Chief Constable becomes a Victim of Crime
Discussion
Courtesy of Aunty Beeb's web site today....
Chief constable's briefcase taken
It is the second time Mr Todd has been a victim of crime
A briefcase containing documents and personal items has been stolen from the boot of a chief constable's car.
Raiders also made off with a uniform and a side-handle baton belonging to the Chief Constable of Greater Manchester Police, Mike Todd.
The raid took place outside his flat in Manchester city centre on Monday. No items of a "sensitive nature" were taken, a police spokesman said.
In 2002, burglars stole electrical equipment from Mr Todd's flat.
'No laptop'
A Greater Manchester Police spokesman said: "At about 2315 BST on Monday, a car being used by the chief constable was broken into in a Manchester city centre car park.
"Stolen from the boot of the car were items of uniform and a briefcase.
"The briefcase contained papers and personal items. There were no items of a personal or a sensitive nature stolen and no laptop computer was stolen."
The spokesman said Mr Todd would not be commenting on the incident.
Not long after Mr Todd joined the force in 2002 he returned to his Manchester flat to find a window had been broken and a small amount of electrical equipment taken.
Some of Mr Todd's neighbours were also burgled recently but it was not thought his home was specifically targeted.
Mr Todd joined Greater Manchester Police in October 2002 from the Metropolitan Police.
The question is...what is the CC doing with a side-handle baton off duty and is it an offensive weapon in the circumstances (eh, that's two questions...sorry).
After all, the baton is intended for "protection" and "assault" two words that go hand in glove for most 'protection aids' found in scrotes cars and resulting in arrest...indeed the "it's for my own protection" is the ultimate cough when questioned about the claw hammer, baseball bat or kitchen knife under the car seat.
Edited because I can't speel
Chief constable's briefcase taken
It is the second time Mr Todd has been a victim of crime
A briefcase containing documents and personal items has been stolen from the boot of a chief constable's car.
Raiders also made off with a uniform and a side-handle baton belonging to the Chief Constable of Greater Manchester Police, Mike Todd.
The raid took place outside his flat in Manchester city centre on Monday. No items of a "sensitive nature" were taken, a police spokesman said.
In 2002, burglars stole electrical equipment from Mr Todd's flat.
'No laptop'
A Greater Manchester Police spokesman said: "At about 2315 BST on Monday, a car being used by the chief constable was broken into in a Manchester city centre car park.
"Stolen from the boot of the car were items of uniform and a briefcase.
"The briefcase contained papers and personal items. There were no items of a personal or a sensitive nature stolen and no laptop computer was stolen."
The spokesman said Mr Todd would not be commenting on the incident.
Not long after Mr Todd joined the force in 2002 he returned to his Manchester flat to find a window had been broken and a small amount of electrical equipment taken.
Some of Mr Todd's neighbours were also burgled recently but it was not thought his home was specifically targeted.
Mr Todd joined Greater Manchester Police in October 2002 from the Metropolitan Police.
The question is...what is the CC doing with a side-handle baton off duty and is it an offensive weapon in the circumstances (eh, that's two questions...sorry).
After all, the baton is intended for "protection" and "assault" two words that go hand in glove for most 'protection aids' found in scrotes cars and resulting in arrest...indeed the "it's for my own protection" is the ultimate cough when questioned about the claw hammer, baseball bat or kitchen knife under the car seat.
Edited because I can't speel
Edited by XMG5 on Friday 7th September 08:35
I agree he was daft to leave it in the car, but there is no reason he should not have it off duty.
I often used to cary my ASP off duty, especially if I had an early start the next morning and my destination was miles from my locker........
Or would you prefer officers spent hours of duty time driving around collecting their equipment....
I often used to cary my ASP off duty, especially if I had an early start the next morning and my destination was miles from my locker........
Or would you prefer officers spent hours of duty time driving around collecting their equipment....
Chrispy Porker said:
I agree he was daft to leave it in the car, but there is no reason he should not have it off duty.
I often used to cary my ASP off duty, especially if I had an early start the next morning and my destination was miles from my locker........
Or would you prefer officers spent hours of duty time driving around collecting their equipment....
Not at all, I am just wondering whether the law relating to possessing an offencive weapon in a public place allows the police officer to be in possession of his baton when not engaged in police duty. If the baton is being carried in his car, off duty, why isn't it an offensive weapon?I often used to cary my ASP off duty, especially if I had an early start the next morning and my destination was miles from my locker........
Or would you prefer officers spent hours of duty time driving around collecting their equipment....
