Need an informed police opinion
Discussion
On another thread regarding fog lamps there was an argument as to wether rear high vis lights should be used in heavy spray.
I believe when road spray is bad that it is vital to use your rear high vis (fog) lamps.
Others have argued forcibly that they are only to be used in FOG
I argue that they should be used in reduced visibility wether that is caused by FOG or ROAD SPRAY.
Can Bib give me a definative answer.
Many have said I am wrong and using them in spray dazzles
I reply that being so close to be dazzled in heavy spray only proves that they are driving too close for the dangerous conditions
I believe when road spray is bad that it is vital to use your rear high vis (fog) lamps.
Others have argued forcibly that they are only to be used in FOG
I argue that they should be used in reduced visibility wether that is caused by FOG or ROAD SPRAY.
Can Bib give me a definative answer.
Many have said I am wrong and using them in spray dazzles
I reply that being so close to be dazzled in heavy spray only proves that they are driving too close for the dangerous conditions
There was a bit of confusion in the other thread between front and rear fog lights. I thought this was the best answer:
The worst thing I find about the sea of bright red light being used inappropriately is how it masks brake lamps, which you really should be able to see.
japhilip said:
I haven't seen visibility bad enough yet this year to warrant fog lights. Using them at night is unnecessary, unless you're the only vehicle on the road, and you wish to make the rear of your car more visibile for traffic approaching from behind. When they catch up, it's courteous to switch them off and not blind the guy behind.
My view is, you only need (rear) fog lights if you can't see the car behind or in front (therefore they can't see you, and the high intensity lamp is to help improve visibility of your vehicle). If you can see several vehicles in a row in front, you don't need fog lamps. Period.
I see many people using them on the motorways, even when visibility is only slightly reduced, all it does is generates lots of red glare reducing visibility for following road users even more as it makes it much more difficult to see past the car with fog lamps on.
The highway code sets it out nicely, read it and stick to it.
I only use the rear fogs in fog (strangely enough) when it's so heavy I can't see any cars approaching at the rear. Once it's evident that the driver behind can see me, I turn them off again to avoid dazzling him.My view is, you only need (rear) fog lights if you can't see the car behind or in front (therefore they can't see you, and the high intensity lamp is to help improve visibility of your vehicle). If you can see several vehicles in a row in front, you don't need fog lamps. Period.
I see many people using them on the motorways, even when visibility is only slightly reduced, all it does is generates lots of red glare reducing visibility for following road users even more as it makes it much more difficult to see past the car with fog lamps on.
The highway code sets it out nicely, read it and stick to it.
The worst thing I find about the sea of bright red light being used inappropriately is how it masks brake lamps, which you really should be able to see.
oggs said:
Guess you've found out that fog lights should only be used in fog 
If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
Are you an officer?If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
It doesn't need to be raining for surface water to create a bad visibility spray hazzard .Rain could have just passed over.
mark69sheer said:
oggs said:
Guess you've found out that fog lights should only be used in fog
If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
Are you an officer?If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
It doesn't need to be raining for surface water to create a bad visibility spray hazzard .Rain could have just passed over.
Toting up north of 300,000 miles I would have to say I can't ever think of a time when visability has been reduced to the extent where I have used my rear fog light(s) other than in fairly foggy circumstances or when the rain has been torential. Lights yes, high intensity lights? no.
oggs said:
Guess you've found out that fog lights should only be used in fog
If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
ok so what if unlike your answer above. . If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
There is lots of spray and you CAN'T see the road ahead clearly?
It has always been my understanding that high intensity lighting should be [u]used in conditions of severely reduced visibility.[/u] That to me would includes heavy fog, smoke and extremely heavy spray conditions for example passing an HGV. If there's excessive spray when I'm passing a large vehicle, I'll use my bright lights to give the driver of the vehicle behind a point of referrence then extinguish them as soon as I can see they've emerged from the 'cloud'.
I like to think I use the lighting on my car responsibly to see and be seen and don't use them as a matter of course for when there's a little bit of mist or such like.
So I'm very much of the opinion that if you can'tclearly see other vehicles then it's prudent to advertise your presence.
I like to think I use the lighting on my car responsibly to see and be seen and don't use them as a matter of course for when there's a little bit of mist or such like.
So I'm very much of the opinion that if you can'tclearly see other vehicles then it's prudent to advertise your presence.
mark69sheer said:
oggs said:
Guess you've found out that fog lights should only be used in fog
If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
ok so what if unlike your answer above. . If someone has their fog lights on when it is raining I flash them to turn them off, why should I be dazzled by them??? If i can clearly see the road ahead so should they
There is lots of spray and you CAN'T see the road ahead clearly?
A problem we have in this country is that some people just put the fog lamp on at the slightest mist and then forget about them
My GF thinks its because they haven't pushed the button for a long time
I am an officer and the highway code makes reference to fog not rain, the problem these days as we have so many smart arses who take certain words that were made simple and put there own interpretation onto them as they feel fit.
The argument of spray and the ability not being able to see is not solved by the fact that you have fog lights on or not, it should be a case of following distance and speed therfore if you can not see slow down and extend your distance as what does distance give you, time to react, and that is the trouble with drivers to day poor weather then they think that turning a few lights on and that sorts that little problem out, it doesn't so the next time you think it does and you get stopped dont say that to a traffic officer as that is not good driving, and you will probably get a ticket or if he has witnessed poor driving sent on a driving improvement course to say the least.
Stefluc
The argument of spray and the ability not being able to see is not solved by the fact that you have fog lights on or not, it should be a case of following distance and speed therfore if you can not see slow down and extend your distance as what does distance give you, time to react, and that is the trouble with drivers to day poor weather then they think that turning a few lights on and that sorts that little problem out, it doesn't so the next time you think it does and you get stopped dont say that to a traffic officer as that is not good driving, and you will probably get a ticket or if he has witnessed poor driving sent on a driving improvement course to say the least.
Stefluc
mark69sheer said:
ok so what if unlike your answer above. .
There is lots of spray and you CAN'T see the road ahead clearly?
Slow down and increase your distance from the one in front!There is lots of spray and you CAN'T see the road ahead clearly?
Modern rear position lamps are bright enough for you to see them in spray without resorting to fog lamps. Rear fog lamps are the worst invention ever placed on a motor vehicle! They are completely unecessary even in thick fog if people drive to the conditions in a manner that is relevant to those conditions.
Rear lights are no longer the feint candle glow that used to be installed on Morris Minors in the 1960's
I am BIB so I know about these things
Edited by Mg6b on Monday 3rd December 14:30
Stefluc said:
I am an officer and the highway code makes reference to fog not rain, the problem these days as we have so many smart arses who take certain words that were made simple and put there own interpretation onto them as they feel fit.
The argument of spray and the ability not being able to see is not solved by the fact that you have fog lights on or not, it should be a case of following distance and speed therfore if you can not see slow down and extend your distance as what does distance give you, time to react, and that is the trouble with drivers to day poor weather then they think that turning a few lights on and that sorts that little problem out, it doesn't so the next time you think it does and you get stopped dont say that to a traffic officer as that is not good driving, and you will probably get a ticket or if he has witnessed poor driving sent on a driving improvement course to say the least.
Stefluc
On a motorway when spray is a problem the spray is a problem wether I drive at 40mph or at 60mph.The argument of spray and the ability not being able to see is not solved by the fact that you have fog lights on or not, it should be a case of following distance and speed therfore if you can not see slow down and extend your distance as what does distance give you, time to react, and that is the trouble with drivers to day poor weather then they think that turning a few lights on and that sorts that little problem out, it doesn't so the next time you think it does and you get stopped dont say that to a traffic officer as that is not good driving, and you will probably get a ticket or if he has witnessed poor driving sent on a driving improvement course to say the least.
Stefluc
Either way the spray reduces the ability of following vehicles to see me.
that why I would if visibility was bad use my rear fogs.
Then traffic coming up behind me will see me hopefully earlier.
The highway code mentions 'reduced visibility' which could easily apply to heavy spray.
So many people on fast roads put their fog lights on and then drive like nutters in conditions of seriously reduced visibilty. No better evidence for a charge of due care!
" Good eevening Sir. I see you have identified its difficult to see because you have illuminated your rear fog lamps. Can you tell me why you are driving at 85mph 20 feet behind the vehicle in front of you? You do not have to say anything but it may harm your defence....."
" Good eevening Sir. I see you have identified its difficult to see because you have illuminated your rear fog lamps. Can you tell me why you are driving at 85mph 20 feet behind the vehicle in front of you? You do not have to say anything but it may harm your defence....."
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