Fine for wrongly spaced number plate!!
Discussion
I was recently stopped for driving a car with a "slightly" (and I emphasise the slightly!) mis spaced number plate.
I had explained why the spacing was slightly out, and what it was meant to signify, and explained that I was honestly unaware that I was breaking the law. I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
Anyway, after the "lets have a seat in the car" statement, I was given a fine of £30!!! I could have easily spent this money on the new registration plates they asked me to purchase. Now, my annoyance stems from me being very civil, driving my father's almost new Jaguar XJ(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap. I asked why I deserved a fine, and not a caution with the instruction to buy new plates!?? They duly informed me that I had committed an offence and was due a fine for it!! I accepted that I committed an offence and instructed the officers that I would immediately purchase new plates, and explained I was unaware of this until they had stopped me. I asked if there was no place for them to make discretionary decisions these days based on the individual and circumstances, but no, the attitude I got was, give us yer money!!
It's hardly crime of the centuary is it!!! What's happening on our roads these days! Is it all just about revenue!? The motorsist seems to be the easy target these days, almost as if the govt know if we can run a car, then we must have a few quid to pay all these fines!!
A friend of mine was in court recently for driving his car at just over 100 mph. Yes, we all know, he shouldn't have been. I'm not going into all the circumstances, but it was probably as safe, if you like, a time as any to be driving at this speed. The guy heard before him, was up in court for kicking 7 colours of s
t out of his wife, after stealing the charity bottle off the counter of his local shop, then bursting it open to buy some cheap, nasty lager and drugs. He was practically on first name terms with everyone in the court, including the judge, and got a £60 fine with costs and told to behave!! Now, I have no doubt that guy will visit that court again..........and again and again, but my friend was fined £1000, because he could pay it, what's going on!
I had explained why the spacing was slightly out, and what it was meant to signify, and explained that I was honestly unaware that I was breaking the law. I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
Anyway, after the "lets have a seat in the car" statement, I was given a fine of £30!!! I could have easily spent this money on the new registration plates they asked me to purchase. Now, my annoyance stems from me being very civil, driving my father's almost new Jaguar XJ(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap. I asked why I deserved a fine, and not a caution with the instruction to buy new plates!?? They duly informed me that I had committed an offence and was due a fine for it!! I accepted that I committed an offence and instructed the officers that I would immediately purchase new plates, and explained I was unaware of this until they had stopped me. I asked if there was no place for them to make discretionary decisions these days based on the individual and circumstances, but no, the attitude I got was, give us yer money!!
It's hardly crime of the centuary is it!!! What's happening on our roads these days! Is it all just about revenue!? The motorsist seems to be the easy target these days, almost as if the govt know if we can run a car, then we must have a few quid to pay all these fines!!
A friend of mine was in court recently for driving his car at just over 100 mph. Yes, we all know, he shouldn't have been. I'm not going into all the circumstances, but it was probably as safe, if you like, a time as any to be driving at this speed. The guy heard before him, was up in court for kicking 7 colours of s
t out of his wife, after stealing the charity bottle off the counter of his local shop, then bursting it open to buy some cheap, nasty lager and drugs. He was practically on first name terms with everyone in the court, including the judge, and got a £60 fine with costs and told to behave!! Now, I have no doubt that guy will visit that court again..........and again and again, but my friend was fined £1000, because he could pay it, what's going on!I know, but they asked who's car as it wasn't registered to me etc. It was my father's after all! Hindsight is a great thing! my mate is in the plod and he said I shouldn't have accepted the conditional offer, he doubt's very much it would have been called to court for such a triviality!! All the what if's are too late unfortunately!!
jim_1976 said:
I was recently stopped for driving a car with a "slightly" (and I emphasise the slightly!) mis spaced number plate.