I'm not sure that the ASP is any different. Convenience is not a defence IMHO. When we were off duty our CS Spray had to be clipped to the inside of our secure (locked) changing room locker.
As the side-handle baton and ASP are intended for assault to 'subdue' and/or for self defence, then I would be interested to know what allows for their possession off duty and away from the job.
Perhaps someone with legal training can clarify the exceptions that may apply? If indeed there are any?
Edited by XMG5 on Friday 7th September 09:37
XMG5 said:
Not at all, I am just wondering whether the law relating to possessing an offencive weapon in a public place allows the police officer to be in possession of his baton when not engaged in police duty. If the baton is being carried in his car, off duty, why isn't it an offensive weapon?
But you'd expect an off duty copper to jump in if a crime was happening (and I believe that'd be in teh poop if they didn't?Besides, I doubt a CC's been baton charging hoodies for a good few years
well it all goes down to 'lawful authority' - I would argue that. Or 'reasonable excuse' - the circs I have described also cover that.
The point is daft really. When I was issued with a truncheon at the stores and had to take it to Training school in Dorset, I did this in my own time, off duty.
Are you suggesting I acted illegally before day one of training?
the point with CS is that it is a firearm rather than purely an 'offensive weapon' therefore is treated differently.
The point is daft really. When I was issued with a truncheon at the stores and had to take it to Training school in Dorset, I did this in my own time, off duty.
Are you suggesting I acted illegally before day one of training?
the point with CS is that it is a firearm rather than purely an 'offensive weapon' therefore is treated differently.
Chrispy Porker said:
well it all goes down to 'lawful authority' - I would argue that. Or 'reasonable excuse' - the circs I have described also cover that.
The point is daft really. When I was issued with a truncheon at the stores and had to take it to Training school in Dorset, I did this in my own time, off duty.
Are you suggesting I acted illegally before day one of training?
the point with CS is that it is a firearm rather than purely an 'offensive weapon' therefore is treated differently.
Mmm good point. But just wondering that's all.The point is daft really. When I was issued with a truncheon at the stores and had to take it to Training school in Dorset, I did this in my own time, off duty.
Are you suggesting I acted illegally before day one of training?
the point with CS is that it is a firearm rather than purely an 'offensive weapon' therefore is treated differently.
As police officers are not ever 'off duty' and depending on role requirements then equipment may be at home or in your car as your travelling between stations or if your working somewhere different each day. I sometimes have all my iit at home as I work from multiple sites.
As such no specific offence, however should you use such items in a road rage incident or outside your line of duty then it would be a huge aggravating factor. Police officers as you well know have certain exemptions due to the nature of the role.
As such no specific offence, however should you use such items in a road rage incident or outside your line of duty then it would be a huge aggravating factor. Police officers as you well know have certain exemptions due to the nature of the role.
Bing o said:
XMG5 said:
Not at all, I am just wondering whether the law relating to possessing an offencive weapon in a public place allows the police officer to be in possession of his baton when not engaged in police duty. If the baton is being carried in his car, off duty, why isn't it an offensive weapon?
But you'd expect an off duty copper to jump in if a crime was happening (and I believe that'd be in teh poop if they didn't?Besides, I doubt a CC's been baton charging hoodies for a good few years
Edited by XMG5 on Friday 7th September 09:53
Mr_annie_vxr said:
As police officers are not ever 'off duty' and depending on role requirements then equipment may be at home or in your car as your travelling between stations or if your working somewhere different each day. I sometimes have all my iit at home as I work from multiple sites.
As such no specific offence, however should you use such items in a road rage incident or outside your line of duty then it would be a huge aggravating factor. Police officers as you well know have certain exemptions due to the nature of the role.
Damn it!! Another good point! As such no specific offence, however should you use such items in a road rage incident or outside your line of duty then it would be a huge aggravating factor. Police officers as you well know have certain exemptions due to the nature of the role.
Chrispy Porker said:
well it all goes down to 'lawful authority' - I would argue that. Or 'reasonable excuse' - the circs I have described also cover that.
A copper will easily have a reasonable excuse to carry what would otherwise be offensive weapons as they are expected to tackle crooks even when "off duty".Police, at all times, should maintain a relationship with the public that gives reality to the historic tradition that the police are the public and the public are the police; the police being only members of the public who are paid to give full-time attention to duties which are incumbent on every citizen in the interests of community welfare and existence.
Jules360 said:
vonhosen said:
lgw said:
You don’t honestly believe coppers jump in when off duty ?
They can get disciplined where they don't.Forums | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff