Another Roundabout Question

[AL666]

Right, I know we've had plenty of them, but I've only just noticed something about a roundabout that I use regularly that I've not noticed before, there's a diagram of it too!

I was about to pull onto a roundabout at the same time as another car (marked 'S' in the diagram), and we're both going straight on. There are two lanes at the junction for the roundabout and two lanes on the roundabout, but only one lane in each direction on the bridge in between the two roundabouts. Well, it's only comfortably big enough to fit one, but two at a push (as I found this evening).
There are no markings on the roundabout, or before it indicating direction of travel from either lane that enters on to it, or that the lanes will merge afterwards if you're going straight on.

Am I right in thinking that both lanes are for straight on, and the left lane can be used to turn left (if you missed the previous exit to the slip) and the right lane can also be used if you're turning back on yourself?

If not, what's the deal?

My car and the other car are near the bottom, travelling upwards:



Thanks,

AL

[JustinP1]

I would say left for left. Left for straight on, right for right.

I think for the 'middle' exits for a roundabout (not first left or last right), the HWC says 'an appropriate' lane.

If there is only one lane the other side of the roundabout, I would suggest that this lane is for those in the left hand lane, and it is not intended in this situation for people in the right hand lane to go straight on.

[Captain Volvo]

Isn't it left hand lane for straight on unless road markings indicate otherwise? Of course if there are 2 lanes on and 2 lanes off I don't see any reason why you shouldn't use the right hand one to go straight on, of course unless road markings say otherwise.

Cool picture by the way - contact HMSO and offer to do the next Highway Code book for them. ;-)

[AL666]

The point is that there is only really one lane off. It is not really large enough to house two cars side-by-side on the bridge that runs between the two roundabouts, yet both of them sport two lanes onto the roundabout, there's a sort of bottleneck in the middle...

[mechsympathy]

AL666 said:

The point is that there is only really one lane off. It is not really large enough to house two cars side-by-side on the bridge that runs between the two roundabouts, yet both of them sport two lanes onto the roundabout, there's a sort of bottleneck in the middle...

If you know the lane layout then left to turn left and right for straight on would be most sensible. In the absence of road markings or signs to indicate that (or a sign to indicate the reduction of lanes on leaving the RB) then you could reasonably expect to use both lanes for straight on, and merge in turn when you discover the single lane at the exit.

Then you get to the situation the OP describes where two cars are trying to exit side by side, in which case S should drop back and allow the OP right of way IMO as it is more usual to use the left lane for straight on.

Are you sure there are no road markings on the approach?

[pdV6]

I'd say you can both go straight on, but the car marked "S" should give way at the bridge exit if you both arrive together.

It's a bit of a weird one as left-turners would be expected to take the slip provided and there's no actual right turn at the first roundabout, so the only obvious route for both lanes is straight on. (Of course, there are other options, like turning left having missed the slip and doing a U-turn via the r/bout).

{eta:} Thinking about it, it looks like a cut-price junction, i.e. they should have built a mahoosive roundabout to cover the entire junction but that would have entailed building an extra bridge. Furthermore, having bodged it with a single bridge they've made matters worse by making it only 2 lanes wide rather than 4.

Edited by pdV6 on Tuesday 29th January 11:15

[havoc]

mechsympathy said:

AL666 said:

The point is that there is only really one lane off. It is not really large enough to house two cars side-by-side on the bridge that runs between the two roundabouts, yet both of them sport two lanes onto the roundabout, there's a sort of bottleneck in the middle...

If you know the lane layout then left to turn left and right for straight on would be most sensible. In the absence of road markings or signs to indicate that (or a sign to indicate the reduction of lanes on leaving the RB) then you could reasonably expect to use both lanes for straight on, and merge in turn when you discover the single lane at the exit.

Then you get to the situation the OP describes where two cars are trying to exit side by side, in which case S should drop back and allow the OP right of way IMO as it is more usual to use the left lane for straight on.

Are you sure there are no road markings on the approach?

100% right, IMHO.

[AL666]

mechsympathy said:

AL666 said:

The point is that there is only really one lane off. It is not really large enough to house two cars side-by-side on the bridge that runs between the two roundabouts, yet both of them sport two lanes onto the roundabout, there's a sort of bottleneck in the middle...

If you know the lane layout then left to turn left and right for straight on would be most sensible. In the absence of road markings or signs to indicate that (or a sign to indicate the reduction of lanes on leaving the RB) then you could reasonably expect to use both lanes for straight on, and merge in turn when you discover the single lane at the exit.

Then you get to the situation the OP describes where two cars are trying to exit side by side, in which case S should drop back and allow the OP right of way IMO as it is more usual to use the left lane for straight on.

Are you sure there are no road markings on the approach?

Sounds about right to me, I'm 90% sure that there are no markings, I've not specifically looked, but I usually notice markings... It does get a bit busy around there when I leave as 7 8 companies use that roundabout and kick out around the same time.

I'll take another look when I finish work and see if there's anything I've missed.

[mechsympathy]

AL666 said:

Sounds about right to me, I'm 90% sure that there are no markings, I've not specifically looked, but I usually notice markings... It does get a bit busy around there when I leave as 7 8 companies use that roundabout and kick out around the same time.

I'll take another look when I finish work and see if there's anything I've missed.

Road markings are easily missed when it's busy, but looking at what you drive it could well have been a case of small man syndrome as you kept ahead in a crappy, yet strangely quick Rover

[AL666]

Just checked on the way back from work and adjusted the picture slightly, but there are no markings coming up to the roundabout, nor any 'merge' signs.

I've put the road markings in red to make them obvious compared to the arrows in black, which are just there to show traffic flow, they are not actual markings.




I'm guessing that we are supposed to merge due to the fact that there are markings for two lanes in each direction after the roundabout, which then disappear when the road narrows. The arrows in the bottom left are supposed to be there, one points to the slip road, the other points towards the middle of the two lanes in front.

[Do0Bs]

Yeh this is the same on the new north devon bypass. You just have to merge into one lane before the bridge, works quite well.

[pdV6]

[quote=AL666The arrows in the bottom left are supposed to be there, one points to the slip road, the other points towards the middle of the two lanes in front.
[/quote]
There we are, then. Both lanes are for straight on and common sense is supposed to be used at the merge on the bridge. If the markings on your drawing are accurate, though, it looks like the left lane disappears rather than the right, so there could be an argument for yielding to traffic outside you when you get to the bridge?

[8Ace]

There's a similar thing in Amersham. A 3 exit roundabout (9, 12 and 3 o'clock) and two lane entry. Straight on is 1 lane. Staying in the left lane to go straight on invites accidents as the council didn't bother to include on the sign that one can turn right there. Thus right lane is generally used for straight on. No markings on road either. I now use the RH lane after almost being HotWheeled off the road by a roundabout-cutting arsewit.

[AL666]

pdV6 said:

AL666 said:

The arrows in the bottom left are supposed to be there, one points to the slip road, the other points towards the middle of the two lanes in front.

There we are, then. Both lanes are for straight on and common sense is supposed to be used at the merge on the bridge. If the markings on your drawing are accurate, though, it looks like the left lane disappears rather than the right, so there could be an argument for yielding to traffic outside you when you get to the bridge?

Having reviewed the junction again, there are no dotted lines to suggest four lanes after the roundabout, there are only the dotted lines to separate opposing directions down the centre of the bridge.

Edited by AL666 on Wednesday 30th January 23:40

[pdV6]

OK, back to my first interpretation then!

[ukvoyager.info]

That looks like the A14/M6/M1 section. Its a free for all if you ask me but I usually try and merge in turn.

[FishFace]

I ing love that diagram