Chronically Bad Driving - Worth reporting?
Discussion
Was driving out of Brighton this evening to goto Sainsburys up the Lewes Rd for anyone that knows it. Anyway this is a dual carriage way, 30 limit going to a 40 limit for a long stretch before reaching the A27.
Had just got to the 40mph section when I get an idiot in a Ford Ka right up my arse and bouncing all over the place. As I've just overtaken someone, I pull in (at speed limit mind!) to let him pass, at which point I estimate he accelerates to 50mph+, and starts to pull away, before heavy braking for a speed camera, then speeding up, and then some morew heavy breaking for traffic lights which are red.
At these lights he ends up right behind a taxi. So the taxi pulls away and evidently 40MPH isn't fast enough for the guy, so he proceeds to try to undertake the taxi driver without indication and while hanging right off his tail. Taxi obviously didn't see him as he's pulling over to the left to let him pass, so anchors go on again, and the guys straddles both lanes for a bit before tearing off up the road. I end up a few cars behind following, taking the same route. Decide to get his registration number incase anything can be done about it.
Given the generally abysmal standard of driving, is there any point of me handing the reg over to the BiB incase they are able to go and have a quiet word? The guy in the car looks about 18-25, white male. Now I'm not some anti speed freak, but I'm all for driving for the conditions, and behaving like that in traffic is appauling.
Thoughts?
Had just got to the 40mph section when I get an idiot in a Ford Ka right up my arse and bouncing all over the place. As I've just overtaken someone, I pull in (at speed limit mind!) to let him pass, at which point I estimate he accelerates to 50mph+, and starts to pull away, before heavy braking for a speed camera, then speeding up, and then some morew heavy breaking for traffic lights which are red.
At these lights he ends up right behind a taxi. So the taxi pulls away and evidently 40MPH isn't fast enough for the guy, so he proceeds to try to undertake the taxi driver without indication and while hanging right off his tail. Taxi obviously didn't see him as he's pulling over to the left to let him pass, so anchors go on again, and the guys straddles both lanes for a bit before tearing off up the road. I end up a few cars behind following, taking the same route. Decide to get his registration number incase anything can be done about it.
Given the generally abysmal standard of driving, is there any point of me handing the reg over to the BiB incase they are able to go and have a quiet word? The guy in the car looks about 18-25, white male. Now I'm not some anti speed freak, but I'm all for driving for the conditions, and behaving like that in traffic is appauling.
Thoughts?
t too! 
hutchingsp said:
I thought there was a rather lengthy thread a while back about how all MOP had to do was call the Police to get a Section 59 slapped on a car...
You have to find a policeman to take interest first. Without an independant witness I don't think he'll find one.I reported a driver who hit my truck and drove off, took the truck round to show plod.
For my trouble I got read my rights ('cos I'd admitted to being involved in an rta. The truck was parked outside a petrol station at the time of the smack), had to make a statement, got given a producer and still had to do the obligatory 15 minute wait when I produced. I shan't bother reporting a crime again.
Heebeegeetee said:
For my trouble I got read my rights, had to make a statement, got given a producer and still had to do the obligatory 15 minute wait when I produced. I shan't bother reporting a crime again.
thetrash said:
Mind your own business springs to mind?
Sadly that does seem to be the current best-practice. Sh't, isn't it?!?What was it someone else on here said about a month ago - "make sure you never come to the attention of the police"?!?
You should report bad driving. I think there has to be some realistic expectations though in terms of how it will get dealt with though. Many people would consider reoprting bad driving but not many would be prepared to go to court and It's very hard to prove in court mainly because its a member of the public who is the witness.
If you report bad driving a description of the vehicle will be passed over police radios and if the car is spotted on routine patrol it would be stopped and the driver spoken to and probably given a producer if they have no documents with them and dealt with for any offences that come to light. Remember though that again the report is from a member of the public, the police have not witnessed it which makes it harder to deal with legally and the CPS would never bother taking it to court as it might involve effort on their behalf.
In the county i live in the Police Chief asked the public to report bad drivers in articles in the paper and on TV. Result of this was that grandad's driving their Rover 214's at 35mph in a 60 were calling to report those boy racers overtaking them like bats out of hell at 55 and 60mph. It just ended up with dozens of malicious complaints from people who vastly over rated their own driving skills complaining about other people. I dont doubt what the first poster had to say was true but it's just not a cut and dry issue. Isn't this just one more justification for increasing the number of traffic cops, after all GATSO's dont catch bad drivers, dangerous drivers, drunk drivers, disqualified drivers, drug drivers, uninsured drivers, untaxed cars, cars with serious defects etc etc etc....
If you report bad driving a description of the vehicle will be passed over police radios and if the car is spotted on routine patrol it would be stopped and the driver spoken to and probably given a producer if they have no documents with them and dealt with for any offences that come to light. Remember though that again the report is from a member of the public, the police have not witnessed it which makes it harder to deal with legally and the CPS would never bother taking it to court as it might involve effort on their behalf.
In the county i live in the Police Chief asked the public to report bad drivers in articles in the paper and on TV. Result of this was that grandad's driving their Rover 214's at 35mph in a 60 were calling to report those boy racers overtaking them like bats out of hell at 55 and 60mph. It just ended up with dozens of malicious complaints from people who vastly over rated their own driving skills complaining about other people. I dont doubt what the first poster had to say was true but it's just not a cut and dry issue. Isn't this just one more justification for increasing the number of traffic cops, after all GATSO's dont catch bad drivers, dangerous drivers, drunk drivers, disqualified drivers, drug drivers, uninsured drivers, untaxed cars, cars with serious defects etc etc etc....
jambuster said:
If you report bad driving a description of the vehicle will be passed over police radios and if the car is spotted on routine patrol it would be stopped and the driver spoken to and probably given a producer if they have no documents with them and dealt with for any offences that come to light.
How do you know this please?jambuster said:
In the county i live in the Police Chief asked the public to report bad drivers in articles in the paper and on TV. Result of this was that grandad's driving their Rover 214's at 35mph in a 60 were calling to report those boy racers overtaking them like bats out of hell at 55 and 60mph.
I wonder what it is about driving in particular which seems to bring out these incredibly opinionated, incredibly wrong, incredibly irritating types. "Anything faster than 35mph feels too fast for me, so that must be because it's the maximum safe speed for everyone, and nothing to do with my reactions being too slow." Is it because they don't want to have to admit to themselves that they shouldn't be driving anymore? Are they that stupid, offensive and reluctant to blame themselves in the rest of their lives as well?
GPSHead said:
jambuster said:
If you report bad driving a description of the vehicle will be passed over police radios and if the car is spotted on routine patrol it would be stopped and the driver spoken to and probably given a producer if they have no documents with them and dealt with for any offences that come to light.
How do you know this please?jambuster said:
In the county i live in the Police Chief asked the public to report bad drivers in articles in the paper and on TV. Result of this was that grandad's driving their Rover 214's at 35mph in a 60 were calling to report those boy racers overtaking them like bats out of hell at 55 and 60mph.
I wonder what it is about driving in particular which seems to bring out these incredibly opinionated, incredibly wrong, incredibly irritating types. "Anything faster than 35mph feels too fast for me, so that must be because it's the maximum safe speed for everyone, and nothing to do with my reactions being too slow." Is it because they don't want to have to admit to themselves that they shouldn't be driving anymore? Are they that stupid, offensive and reluctant to blame themselves in the rest of their lives as well?
The problem with bad driving allegations from one person is that its very subjective thats why you need 2 or more to run a 'job' or to witness it yourself. However you may not be the only person who rings it in. If there are 2 or 3 other who have then the matter will probably get looked at.
Problem is that one person's "bad driving" is another person's "safe progress" - we've had posts galore about the people who flash their lights at you after perfectly safe overtakes, so to them, it obviously wasn't safe. So what if they phone in and "shop" you? What if people phone in because they think you're speeding just because your car is a bit louder than they are used to?
OK the cops might not be able to nick you but it could put you on the "radar" for the future.
If you drive any distance at all, you're guaranteed to see at least one example of "bad driving". Sometimes it directly affects you, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes it's deliberate aggression, sometimes it's just stupidity. Sometimes (and this is the bit that's hard to admit) it's you who's made a mistake, more usually it's somebody else.
So?
I don't think that this whole business of "reporting bad driving" should be encouraged at all, and it's small wonder that the police have time to take it seriously, unless they get a number of reports at the same time.
Personally I wouldn't bother. I can't think of one single time when I've phoned in about "bad driving". I've seen plenty though!
OK the cops might not be able to nick you but it could put you on the "radar" for the future.
