safer for the general public to know if its a police car possibly travelling at high speed, therefore they can make desicions based on that information. All it would need is for a Speed Vigilante to decide that he wasn't happy about somebody travelling much faster than him to pull out into thier path, if he saw the blues would he do it? i don't think so.
I understand it may at times be preferable to travel at speed without using blues, but it has to be weighed against the safety of other road users, bearing in mind there are some right muppets out there!
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