UK Maximum Towing Weight for Pickup Trucks
Discussion
Most pickups in the UK have a maximum towing weight of 3,500kg but is that limit a UK legal limit or could, in theory at least, Ford or another make decide to rate this pickup at 4,000kg to beat the competition? I ask this as there are rumours that ford are bring the 'Superduty' trim level of the Ranger to the UK with a towing weight of 4,500kg and I was wondering if that would exceed the legal maximum or whether it would be okay?
3500kg is the top limit for a toe ball hitch, so you would need a different hitch.
The GVW of the pickup will more than likely be over 3500kg as well, so a different class of licence required, and a tachometer and operator’s licence for any commercial use.
These don’t slot into current UK legislation well, and I’m not sure who would make use of such a vehicle, maybe a tree surgeon? They do like their Unimogs though.
The GVW of the pickup will more than likely be over 3500kg as well, so a different class of licence required, and a tachometer and operator’s licence for any commercial use.
These don’t slot into current UK legislation well, and I’m not sure who would make use of such a vehicle, maybe a tree surgeon? They do like their Unimogs though.
Thank you for your contributions, would the US style electric brakes be allowed in the UK as I assume from whats posted above having a pintle hitch would over come the hitch issue but that overrun brakes wouldn't be adequate?
As for usage, farmers, builders, car transporting companies, horsebox owners and all most every other kind of towing user. The UK rules are horrendously restrictive and make life very hard.
As for usage, farmers, builders, car transporting companies, horsebox owners and all most every other kind of towing user. The UK rules are horrendously restrictive and make life very hard.
Edited by 150234 on Saturday 31st January 16:16
150234 said:
Thank you for your contributions, would the US style electric brakes be allowed in the UK as I assume from whats posted above having a pintle hitch would over come the hitch issue but that overrun brakes wouldn't be adequate?
As for usage, farmers, builders, car transporting companies, horsebox owners and all most every other kind of towing user. The UK rules are horrendously restrictive and make life very hard.
I looked into this when I briefly flirted with the idea of buying an F150. The dvsa don't recognize electric brakes as an acceptable trailer brake system in this country, and that's before you realise you'll need a class 1 licence on top, plus tacho if you're using it for hire and reward. I know we're a small compact country with the road networks that go with that but I do think the 3.5t limit on a B licence is outdated now with vehicle weights as they are. As for usage, farmers, builders, car transporting companies, horsebox owners and all most every other kind of towing user. The UK rules are horrendously restrictive and make life very hard.
Edited by 150234 on Saturday 31st January 16:16
I for one couldn't believe they decided to scrap the trailer entitlement during COVID, if they wanted to increase numbers of hgv drivers and available tests it would have been far safer to give everyone the grandfather rights for 7.5t back instead of trailers, in my mind towing a 3.5t trailer is far riskier and carries more severe potential consequences than driving 7.5 tonners,but there we go.
150234 said:
Thank you for your contributions, would the US style electric brakes be allowed in the UK as I assume from whats posted above having a pintle hitch would over come the hitch issue but that overrun brakes wouldn't be adequate?
As for usage, farmers, builders, car transporting companies, horsebox owners and all most every other kind of towing user. The UK rules are horrendously restrictive and make life very hard.
Electric brakes only legal to 3.5t trailers.As for usage, farmers, builders, car transporting companies, horsebox owners and all most every other kind of towing user. The UK rules are horrendously restrictive and make life very hard.
Edited by 150234 on Saturday 31st January 16:16
Uk laws are fine regarding this. Only real difference between UK & EU on this is trailer lengths for 3.5t & under towing vehicles.
Towing over 3500kg is very niche in the UK, even for trade applications. I guess the whole market has evolved around the post-97 cat B+E license restrictions.
Personally, I think the licensing rules in the UK strike a good balance since they added B+E to all licenses. 3500kg is more than enough for 99% of people and requiring extra training for the few people who will tow really huge trailers seems sensible. The last thing we need is to change the rules to encourage even more ridiculously heavy vehicles.
The old 750kg towing limit for post-97 licenses was a pain, though.
Personally, I think the licensing rules in the UK strike a good balance since they added B+E to all licenses. 3500kg is more than enough for 99% of people and requiring extra training for the few people who will tow really huge trailers seems sensible. The last thing we need is to change the rules to encourage even more ridiculously heavy vehicles.
The old 750kg towing limit for post-97 licenses was a pain, though.