If you drive any distance at all, you're guaranteed to see at least one example of "bad driving". Sometimes it directly affects you, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes it's deliberate aggression, sometimes it's just stupidity. Sometimes (and this is the bit that's hard to admit) it's you who's made a mistake, more usually it's somebody else.
So?
I don't think that this whole business of "reporting bad driving" should be encouraged at all, and it's small wonder that the police have time to take it seriously, unless they get a number of reports at the same time.
Personally I wouldn't bother. I can't think of one single time when I've phoned in about "bad driving". I've seen plenty though!
As a trucker, I reported or attempted to report other truckers 3 times to no avail. One was a spanish truck that (literally, I'm not exaggerating) was veering between the hardshoulder and lane 3. The guy was either high on drugs or pissed or both and with a alck of sleep no doubt. I tried to get alongside him and stop him, which would probably have been foolish but this was 20 years ago and I was young at the time. I followed this truck for miles and miles, watching it constantly crossing all 2 lanes and the hard shoulder. At one point a BMW had to squeeze between the truck and the central barrier at speed to get by. I kept following him, in the hope of seeing a police car whose attention I could attract, but I didn't see one. Eventually I stopped at an emergency phone and called in. I was so shocked at what I had been seeing that I could scarecely breathe. I was able to give the trucks reg. no and a description. I was asked if I would be prepared to go to court as a witness and I said I would, but I heard nothing about it.
On another occasion I saw two french trucks running nose to tail in lane 3 at about 75 mph both gassing on their cb radios. I was just leaving a services and there was a small police base there with a police car outside. I knocked on the doors, banged on the windows, got no response. I used the emergency phone that was outside, it didn't work.
I witnessed a Mr Kipling delivery van almost crush a group of school kids and moms against a wall when he turned round. It was only the action of a mom who pushed everyone out of the way that prevented a tragedy. I couldn't catch up with the van, but when I got back to my base I phoned the police and told them it was a Mr Kipling truck outside suchandsuch shop in xyz village at 10.40 am etc etc. Was I prepared to go to court over it? No, it doesn't need to go to court, it just needs you to speak to the driver and exoplain what he had done (I don't think the driver was aware) and tell him not to do it agai. But it seemed unless I was prepared to go to court they weren't prepared to do anything about it.
Then there was my own experience when my own vehicle was hit as I described before.
The road where I have worked for the last 10+ years is a dc, the A38 between Sutton Coldfield and Lichfield. There has been a good number of serious accidents with approx a dozen fatalities in my time there. A van full of hippies broke down one day, just around a bend. This was weeks after a tractor driver was nearly killed when a tipper lorry ran into it at the same location. I phoned the police on the number I had stored in my phone to tell them about it. I got passed from pillar to post adn when I did speak to somebody he didn't seem to know where the road is. This dc apparently has one side of the road belonging to one patch and the other side to another patch, one side is in staffordshire and t'other in west mids, it seems. Either way, the police didn't attend.
One of our tipper lorries broke down on that road one day, but on a stretch where it was in full visibility (I posted before about this at the time). I stopped and we considered me towing him down hill into the quarry, but we decided against it, a) because my chain was only about 6 foot long, b) his engine had died and there was the possibility he would run out of air, plus he had no power steering, and c) we both knew very clearlythat if anything happened due to us trying to make the road safer, even if someone ran into us for no good reason, we both knew that as lorry drivers we would get the blame, so we left it as it was and he stood behind the truck giving warning. So what happened? Two cars came down the dc and wouldn't giver way to each other, to the point where they reached the truck, couldn't get through and so both stopped. behind them was a biker giving it the max, and hadn't noticed what was happening until too late. When he saw the stationary cars he knew he couldn't stop so dropped the bike. The bike slid under the truck and the biker slid into the cars and broke his legs. This was in the 10 mins between me leaving him and the breakdown van getting there. The tipper driver was cautioned by the police that he may be prosecuted for failing to inform the police that he had broken down on such a dangerous road.
On another occasion I was in my car with my wife when another car changed lanes and almost shoved us into some traffic lights. I managed to get his number and the number of the car behind me. We went to the police, made a statement etc. Nothing happened, apparently the driver behind me claimed he saw nothing. When at the police station though, I did manage to get full view of the offending drivers name & address though.