I had explained why the spacing was slightly out, and what it was meant to signify, and explained that I was honestly unaware that I was breaking the law. I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
Anyway, after the "lets have a seat in the car" statement, I was given a fine of £30!!! I could have easily spent this money on the new registration plates they asked me to purchase. Now, my annoyance stems from me being very civil, driving my father's almost new Jaguar XJ(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap. I asked why I deserved a fine, and not a caution with the instruction to buy new plates!?? They duly informed me that I had committed an offence and was due a fine for it!! I accepted that I committed an offence and instructed the officers that I would immediately purchase new plates, and explained I was unaware of this until they had stopped me. I asked if there was no place for them to make discretionary decisions these days based on the individual and circumstances, but no, the attitude I got was, give us yer money!!
It's hardly crime of the centuary is it!!! What's happening on our roads these days! Is it all just about revenue!? The motorsist seems to be the easy target these days, almost as if the govt know if we can run a car, then we must have a few quid to pay all these fines!!
A friend of mine was in court recently for driving his car at just over 100 mph. Yes, we all know, he shouldn't have been. I'm not going into all the circumstances, but it was probably as safe, if you like, a time as any to be driving at this speed. The guy heard before him, was up in court for kicking 7 colours of st out of his wife, after stealing the charity bottle off the counter of his local shop, then bursting it open to buy some cheap, nasty lager and drugs. He was practically on first name terms with everyone in the court, including the judge, and got a £60 fine with costs and told to behave!! Now, I have no doubt that guy will visit that court again..........and again and again, but my friend was fined £1000, because he could pay it, what's going on!
what a whinger - moan, whinge, stamp, toys out of, whinge, catch real crims ....... go and stand in the naughty corner for 4 minutes.I had explained why the spacing was slightly out, and what it was meant to signify, and explained that I was honestly unaware that I was breaking the law. I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
Anyway, after the "lets have a seat in the car" statement, I was given a fine of £30!!! I could have easily spent this money on the new registration plates they asked me to purchase. Now, my annoyance stems from me being very civil, driving my father's almost new Jaguar XJ(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap. I asked why I deserved a fine, and not a caution with the instruction to buy new plates!?? They duly informed me that I had committed an offence and was due a fine for it!! I accepted that I committed an offence and instructed the officers that I would immediately purchase new plates, and explained I was unaware of this until they had stopped me. I asked if there was no place for them to make discretionary decisions these days based on the individual and circumstances, but no, the attitude I got was, give us yer money!!
It's hardly crime of the centuary is it!!! What's happening on our roads these days! Is it all just about revenue!? The motorsist seems to be the easy target these days, almost as if the govt know if we can run a car, then we must have a few quid to pay all these fines!!
A friend of mine was in court recently for driving his car at just over 100 mph. Yes, we all know, he shouldn't have been. I'm not going into all the circumstances, but it was probably as safe, if you like, a time as any to be driving at this speed. The guy heard before him, was up in court for kicking 7 colours of s
t out of his wife, after stealing the charity bottle off the counter of his local shop, then bursting it open to buy some cheap, nasty lager and drugs. He was practically on first name terms with everyone in the court, including the judge, and got a £60 fine with costs and told to behave!! Now, I have no doubt that guy will visit that court again..........and again and again, but my friend was fined £1000, because he could pay it, what's going on!perhaps that should be 33 minutes in the corner.
Edited by superlightr on Tuesday 12th May 09:12
I think you will just have to wear the number plate fine, its not so bad. But I totally agree with you about the court anacdote, okay your mate doing 100 wasnt good either, but these wallys who commit nasty offences with drugs stealing violence etc, just get let off and are then paid by the tax payer to sit on his bottom and think of other stupid things to do.
They have nothing to loose and dont care if they get slapped in jail for a bit, it just means they are even less likely to get a job which suits em right down to the ground.
They have nothing to loose and dont care if they get slapped in jail for a bit, it just means they are even less likely to get a job which suits em right down to the ground.
superlightr said:
jim_1976 said:
I was recently stopped for driving a car with a "slightly" (and I emphasise the slightly!) mis spaced number plate.