Edited by kambites on Saturday 31st January 17:10
iguana said:
Electric brakes only legal to 3.5t trailers.
Uk laws are fine regarding this. Only real difference between UK & EU on this is trailer lengths for 3.5t & under towing vehicles.
I wouldn't say that they are fine and that they are in fact quite restrictive. Adding an extra 1000kg to the towing limit would allow and extra turf pallet for a landscaper or pack of bricks for a builder etc. and would be a massive help. Uk laws are fine regarding this. Only real difference between UK & EU on this is trailer lengths for 3.5t & under towing vehicles.
donkmeister said:
Yes, but larger vehicles/trailers are already available for that, you just need to get those vehicles, the correct licence and operate them in accordance with the rules.
But the additional cost of a 7.5t vehicle is far more than what it would be to to add an extra 1000kg to the towing weight. The carrying capacity of a 7.5t truck is not that good compared to the gross weight. 150234 said:
But the additional cost of a 7.5t vehicle is far more than what it would be to to add an extra 1000kg to the towing weight. The carrying capacity of a 7.5t truck is not that good compared to the gross weight.
Depends what kind of 7.5t vehicle. Trucks like DAF LF, Merc Atego, Iveco Eurocargo are scaled down medium duty trucks which are essentially the same as 10t-18t variants except for smaller/lower power engines, lighter duty chassis, axles, wheels and tyres. In fact the Merc Atego is available with an option to plate it to 8300kg.Then there's the lighter duty ones like Fuso Canter, Isuzu Grafter which are available in various GVW of 3.5t-7.5t and are lighter still - these have a useful loading capacity.
And then there's larger Ford Transit, Merc Sprinter etc which have GVW > 3.5t. And the Iveco Daily, which is really in the 3-5-7.5t class but offers a panel van and a 3.5t variant.
The problem is, once you start towing with one of the above, you need to stick to the 8250kg GVW which comes with the grandfather'd C1+E with endorsment 107 entitlement. Meaning that you have very little advantage (and a lot of extra disadvantage - manoeuvrability, length, extra axles, connections) over a rigid 7.5t. If you want to go higher, you'd need a C1+E licence with no endorsment - which very few have. So you may as well get a class 2 (C) or class 1 (C+E) driver to drive a 12t truck, or a wag+drag.
paul_c123 said:
Depends what kind of 7.5t vehicle. Trucks like DAF LF, Merc Atego, Iveco Eurocargo are scaled down medium duty trucks which are essentially the same as 10t-18t variants except for smaller/lower power engines, lighter duty chassis, axles, wheels and tyres. In fact the Merc Atego is available with an option to plate it to 8300kg.
Then there's the lighter duty ones like Fuso Canter, Isuzu Grafter which are available in various GVW of 3.5t-7.5t and are lighter still - these have a useful loading capacity.
And then there's larger Ford Transit, Merc Sprinter etc which have GVW > 3.5t. And the Iveco Daily, which is really in the 3-5-7.5t class but offers a panel van and a 3.5t variant.
The problem is, once you start towing with one of the above, you need to stick to the 8250kg GVW which comes with the grandfather'd C1+E with endorsment 107 entitlement. Meaning that you have very little advantage (and a lot of extra disadvantage - manoeuvrability, length, extra axles, connections) over a rigid 7.5t. If you want to go higher, you'd need a C1+E licence with no endorsment - which very few have. So you may as well get a class 2 (C) or class 1 (C+E) driver to drive a 12t truck, or a wag+drag.
But none of the above offer the passenger carrying, off roading, power of a pickup truck nor the looks of course. In an ideal world a trailer would be able to be 5,000kg maximum on overrun brakes allowing for a 3,250k pickup to tow it. I would also change the rules to remove the need for a taco to make the system simplier.Then there's the lighter duty ones like Fuso Canter, Isuzu Grafter which are available in various GVW of 3.5t-7.5t and are lighter still - these have a useful loading capacity.
And then there's larger Ford Transit, Merc Sprinter etc which have GVW > 3.5t. And the Iveco Daily, which is really in the 3-5-7.5t class but offers a panel van and a 3.5t variant.
The problem is, once you start towing with one of the above, you need to stick to the 8250kg GVW which comes with the grandfather'd C1+E with endorsment 107 entitlement. Meaning that you have very little advantage (and a lot of extra disadvantage - manoeuvrability, length, extra axles, connections) over a rigid 7.5t. If you want to go higher, you'd need a C1+E licence with no endorsment - which very few have. So you may as well get a class 2 (C) or class 1 (C+E) driver to drive a 12t truck, or a wag+drag.