Having said all this though, one thing I have noticed when out on the roads, that approx 99% of usages of a car horn are numpty, ie either spurious or being sounded by the person who was in the wrong in the first place. If every person who blew their horns went to the police, the police would be wasting their time for 99% of the time, IMO.
On another occasion I saw two french trucks running nose to tail in lane 3 at about 75 mph both gassing on their cb radios. I was just leaving a services and there was a small police base there with a police car outside. I knocked on the doors, banged on the windows, got no response. I used the emergency phone that was outside, it didn't work.
I witnessed a Mr Kipling delivery van almost crush a group of school kids and moms against a wall when he turned round. It was only the action of a mom who pushed everyone out of the way that prevented a tragedy. I couldn't catch up with the van, but when I got back to my base I phoned the police and told them it was a Mr Kipling truck outside suchandsuch shop in xyz village at 10.40 am etc etc. Was I prepared to go to court over it? No, it doesn't need to go to court, it just needs you to speak to the driver and exoplain what he had done (I don't think the driver was aware) and tell him not to do it agai. But it seemed unless I was prepared to go to court they weren't prepared to do anything about it.
Then there was my own experience when my own vehicle was hit as I described before.
The road where I have worked for the last 10+ years is a dc, the A38 between Sutton Coldfield and Lichfield. There has been a good number of serious accidents with approx a dozen fatalities in my time there. A van full of hippies broke down one day, just around a bend. This was weeks after a tractor driver was nearly killed when a tipper lorry ran into it at the same location. I phoned the police on the number I had stored in my phone to tell them about it. I got passed from pillar to post adn when I did speak to somebody he didn't seem to know where the road is. This dc apparently has one side of the road belonging to one patch and the other side to another patch, one side is in staffordshire and t'other in west mids, it seems. Either way, the police didn't attend.
One of our tipper lorries broke down on that road one day, but on a stretch where it was in full visibility (I posted before about this at the time). I stopped and we considered me towing him down hill into the quarry, but we decided against it, a) because my chain was only about 6 foot long, b) his engine had died and there was the possibility he would run out of air, plus he had no power steering, and c) we both knew very clearlythat if anything happened due to us trying to make the road safer, even if someone ran into us for no good reason, we both knew that as lorry drivers we would get the blame, so we left it as it was and he stood behind the truck giving warning. So what happened? Two cars came down the dc and wouldn't giver way to each other, to the point where they reached the truck, couldn't get through and so both stopped. behind them was a biker giving it the max, and hadn't noticed what was happening until too late. When he saw the stationary cars he knew he couldn't stop so dropped the bike. The bike slid under the truck and the biker slid into the cars and broke his legs. This was in the 10 mins between me leaving him and the breakdown van getting there. The tipper driver was cautioned by the police that he may be prosecuted for failing to inform the police that he had broken down on such a dangerous road.
On another occasion I was in my car with my wife when another car changed lanes and almost shoved us into some traffic lights. I managed to get his number and the number of the car behind me. We went to the police, made a statement etc. Nothing happened, apparently the driver behind me claimed he saw nothing. When at the police station though, I did manage to get full view of the offending drivers name & address though.
Having said all this though, one thing I have noticed when out on the roads, that approx 99% of usages of a car horn are numpty, ie either spurious or being sounded by the person who was in the wrong in the first place. If every person who blew their horns went to the police, the police would be wasting their time for 99% of the time, IMO.
Heebeegeetee said:
As a trucker, I reported or attempted to report other truckers 3 times to no avail. One was a spanish truck that (literally, I'm not exaggerating) was veering between the hardshoulder and lane 3. The guy was either high on drugs or pissed or both and with a alck of sleep no doubt. I tried to get alongside him and stop him, which would probably have been foolish but this was 20 years ago and I was young at the time. I followed this truck for miles and miles, watching it constantly crossing all 2 lanes and the hard shoulder. At one point a BMW had to squeeze between the truck and the central barrier at speed to get by. I kept following him, in the hope of seeing a police car whose attention I could attract, but I didn't see one. Eventually I stopped at an emergency phone and called in. I was so shocked at what I had been seeing that I could scarecely breathe. I was able to give the trucks reg. no and a description. I was asked if I would be prepared to go to court as a witness and I said I would, but I heard nothing about it.
Just means that 20 years ago they could not find the vehicle.Heebeegeetee said:
On another occasion I saw two french trucks running nose to tail in lane 3 at about 75 mph both gassing on their cb radios. I was just leaving a services and there was a small police base there with a police car outside. I knocked on the doors, banged on the windows, got no response. I used the emergency phone that was outside, it didn't work.