I had explained why the spacing was slightly out, and what it was meant to signify, and explained that I was honestly unaware that I was breaking the law. I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
Anyway, after the "lets have a seat in the car" statement, I was given a fine of £30!!! I could have easily spent this money on the new registration plates they asked me to purchase. Now, my annoyance stems from me being very civil, driving my father's almost new Jaguar XJ(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap. I asked why I deserved a fine, and not a caution with the instruction to buy new plates!?? They duly informed me that I had committed an offence and was due a fine for it!! I accepted that I committed an offence and instructed the officers that I would immediately purchase new plates, and explained I was unaware of this until they had stopped me. I asked if there was no place for them to make discretionary decisions these days based on the individual and circumstances, but no, the attitude I got was, give us yer money!!
It's hardly crime of the centuary is it!!! What's happening on our roads these days! Is it all just about revenue!? The motorsist seems to be the easy target these days, almost as if the govt know if we can run a car, then we must have a few quid to pay all these fines!!
A friend of mine was in court recently for driving his car at just over 100 mph. Yes, we all know, he shouldn't have been. I'm not going into all the circumstances, but it was probably as safe, if you like, a time as any to be driving at this speed. The guy heard before him, was up in court for kicking 7 colours of st out of his wife, after stealing the charity bottle off the counter of his local shop, then bursting it open to buy some cheap, nasty lager and drugs. He was practically on first name terms with everyone in the court, including the judge, and got a £60 fine with costs and told to behave!! Now, I have no doubt that guy will visit that court again..........and again and again, but my friend was fined £1000, because he could pay it, what's going on!
what a whinger - moan, whinge, stamp, toys out of, whinge, catch real crims ....... go and stand in the naughty corner for 4 minutes.I had explained why the spacing was slightly out, and what it was meant to signify, and explained that I was honestly unaware that I was breaking the law. I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
Anyway, after the "lets have a seat in the car" statement, I was given a fine of £30!!! I could have easily spent this money on the new registration plates they asked me to purchase. Now, my annoyance stems from me being very civil, driving my father's almost new Jaguar XJ(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap. I asked why I deserved a fine, and not a caution with the instruction to buy new plates!?? They duly informed me that I had committed an offence and was due a fine for it!! I accepted that I committed an offence and instructed the officers that I would immediately purchase new plates, and explained I was unaware of this until they had stopped me. I asked if there was no place for them to make discretionary decisions these days based on the individual and circumstances, but no, the attitude I got was, give us yer money!!
It's hardly crime of the centuary is it!!! What's happening on our roads these days! Is it all just about revenue!? The motorsist seems to be the easy target these days, almost as if the govt know if we can run a car, then we must have a few quid to pay all these fines!!
A friend of mine was in court recently for driving his car at just over 100 mph. Yes, we all know, he shouldn't have been. I'm not going into all the circumstances, but it was probably as safe, if you like, a time as any to be driving at this speed. The guy heard before him, was up in court for kicking 7 colours of s
t out of his wife, after stealing the charity bottle off the counter of his local shop, then bursting it open to buy some cheap, nasty lager and drugs. He was practically on first name terms with everyone in the court, including the judge, and got a £60 fine with costs and told to behave!! Now, I have no doubt that guy will visit that court again..........and again and again, but my friend was fined £1000, because he could pay it, what's going on!perhaps that should be 33 minutes in the corner.
Edited by superlightr on Tuesday 12th May 09:12
herewego said:
Where's the disincentive to fit deliberately misplaced plates if all that happens when they are spotted is a request to put it right?
I assume your dad put the plates on so you can pass the fine onto him.
My Mother, Sister and Brother in law bought him a plate for his 60th last year. So, yes I guess he did fit them, but as my origonal post stated, they were not that bad in comparison to some, and you know perfectly well what I'm on about regarding the italics etc etc. But none of us were fully aware that it was illegal and would merit a fine!! Surely, in this situation, a caution and a request to change them would have been suffice?I assume your dad put the plates on so you can pass the fine onto him.