150234 said:
But none of the above offer the passenger carrying, off roading, power of a pickup truck nor the looks of course. In an ideal world a trailer would be able to be 5,000kg maximum on overrun brakes allowing for a 3,250k pickup to tow it. I would also change the rules to remove the need for a taco to make the system simplier.
Transistor, Sprinters, and Ivecos can all be had with 4x4 crew cabs, and the Iveco is available in up to seven tonne GVW. Towing over 3.5t is not legal on overrun brakes, so that would require a change in legislation.As for looks, I can't help you, but having had a Ranger as a company vehicle, I can say that big 4x4 pickups are extremely impractical compared to a drop side pickup, anything in the load bed is inaccessible from the side, and unless whatever you are carrying is by the tailgate, you can't reach it from the back over the open tailgate either.
150234 said:
Most pickups in the UK have a maximum towing weight of 3,500kg but is that limit a UK legal limit or could, in theory at least, Ford or another make decide to rate this pickup at 4,000kg to beat the competition? I ask this as there are rumours that ford are bring the 'Superduty' trim level of the Ranger to the UK with a towing weight of 4,500kg and I was wondering if that would exceed the legal maximum or whether it would be okay?
Do you have any reliable source for your rumours?I have heard a rumour the Ford Ranger Super Duty will NOT be marketed in the UK.
150234 said:
But the additional cost of a 7.5t vehicle is far more than what it would be to to add an extra 1000kg to the towing weight. The carrying capacity of a 7.5t truck is not that good compared to the gross weight.
There are "vans" (i.e. monocoque commercial vehicles that are literally just a really big van in the way they are built) up to about 7 tonnes, they have an excellent load weight due to the more efficient construction. But they are of course treated under the same rules as traditional lorries of the same size.I think what you are really saying is that you would benefit from a bigger vehicle but you don't want to have the downsides. Totally understandable but even at the rate cars are getting heavier I can't see anything more than the EV weight concession for vans happening. At best we might see reinstatement of the old provision allowing car licence holders to drive up to 7.5 tonne, but I wouldn't hold my breath!
Do you have a particular use case in mind? The PH hive mind might have a solution you haven't considered. Or is this a purely hypothetical "the yanks get to do it so why don't we?"
paul_c123 said:
Do you have any reliable source for your rumours?
I have heard a rumour the Ford Ranger Super Duty will NOT be marketed in the UK.
That won't stop people importing them of course.I have heard a rumour the Ford Ranger Super Duty will NOT be marketed in the UK.
Many land rovers are rated to tow 4000kg on air brakes, but you'd need a suitable upgrade and would still need to be within the usual limitations of train weight etc. for your license.
It's far too niche at present for the general public to tow anything more than 3500kg to be honest, and pretty much everyone who tows over that the DVSA want on Tacho so they can keep an eye on driving hours, including some of the people who tow under that for business use also. It's a bloody minefield.
Cyberprog said:
That won't stop people importing them of course.
Many land rovers are rated to tow 4000kg on air brakes, but you'd need a suitable upgrade and would still need to be within the usual limitations of train weight etc. for your license.
It's far too niche at present for the general public to tow anything more than 3500kg to be honest, and pretty much everyone who tows over that the DVSA want on Tacho so they can keep an eye on driving hours, including some of the people who tow under that for business use also. It's a bloody minefield.
There's a few operators who run imported F250 repo trucks for recovery, but they're a bit useless because the fuel economy is terrible and they are classed as C1+E or C+E in this country, with all the limitations that imposes. Also they tend to be much longer than an equivalent European recovery truck.Many land rovers are rated to tow 4000kg on air brakes, but you'd need a suitable upgrade and would still need to be within the usual limitations of train weight etc. for your license.
It's far too niche at present for the general public to tow anything more than 3500kg to be honest, and pretty much everyone who tows over that the DVSA want on Tacho so they can keep an eye on driving hours, including some of the people who tow under that for business use also. It's a bloody minefield.
Basically they are bringing the Ranger Super Duty to market where the F150 isn't sold (I think the F150 is LHD only), but its legal to run up to 4500kgs GVW and 4500kgs towing weight - eg Australia.
Being RHD rather than LHD, it will have to comply with much tighter SVA rules if its imported, and even then it will be classed as a 3.5-7.5t truck so it will need to be fitted with a speed limiter, etc. Not very appealing.
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