No-one was working there that day? Did you report the phone as not working? Heebeegeetee said:
I witnessed a Mr Kipling delivery van almost crush a group of school kids and moms against a wall when he turned round. It was only the action of a mom who pushed everyone out of the way that prevented a tragedy. I couldn't catch up with the van, but when I got back to my base I phoned the police and told them it was a Mr Kipling truck outside suchandsuch shop in xyz village at 10.40 am etc etc. Was I prepared to go to court over it? No, it doesn't need to go to court, it just needs you to speak to the driver and exoplain what he had done (I don't think the driver was aware) and tell him not to do it agai. But it seemed unless I was prepared to go to court they weren't prepared to do anything about it.
Dangerous driving. The police wanted to deal with it. You were not willing to provide evidence. How is that the fault of the police? We can't just have a word with no evidence. If we do that then they deny they did it whats achieved? A lorry driver doing that sort of dangerous manouvre should be dealt with.Heebeegeetee said:
Then there was my own experience when my own vehicle was hit as I described before.
The road where I have worked for the last 10+ years is a dc, the A38 between Sutton Coldfield and Lichfield. There has been a good number of serious accidents with approx a dozen fatalities in my time there. A van full of hippies broke down one day, just around a bend. This was weeks after a tractor driver was nearly killed when a tipper lorry ran into it at the same location. I phoned the police on the number I had stored in my phone to tell them about it. I got passed from pillar to post adn when I did speak to somebody he didn't seem to know where the road is. This dc apparently has one side of the road belonging to one patch and the other side to another patch, one side is in staffordshire and t'other in west mids, it seems. Either way, the police didn't attend.
Why didn't you ring 999 if it was that dangerous? How do you know they didn't attend or for what reason?The road where I have worked for the last 10+ years is a dc, the A38 between Sutton Coldfield and Lichfield. There has been a good number of serious accidents with approx a dozen fatalities in my time there. A van full of hippies broke down one day, just around a bend. This was weeks after a tractor driver was nearly killed when a tipper lorry ran into it at the same location. I phoned the police on the number I had stored in my phone to tell them about it. I got passed from pillar to post adn when I did speak to somebody he didn't seem to know where the road is. This dc apparently has one side of the road belonging to one patch and the other side to another patch, one side is in staffordshire and t'other in west mids, it seems. Either way, the police didn't attend.
Heebeegeetee said:
One of our tipper lorries broke down on that road one day, but on a stretch where it was in full visibility (I posted before about this at the time). I stopped and we considered me towing him down hill into the quarry, but we decided against it, a) because my chain was only about 6 foot long, b) his engine had died and there was the possibility he would run out of air, plus he had no power steering, and c) we both knew very clearlythat if anything happened due to us trying to make the road safer, even if someone ran into us for no good reason, we both knew that as lorry drivers we would get the blame, so we left it as it was and he stood behind the truck giving warning. So what happened? Two cars came down the dc and wouldn't giver way to each other, to the point where they reached the truck, couldn't get through and so both stopped. behind them was a biker giving it the max, and hadn't noticed what was happening until too late. When he saw the stationary cars he knew he couldn't stop so dropped the bike. The bike slid under the truck and the biker slid into the cars and broke his legs. This was in the 10 mins between me leaving him and the breakdown van getting there. The tipper driver was cautioned by the police that he may be prosecuted for failing to inform the police that he had broken down on such a dangerous road.
So you hadn't told the police? Cautioned or told by officers at the scene that he should have told them. You don't get a caution for a vehicle in a dangerous position you get points and a fine.Heebeegeetee said:
On another occasion I was in my car with my wife when another car changed lanes and almost shoved us into some traffic lights. I managed to get his number and the number of the car behind me. We went to the police, made a statement etc. Nothing happened, apparently the driver behind me claimed he saw nothing. When at the police station though, I did manage to get full view of the offending drivers name & address though.
So the police investigated the incident. Your witness said nothing happened that he saw. So there is no independant evidence of an offence and in fact the witness supports the other chaps story. Not sure what your complaint is? The police did investigate. Is it against the inattentive other driver?I'm not trying to be argumentative. Just pointing out that there are two sides to every incident and sometimes there are reasons things don't happen. The implication in this thread is its police being lazy that things don't get done. When reading what you said I don't think it is as straight forward as that.