You could go on all day about "disincentives", can you honestly say that a plate that has one digit out of line by 2cm can be compared to some plate that is totally ineligable?? I'm talking more about discretion here and the fact that it all seems to be about revenue.
jim_1976 said:
I honestly thought that it was more the "boy racers" if you like, with italics or ineligable typeface, with a couple of dozen screw caps scattered about to make up a name.
(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap.
Only chavs should recieve fines, the rest of us should get away with warnings?(incidentaly, I'm 33, and don't sport a track suit!! Lol), and not wearing a baseball cap.
There are a number of reasons that registrations plates have been required, one of which is to enable the vehicle to be easily identified. This is done nowadays via automatic number plate recognition (ANPR) cameras.
The reasoning behind the precise requirements for numberplate character spacing is so as to make prosecution easier, so that rather than having to prove that a number plate is unreadable or intended or likely to be misread, all the prosecution has to do is show that the spacing or size of characters was wrong. It's a bit like speed limits. There has never been any suggestion that a 50mph limit means that 50 is safe and 51 is not. However, the legislation negates any need for the prosecution to prove danger.
Times have changed it would appear. In my day prosecuting a person for a legible number plate would have been an example of abuse of authority. Even as late as the middle 90s when I was in charge of a prosecutions department my staff were told only to pass such a process if there was evidence - even a suspicion would have been sufficient - of the liklihood or intent to deceive. Othwerwise it would be binned.
Prosecuting a person for such an offence costs: it costs the time of the driver, the time of the PC, the time of the people in the process departments. It takes £30 out of the pocket of someone who might well have spent it on something useful. It is not as if you can support the suggestion that it is pointless when the DVLA makes £millions out of selling specific arrangements of letters and figures that can only be worth it if the spacing requirements are ignored.
I'd have taken the PC to one side and read him his rights. His job is to support and protect the public and prosecute offenders gainst the peace. If he could prove to me how prosecuting someone for a minor change in spacing is value for money, or indeed if the offence is against the peace, then I'd apologise. If not, I'd tell him he probably has picked the wrong job. Or I could have said what my old DS said: out of twenty people on the street, six have CRO, two are up to no good and one is actively involved in crime. Calculate the number of people who passed this PC whilst he was faffing about charging this driver. Divide that number by twenty and multiply it by three. That's how many times he was not doing a proper job. Fair enough, one of these three might have been someone drink driving but the number plate gives a reason to stop - not that you really need one - but once it is established that he's in the other seventeen, let him go on his way unmolested.
If there is nothing more to this than has been reported by the original OP then I've got to say pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe the officer's actions.
The terrible thing is that I'm not particularly surprised.
The reasoning behind the precise requirements for numberplate character spacing is so as to make prosecution easier, so that rather than having to prove that a number plate is unreadable or intended or likely to be misread, all the prosecution has to do is show that the spacing or size of characters was wrong. It's a bit like speed limits. There has never been any suggestion that a 50mph limit means that 50 is safe and 51 is not. However, the legislation negates any need for the prosecution to prove danger.
Times have changed it would appear. In my day prosecuting a person for a legible number plate would have been an example of abuse of authority. Even as late as the middle 90s when I was in charge of a prosecutions department my staff were told only to pass such a process if there was evidence - even a suspicion would have been sufficient - of the liklihood or intent to deceive. Othwerwise it would be binned.
Prosecuting a person for such an offence costs: it costs the time of the driver, the time of the PC, the time of the people in the process departments. It takes £30 out of the pocket of someone who might well have spent it on something useful. It is not as if you can support the suggestion that it is pointless when the DVLA makes £millions out of selling specific arrangements of letters and figures that can only be worth it if the spacing requirements are ignored.
