PCSO stopping cars?

[Mattt]

The other day (I assume as part of a larger operation) there were a couple of PCSOs stopping cars for random checks (it looked like to me anyway).

I assume they are able do it, by the fact that they were doing so, but it seemed odd that they were doing this, knowing how much training regular BiBs have to have to pull over cars.

Do PCSOs normally get involved with traffic ops?

• EDIT - Can someone change the special spelling in the title please!*

Edited by Mattt on Sunday 3rd June 13:13

[vonhosen]

Yes they have the same powers as a constable under Sec 163 RTA 1988

[Mattt]

What would happen if they did find defects? Could they issue a DRN or HORT/1 (or worse) or would they have to wait for a regular?

[vonhosen]

Mattt said:

What would happen if they did find defects? Could they issue a DRN or HORT/1 (or worse) or would they have to wait for a regular?

Beyond stopping it depends on what they dealing with as to the powers conveyed on them. They for instance have the same powers as a constable under sec 59 of the Police Reform Act 2002.

[7db]

You're joking. That's a disgrace.

So people who aren't even constables can cause your car to be confiscated with no judicial review?

[Zeeky]

Judicial Review? The legality of an offical act or law can always be challenged in the Courts with standing and a reasonable case.

I am confused. Do you mean that confiscation should only happen after a Court hearing? If so the Judiciary are unlikely to be involved; it would be the Magistrates.

In my view no official should be able to confiscate your vehicle unless to prevent the commission of a serious crime or to prevent a serious risk of death or serious injury.

[vonhosen]

7db said:

You're joking. That's a disgrace.

So people who aren't even constables can cause your car to be confiscated with no judicial review?

No joke, the powers are the same, except that if it means entering premises in order to do so they need a Police officer supervising.

Of course even though they have the power within law to do so, it is for the force concerned to decide proceedurally whether they can or not.

[vonhosen]

Zeeky said:

Judicial Review? The legality of an offical act or law can always be challenged in the Courts with standing and a reasonable case.

I am confused. Do you mean that confiscation should only happen after a Court hearing? If so the Judiciary are unlikely to be involved; it would be the Magistrates.

In my view no official should be able to confiscate your vehicle unless to prevent the commission of a serious crime or to prevent a serious risk of death or serious injury.

Yes that's your view, but not the legislature's.

[Zeeky]

vonhosen said:

Zeeky said:

Judicial Review? The legality of an offical act or law can always be challenged in the Courts with standing and a reasonable case.

I am confused. Do you mean that confiscation should only happen after a Court hearing? If so the Judiciary are unlikely to be involved; it would be the Magistrates.

In my view no official should be able to confiscate your vehicle unless to prevent the commission of a serious crime or to prevent a serious risk of death or serious injury.

Yes that's your view, but not the legislature's.

Hence the use of the words. 'In my view'. If I was referring to the view of our legislature I would quote the relevant legislation.

What was the purpose of that response other than to state the obvious that I had already stated?

[7db]

Are C3POs even sworn-in by magistrates?

[7db]

vonhosen said:

Beyond stopping it depends on what they dealing with as to the powers conveyed on them. They for instance have the same powers as a constable under sec 59 of the Police Reform Act 2002.

Do they all have the same powers, or does it depend one to the other?

[Zod]

vonhosen said:

Yes they have the same powers as a constable under Sec 163 RTA 1988

Great isn't it that the government confers such powers on a bunch of monkeys with a few hours of training.

[Zeeky]

Probably just as much training as 'Specials' who have the Full Monty of Police powers...

Not sure why Section 163 of the RTA 1988 requires skills monkeys couldn't learn. It's hardly rocket science.

[vonhosen]

7db said:

Are C3POs even sworn-in by magistrates?

Constables aren't.

[vonhosen]

7db said:

vonhosen said:

Beyond stopping it depends on what they dealing with as to the powers conveyed on them. They for instance have the same powers as a constable under sec 59 of the Police Reform Act 2002.

Do they all have the same powers, or does it depend one to the other?

Not sure what you mean

[7db]

vonhosen said:

7db said:

Are C3POs even sworn-in by magistrates?

Constables aren't.

Only in the Met. Everyone else swears-in before a JP.

Other question is whether all PSCOs have the same powers to require vehicles to stop, etc, or whether only some have those powers.

[streaky]

Zeeky said:

Do you mean that confiscation should only happen after a Court hearing? If so the Judiciary are unlikely to be involved; it would be the Magistrates.

Magistrates are members of the Judiciary - Streaky

[streaky]

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

Yes they have the same powers as a constable under Sec 163 RTA 1988

Great isn't it that the government confers such powers on a bunch of monkeys with a few hours of training.

Magistrates - who deal with around 95% of criminal cases - receive three days training (plus reading and distance-learning exercises, three court observations and a visit to a prison facility - if they can find one) PCSOs' training seems to be on a par (taking the ratio of a BiB's training and experience to that of a Circuit Judge)- Streaky

[thunderbelmont]

Zeeky said:

In my view no official should be able to confiscate your vehicle unless to prevent the commission of a serious crime or to prevent a serious risk of death or serious injury.

Surely if the vehicle was un-insured, no MOT (and possibly not roadworthy), would you rather it was left to ride around on our highways, or would you rather the constubulary use all of their available manpower to perform something of benefit to all road users, rather than issue them with LTI20/20's to benefit their coffers?

I would love to see the day when the serious offender (no tax/insurance/mot/licence) see's their vehicle fed in to a mobile fragmenting machine, within minutes of them being pulled by an ANPR check.

Maybe, if more of that were done, the ambulance chasers would be out of work, and our premiums could fall.

[stepej]

I knew they could direct traffic but didn't realise by how much their powers had grown....
Until I read this document