Mr Annie, I haven't time to do the multi-quote thing and reply to your every point, in most of which you are either wrong or you miss the point.
I'm just an ordinary bod who had done a few miles over the past 30 years. I dare say there are thousand s like me. There's no reason to not believe that everyone who does a lot of miles has similar stories.
I dare say you could also pull apart every single point made by every single person, which is quite a feat as aperson who wasn't there at each particular time. So you might persuade yourself that in each and every incident, the police were entirely correct and the members of the public were wrong, in each and every single occasion.
Look, I don't blame you guys on the ground, I blame your politicised chief constables. They are looking after their pensions and positions, and they are not looking after you or me. I think the same of our Army Officers, who complicitly allow their soldiers to go into battle underequipped. The officers are gutless so-and-sos who again are putting themselves first.
I believe even that general Sir Mike Jackson only started complaining after he had retired and had thus secured his pension.
I'm just an ordinary bod who had done a few miles over the past 30 years. I dare say there are thousand s like me. There's no reason to not believe that everyone who does a lot of miles has similar stories.
I dare say you could also pull apart every single point made by every single person, which is quite a feat as aperson who wasn't there at each particular time. So you might persuade yourself that in each and every incident, the police were entirely correct and the members of the public were wrong, in each and every single occasion.
Look, I don't blame you guys on the ground, I blame your politicised chief constables. They are looking after their pensions and positions, and they are not looking after you or me. I think the same of our Army Officers, who complicitly allow their soldiers to go into battle underequipped. The officers are gutless so-and-sos who again are putting themselves first.
I believe even that general Sir Mike Jackson only started complaining after he had retired and had thus secured his pension.
Heebeegeetee said:
I believe even that general Sir Mike Jackson only started complaining after he had retired and had thus secured his pension.
Publicly, yes. Because 'dissent in the ranks' would be considered far more seriously than what he did do. I can understand it - it takes a very big man to speak up against his employer, when that man has a family to support, and even more so when that employer is the state and all he's ever known as a job. Don't think I could.
But that said, from what I understand Sir MJ was a very good leader who did as much as he could for those under his command...almost certainly the complete opposite of the likes of Sir Ian Blair, who's wriggled out of more fiasco's than a politician through passing the buck and ignoring the facts.
More importantly, the issue nowadays is that the 'politicisation' of the services (Emergency and Armed) is slowly spreading downwards...whereas before it was only the very very top that dealt directly with politicians that needed to 'play games' (and even then the principled ones refused to, if you go back before I was born), now it's regional Chief Constables and their ilk...
"look after #1" has become this country's mantra and we're suffering because of it...*
- Industry as well, but it just happens that the state is where it affects the most people the most directly.
Heebeegeetee said:
Mr Annie, I haven't time to do the multi-quote thing and reply to your every point, in most of which you are either wrong or you miss the point.
I'm just an ordinary bod who had done a few miles over the past 30 years. I dare say there are thousand s like me. There's no reason to not believe that everyone who does a lot of miles has similar stories.
I dare say you could also pull apart every single point made by every single person, which is quite a feat as aperson who wasn't there at each particular time. So you might persuade yourself that in each and every incident, the police were entirely correct and the members of the public were wrong, in each and every single occasion.
Look, I don't blame you guys on the ground, I blame your politicised chief constables. They are looking after their pensions and positions, and they are not looking after you or me. I think the same of our Army Officers, who complicitly allow their soldiers to go into battle underequipped. The officers are gutless so-and-sos who again are putting themselves first.
I believe even that general Sir Mike Jackson only started complaining after he had retired and had thus secured his pension.
I don't normaly take the time however you made a number of points which were part of a thread that aimed criticism at the police for failing to deal with bad driving so never report it. You quoted a number of incidents as examples. I pointed out that there are other views to what you have said and some of the things are not correct. You will not be given a police caution for parking a car in a dangerous place is one example. I'm just an ordinary bod who had done a few miles over the past 30 years. I dare say there are thousand s like me. There's no reason to not believe that everyone who does a lot of miles has similar stories.
I dare say you could also pull apart every single point made by every single person, which is quite a feat as aperson who wasn't there at each particular time. So you might persuade yourself that in each and every incident, the police were entirely correct and the members of the public were wrong, in each and every single occasion.