I'd have taken the PC to one side and read him his rights. His job is to support and protect the public and prosecute offenders gainst the peace. If he could prove to me how prosecuting someone for a minor change in spacing is value for money, or indeed if the offence is against the peace, then I'd apologise. If not, I'd tell him he probably has picked the wrong job. Or I could have said what my old DS said: out of twenty people on the street, six have CRO, two are up to no good and one is actively involved in crime. Calculate the number of people who passed this PC whilst he was faffing about charging this driver. Divide that number by twenty and multiply it by three. That's how many times he was not doing a proper job. Fair enough, one of these three might have been someone drink driving but the number plate gives a reason to stop - not that you really need one - but once it is established that he's in the other seventeen, let him go on his way unmolested.
If there is nothing more to this than has been reported by the original OP then I've got to say pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe the officer's actions.
The terrible thing is that I'm not particularly surprised.
That's not what I'm saying so please don't twist things. Individual circumstances should be taken into consideration.
If someone battered a guy in the pub, and another shot a guy in the face would they both receive the same penalty?? No, I don't think so.
I plead ignorant to the fact the number plate was illegal, which I was. Going into the local car accessory shop (ok before any smart arse comes back, I know after Nov lat year it's now impossible!!) and asking for a plate such as E248 JYP to read "BRITNEY", and innocently moving one number which in no way made the plate inelligable surely cannot be compared.
What I'm getting at is, can a police officer these days cannot say to himslef, "well the guy seems ok, he's been civil instead of verbally abusing me for stopping him, seems like a decent member of society, I'll tell him to get them changed", or as I stated initially, is it all about revenue???
If someone battered a guy in the pub, and another shot a guy in the face would they both receive the same penalty?? No, I don't think so.
I plead ignorant to the fact the number plate was illegal, which I was. Going into the local car accessory shop (ok before any smart arse comes back, I know after Nov lat year it's now impossible!!) and asking for a plate such as E248 JYP to read "BRITNEY", and innocently moving one number which in no way made the plate inelligable surely cannot be compared.
What I'm getting at is, can a police officer these days cannot say to himslef, "well the guy seems ok, he's been civil instead of verbally abusing me for stopping him, seems like a decent member of society, I'll tell him to get them changed", or as I stated initially, is it all about revenue???
Derek Smith said:
There are a number of reasons that registrations plates have been required, one of which is to enable the vehicle to be easily identified. This is done nowadays via automatic number plate recognition (ANPR) cameras.
The reasoning behind the precise requirements for numberplate character spacing is so as to make prosecution easier, so that rather than having to prove that a number plate is unreadable or intended or likely to be misread, all the prosecution has to do is show that the spacing or size of characters was wrong. It's a bit like speed limits. There has never been any suggestion that a 50mph limit means that 50 is safe and 51 is not. However, the legislation negates any need for the prosecution to prove danger.
Times have changed it would appear. In my day prosecuting a person for a legible number plate would have been an example of abuse of authority. Even as late as the middle 90s when I was in charge of a prosecutions department my staff were told only to pass such a process if there was evidence - even a suspicion would have been sufficient - of the liklihood or intent to deceive. Othwerwise it would be binned.
Prosecuting a person for such an offence costs: it costs the time of the driver, the time of the PC, the time of the people in the process departments. It takes £30 out of the pocket of someone who might well have spent it on something useful. It is not as if you can support the suggestion that it is pointless when the DVLA makes £millions out of selling specific arrangements of letters and figures that can only be worth it if the spacing requirements are ignored.
I'd have taken the PC to one side and read him his rights. His job is to support and protect the public and prosecute offenders gainst the peace. If he could prove to me how prosecuting someone for a minor change in spacing is value for money, or indeed if the offence is against the peace, then I'd apologise. If not, I'd tell him he probably has picked the wrong job. Or I could have said what my old DS said: out of twenty people on the street, six have CRO, two are up to no good and one is actively involved in crime. Calculate the number of people who passed this PC whilst he was faffing about charging this driver. Divide that number by twenty and multiply it by three. That's how many times he was not doing a proper job. Fair enough, one of these three might have been someone drink driving but the number plate gives a reason to stop - not that you really need one - but once it is established that he's in the other seventeen, let him go on his way unmolested.