Look, I don't blame you guys on the ground, I blame your politicised chief constables. They are looking after their pensions and positions, and they are not looking after you or me. I think the same of our Army Officers, who complicitly allow their soldiers to go into battle underequipped. The officers are gutless so-and-sos who again are putting themselves first.
I believe even that general Sir Mike Jackson only started complaining after he had retired and had thus secured his pension.
The police are not always rights but on one incident you refused to to support a police prosecution of a dangerous driver and on another your witness said nothing happened so they are to blame not the police. Thats what you said, yet you blame the police for inaction.
You have a view. I'm giving the view I formed based on the information you provided me of the incidents.
The dangerous driving you refer to was a van driver (you normally get no training to drive a van remember ) did something that he wasn't aware of. All that was needed was for the guy to recieve a visit from a local policeman and to have his error pointed out to him. The driver would probably have the mick taken from his mates and hopefully the message would sink in.
I don't agree that the ONLY course of action available is to have the driver prosecuted. In any case, I would expect one of the moms to have also reported the incident, maybe he was prosecuted, I don't know. But for myself, that wasn't necessary. But it did seem to me from speaking to the police officer when I reported it, that they'd only take action if I took time off work which would have cost me a lot of money and to have this guy dragged through the courts. We all make mistakes, there is no need for every mistake made by every driver to result in court action. The guy was totally unaware of what he had done. The police have the resources to take the correct action and its what we pay them to do.
With the spanish truck, which wouldn't have been at all hard to find, I did say that I would support court action 'cos this case was really serious, and STILL no action was taken that I was aware of.
Re the other case, you completely miss my point. I said that from the police I was able to get the other guys name and home address. I could have taken action of my own if I was of that nature. Whether my getting the info was deliberate or through incompetance, I don't know. I think I prefer to think it was deliberate, was that the worse of two evils?
If it was through incompetance, then we need to bear this in mind if we make a complaint to the police, 'cos it could be our info that the police pass on, wilfully or otherwise.
I don't agree that the ONLY course of action available is to have the driver prosecuted. In any case, I would expect one of the moms to have also reported the incident, maybe he was prosecuted, I don't know. But for myself, that wasn't necessary. But it did seem to me from speaking to the police officer when I reported it, that they'd only take action if I took time off work which would have cost me a lot of money and to have this guy dragged through the courts. We all make mistakes, there is no need for every mistake made by every driver to result in court action. The guy was totally unaware of what he had done. The police have the resources to take the correct action and its what we pay them to do.
With the spanish truck, which wouldn't have been at all hard to find, I did say that I would support court action 'cos this case was really serious, and STILL no action was taken that I was aware of.
Re the other case, you completely miss my point. I said that from the police I was able to get the other guys name and home address. I could have taken action of my own if I was of that nature. Whether my getting the info was deliberate or through incompetance, I don't know. I think I prefer to think it was deliberate, was that the worse of two evils?
If it was through incompetance, then we need to bear this in mind if we make a complaint to the police, 'cos it could be our info that the police pass on, wilfully or otherwise.
Heebeegeetee said:
The dangerous driving you refer to was a van driver (you normally get no training to drive a van remember ) did something that he wasn't aware of. All that was needed was for the guy to recieve a visit from a local policeman and to have his error pointed out to him. The driver would probably have the mick taken from his mates and hopefully the message would sink in.
I don't agree that the ONLY course of action available is to have the driver prosecuted. In any case, I would expect one of the moms to have also reported the incident, maybe he was prosecuted, I don't know. But for myself, that wasn't necessary. But it did seem to me from speaking to the police officer when I reported it, that they'd only take action if I took time off work which would have cost me a lot of money and to have this guy dragged through the courts. We all make mistakes, there is no need for every mistake made by every driver to result in court action. The guy was totally unaware of what he had done. The police have the resources to take the correct action and its what we pay them to do.
With the spanish truck, which wouldn't have been at all hard to find, I did say that I would support court action 'cos this case was really serious, and STILL no action was taken that I was aware of.
Re the other case, you completely miss my point. I said that from the police I was able to get the other guys name and home address. I could have taken action of my own if I was of that nature. Whether my getting the info was deliberate or through incompetance, I don't know. I think I prefer to think it was deliberate, was that the worse of two evils?
If it was through incompetance, then we need to bear this in mind if we make a complaint to the police, 'cos it could be our info that the police pass on, wilfully or otherwise.
In your view the correct action was A, the person you pay to uphold the law thought the correct action is B. Its not down to someone reporting an act as to the outcome. You can suggest an outcome but you cannot demand one. In my view someone nearly reversing over children should be dealt with. With regards your second point I would hope you got the information through accident. Especially as it appears a witness saw nothing wrong in what happened. I don't agree that the ONLY course of action available is to have the driver prosecuted. In any case, I would expect one of the moms to have also reported the incident, maybe he was prosecuted, I don't know. But for myself, that wasn't necessary. But it did seem to me from speaking to the police officer when I reported it, that they'd only take action if I took time off work which would have cost me a lot of money and to have this guy dragged through the courts. We all make mistakes, there is no need for every mistake made by every driver to result in court action. The guy was totally unaware of what he had done. The police have the resources to take the correct action and its what we pay them to do.
With the spanish truck, which wouldn't have been at all hard to find, I did say that I would support court action 'cos this case was really serious, and STILL no action was taken that I was aware of.
Re the other case, you completely miss my point. I said that from the police I was able to get the other guys name and home address. I could have taken action of my own if I was of that nature. Whether my getting the info was deliberate or through incompetance, I don't know. I think I prefer to think it was deliberate, was that the worse of two evils?
If it was through incompetance, then we need to bear this in mind if we make a complaint to the police, 'cos it could be our info that the police pass on, wilfully or otherwise.
Mr_annie_vxr said:
In your view the correct action was A, the person you pay to uphold the law thought the correct action is B. Its not down to someone reporting an act as to the outcome. You can suggest an outcome but you cannot demand one. In my view someone nearly reversing over children should be dealt with. With regards your second point I would hope you got the information through accident. Especially as it appears a witness saw nothing wrong in what happened.
In 'my' incident, I was in 3 lanes of busy traffic crossing a major junction when the car to my left changed lanes. I swerved and braked to a halt with the nose of my car an inch off the traffic lights. It was the nearest I've ever come to making contact with another car. The car behind had to stop, and then was able to go around me. I got my wife to take the numbers of both cars. The driver of the car behind clearly didn't want to be involved, perhaps he had had experience of such matters and knew it'd come to nowt anyway.The van driver: Like I say, van drivers rarely get trained for their work. I didn't, and I can also say that the training for the HGV licence is minimal, its literally the least that can be got away with. In my own case the lorry I learnt to drive in and passed my test in bore no relationship to anything I drove subsequently, but it was all I could afford at the time, and it was bloody expensive. So, we have all these untrained drivers out there, and when something goes wrong, we hammer the untrained driver, take his licence off him or throw him in the clink in bad cases, and then put the next untrained driver in his place. The van driver I saw simply hadn't realised what he'd done. Yes, you could have taken him off the road, but who's to say the next driver would be any better? Why not point out to the first driver what he did wrong, and let him learn?
I've changed jobs recently and have gone back to doing distance. I haven't done this for 20 years and so I too am inexperienced. I've joined an agency and have chosen to work nights as the roads are quiet and I can get on and learn. God, trucks have changed over 20 years. However, its all working out fine, I've learnt a lot and am very happy with how things are working out. I'm getting paid quite well too.
But I've noticed that there are hardly any drivers out there under 35, and in an age where we can still be predujiced against age, I'm certainly working with an older set of people than I'm used to. Its expensive now to get a class 1 hgv licence, so I guess that younger people just can't afford to do it.
This probably explains the number of foreign trucks on our roads. Indeed, the only youngish drivers I have spoken to have been foreign. The other day, I was working for a prime, household name supermarket. There were 2 young Polish driver in the waiting room working via an agency for this supermarket. One spoke English, the other didn't. So the one who spoke english was asking questions of another (English, old) agency driver, and was then translating the answers to his friend who was writing the answers in a notebook.
I felt for the guy. Here he was, in a foreign country, not speaking the language and yet trying to make his way in the world. I'm sure we all remember what it was like starting out in life, in the world of work and trying to leave home and all that sort of thing. To do it in a foreign country must be twice as hard, and to not speak the language as well, blimey.
But if, in the strain of it all, it goes pear shaped for him and he hurts someone, then like I say, jump on him like a ton of bricks, and then get the next untrained, foreign, non-english speaking driver behind the wheel.
What a way to go on. There must be a better way.
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