If there is nothing more to this than has been reported by the original OP then I've got to say pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe the officer's actions.
The terrible thing is that I'm not particularly surprised.
Thankyou, someone with some sense!! The reasoning behind the precise requirements for numberplate character spacing is so as to make prosecution easier, so that rather than having to prove that a number plate is unreadable or intended or likely to be misread, all the prosecution has to do is show that the spacing or size of characters was wrong. It's a bit like speed limits. There has never been any suggestion that a 50mph limit means that 50 is safe and 51 is not. However, the legislation negates any need for the prosecution to prove danger.
Times have changed it would appear. In my day prosecuting a person for a legible number plate would have been an example of abuse of authority. Even as late as the middle 90s when I was in charge of a prosecutions department my staff were told only to pass such a process if there was evidence - even a suspicion would have been sufficient - of the liklihood or intent to deceive. Othwerwise it would be binned.
Prosecuting a person for such an offence costs: it costs the time of the driver, the time of the PC, the time of the people in the process departments. It takes £30 out of the pocket of someone who might well have spent it on something useful. It is not as if you can support the suggestion that it is pointless when the DVLA makes £millions out of selling specific arrangements of letters and figures that can only be worth it if the spacing requirements are ignored.
I'd have taken the PC to one side and read him his rights. His job is to support and protect the public and prosecute offenders gainst the peace. If he could prove to me how prosecuting someone for a minor change in spacing is value for money, or indeed if the offence is against the peace, then I'd apologise. If not, I'd tell him he probably has picked the wrong job. Or I could have said what my old DS said: out of twenty people on the street, six have CRO, two are up to no good and one is actively involved in crime. Calculate the number of people who passed this PC whilst he was faffing about charging this driver. Divide that number by twenty and multiply it by three. That's how many times he was not doing a proper job. Fair enough, one of these three might have been someone drink driving but the number plate gives a reason to stop - not that you really need one - but once it is established that he's in the other seventeen, let him go on his way unmolested.
If there is nothing more to this than has been reported by the original OP then I've got to say pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe the officer's actions.
The terrible thing is that I'm not particularly surprised.
Derek Smith said:
There are a number of reasons that registrations plates have been required, one of which is to enable the vehicle to be easily identified. This is done nowadays via automatic number plate recognition (ANPR) cameras.
The reasoning behind the precise requirements for numberplate character spacing is so as to make prosecution easier, so that rather than having to prove that a number plate is unreadable or intended or likely to be misread, all the prosecution has to do is show that the spacing or size of characters was wrong. It's a bit like speed limits. There has never been any suggestion that a 50mph limit means that 50 is safe and 51 is not. However, the legislation negates any need for the prosecution to prove danger.
Times have changed it would appear. In my day prosecuting a person for a legible number plate would have been an example of abuse of authority. Even as late as the middle 90s when I was in charge of a prosecutions department my staff were told only to pass such a process if there was evidence - even a suspicion would have been sufficient - of the liklihood or intent to deceive. Othwerwise it would be binned.
Prosecuting a person for such an offence costs: it costs the time of the driver, the time of the PC, the time of the people in the process departments. It takes £30 out of the pocket of someone who might well have spent it on something useful. It is not as if you can support the suggestion that it is pointless when the DVLA makes £millions out of selling specific arrangements of letters and figures that can only be worth it if the spacing requirements are ignored.
I'd have taken the PC to one side and read him his rights. His job is to support and protect the public and prosecute offenders gainst the peace. If he could prove to me how prosecuting someone for a minor change in spacing is value for money, or indeed if the offence is against the peace, then I'd apologise. If not, I'd tell him he probably has picked the wrong job. Or I could have said what my old DS said: out of twenty people on the street, six have CRO, two are up to no good and one is actively involved in crime. Calculate the number of people who passed this PC whilst he was faffing about charging this driver. Divide that number by twenty and multiply it by three. That's how many times he was not doing a proper job. Fair enough, one of these three might have been someone drink driving but the number plate gives a reason to stop - not that you really need one - but once it is established that he's in the other seventeen, let him go on his way unmolested.
If there is nothing more to this than has been reported by the original OP then I've got to say pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe the officer's actions.
The terrible thing is that I'm not particularly surprised.
Incorrect spacing (depending how bad) will stop ANPR reading it. Or will create a misread. The reasoning behind the precise requirements for numberplate character spacing is so as to make prosecution easier, so that rather than having to prove that a number plate is unreadable or intended or likely to be misread, all the prosecution has to do is show that the spacing or size of characters was wrong. It's a bit like speed limits. There has never been any suggestion that a 50mph limit means that 50 is safe and 51 is not. However, the legislation negates any need for the prosecution to prove danger.
Times have changed it would appear. In my day prosecuting a person for a legible number plate would have been an example of abuse of authority. Even as late as the middle 90s when I was in charge of a prosecutions department my staff were told only to pass such a process if there was evidence - even a suspicion would have been sufficient - of the liklihood or intent to deceive. Othwerwise it would be binned.
Prosecuting a person for such an offence costs: it costs the time of the driver, the time of the PC, the time of the people in the process departments. It takes £30 out of the pocket of someone who might well have spent it on something useful. It is not as if you can support the suggestion that it is pointless when the DVLA makes £millions out of selling specific arrangements of letters and figures that can only be worth it if the spacing requirements are ignored.
I'd have taken the PC to one side and read him his rights. His job is to support and protect the public and prosecute offenders gainst the peace. If he could prove to me how prosecuting someone for a minor change in spacing is value for money, or indeed if the offence is against the peace, then I'd apologise. If not, I'd tell him he probably has picked the wrong job. Or I could have said what my old DS said: out of twenty people on the street, six have CRO, two are up to no good and one is actively involved in crime. Calculate the number of people who passed this PC whilst he was faffing about charging this driver. Divide that number by twenty and multiply it by three. That's how many times he was not doing a proper job. Fair enough, one of these three might have been someone drink driving but the number plate gives a reason to stop - not that you really need one - but once it is established that he's in the other seventeen, let him go on his way unmolested.
If there is nothing more to this than has been reported by the original OP then I've got to say pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe the officer's actions.
The terrible thing is that I'm not particularly surprised.
As such there has been a directive from the home officer to officers to deal with that issue. Indeed there was a national campaign not long ago.
It does depend on how bad the spacing is before most officers would consider dealing with it, indeed it would be interesting to see the plate to judge what is described by the OP as slight mis-spacing.
jim_1976 said:
What I'm getting at is, can a police officer these days cannot say to himslef, "well the guy seems ok, he's been civil instead of verbally abusing me for stopping him, seems like a decent member of society, I'll tell him to get them changed", or as I stated initially, is it all about revenue???
what colour was the car? maybe he was on a 147 break 
I don't want to post the plate on here to be honest, but basically the plate reads, XXX 6 OTH.
The 6 was moved slightly to the right from the first letter and 2 numbers so in some way signify the "60th" aspect, which was why the plate was bought for my father. All the letters and numbers were the appropriate size and were not altered in any way other than described above. OTT do you think??
The office explained the ANPR reasons and I duly accepted and apologised on my/father's behalf and said I would immediately change them, but that didn't seem satisfactory!!! I'm just annoyed that there seems to be no courtesy or discretion these days, and as I origonaly said, it seems all about revenue.
Yes thanks for the "toys out the pram" comment and I'm sure there are a few others thinking I am a moning faced git, but come on!! How long does it take all of you guys to earn £30 compared to how long it would have taken me to change the plates?? (And I'm sure I've just opened the floodgates to all the "millionares"!!)
The 6 was moved slightly to the right from the first letter and 2 numbers so in some way signify the "60th" aspect, which was why the plate was bought for my father. All the letters and numbers were the appropriate size and were not altered in any way other than described above. OTT do you think??
The office explained the ANPR reasons and I duly accepted and apologised on my/father's behalf and said I would immediately change them, but that didn't seem satisfactory!!! I'm just annoyed that there seems to be no courtesy or discretion these days, and as I origonaly said, it seems all about revenue.
Yes thanks for the "toys out the pram" comment and I'm sure there are a few others thinking I am a moning faced git, but come on!! How long does it take all of you guys to earn £30 compared to how long it would have taken me to change the plates?? (And I'm sure I've just opened the floodgates to all the "millionares"!!)
jim_1976 said:
I don't want to post the plate on here to be honest, but basically the plate reads, XXX 6 OTH.
The 6 was moved slightly to the right from the first letter and 2 numbers so in some way signify the "60th" aspect, which was why the plate was bought for my father. All the letters and numbers were the appropriate size and were not altered in any way other than described above. OTT do you think??
The office explained the ANPR reasons and I duly accepted and apologised on my/father's behalf and said I would immediately change them, but that didn't seem satisfactory!!! I'm just annoyed that there seems to be no courtesy or discretion these days, and as I origonaly said, it seems all about revenue.
Yes thanks for the "toys out the pram" comment and I'm sure there are a few others thinking I am a moning faced git, but come on!! How long does it take all of you guys to earn £30 compared to how long it would have taken me to change the plates?? (And I'm sure I've just opened the floodgates to all the "millionares"!!)
That would cause a misread on the system although would be read. The 6 was moved slightly to the right from the first letter and 2 numbers so in some way signify the "60th" aspect, which was why the plate was bought for my father. All the letters and numbers were the appropriate size and were not altered in any way other than described above. OTT do you think??
The office explained the ANPR reasons and I duly accepted and apologised on my/father's behalf and said I would immediately change them, but that didn't seem satisfactory!!! I'm just annoyed that there seems to be no courtesy or discretion these days, and as I origonaly said, it seems all about revenue.
Yes thanks for the "toys out the pram" comment and I'm sure there are a few others thinking I am a moning faced git, but come on!! How long does it take all of you guys to earn £30 compared to how long it would have taken me to change the plates?? (And I'm sure I've just opened the floodgates to all the "millionares"!!)
It did need changing.
Courtesy? Was the officer rude?
Discretion - In most cases I would have asked for it to be changed unless there was another issue with the person stopped I would not have issued a fine. Some officers would and always would have done, indeed most officers in my experience were far more pedantic in the past than now.
The problem of relying on discretion is that it is discretionary and not obligatory.
Count yourself lucky. I got the same penalty even with the correct plates in the boot and offering to put them on at that time...! What was more annoying was that I was hunting around for a tyre because one of mine was bald and the half an hour it took him to stop me (he stopped me when I turned into the tyre place), meant that they had shut before I got the chance to get a new tyre, so I had to drive around for another 24 hours with an illegal tyre!!
I could say he was bordering on being rude to be honest.
It's just annoying as I've never been involved in anything like this. I'm never involved with the police, and upon speaking to the officer, I thought all was going well and he would send me on my way!!! Even my friends who are in the police force thought it was over the top. I took everything he said to me onboard and apologised!! What more could I have done!!!???
It's just the £30 aspect for something as trivial!!!
It's just annoying as I've never been involved in anything like this. I'm never involved with the police, and upon speaking to the officer, I thought all was going well and he would send me on my way!!! Even my friends who are in the police force thought it was over the top. I took everything he said to me onboard and apologised!! What more could I have done!!!???
It's just the £30 aspect for something as trivial!!!
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