Did I just buy the wrong car?
Discussion
So first day of owning a R400 and I think I have bought the wrong car ! It feels like it should be on a smooth racetrack and not on bumpy b roads. It pummelling my spine - it’s got Nitrons NTR1 and I have it nearly set to the softest setting with no avail. The noise coming from the LSD/diff is frankly ridiculous (I read tadts). With the side doors on the interior is consumed with fumes and I stink after and I hate to think what I’m breathing in. The dry sump is what 70-80mm off the floor and one miss-place stone on a country lane and it’s gonna be toast.
Very disappointing first day tbh.
I think I should have gone for a much more road spec - anyone wanna swap ? . I’ll give it few more weekends but I think it’ll be up sale quickly .
(Coming from an Exige V6)
Very disappointing first day tbh.
I think I should have gone for a much more road spec - anyone wanna swap ? . I’ll give it few more weekends but I think it’ll be up sale quickly .
(Coming from an Exige V6)
It does sound like a very track-orientated set-up. The doors being flappy and useless is a feature of the product IIRC although the exhaust may need an extension if you're breathing it. My brother's one had the outlet slightly beyond the width of the rear wheel arch, which looked silly but got rid of the gases.
I have a K-Series VHPD Superlight R, the predecessor to the R400, similarly running Nitron NTR1s, dry sump and ground clearance set to 79mm.
I suspect that’s where the similarity ends, definitely no exhaust fumes in the cabin and it’s a pleasure on fast B roads, in fact comfy and predictable enough that I’ve done 600 mile days touring Europe and still want more.
Could your fumes issue by an oil catch can mounted on the engine side of the front bulkhead? That’s a common cause of bad gases in the cockpit.
Also maybe you need a proper chassis setup to suit your intended use, small changes can make a big difference to how the car behaves.
There’s always the possibility though that Caterhams simply aren’t for you, it does happen.
I suspect that’s where the similarity ends, definitely no exhaust fumes in the cabin and it’s a pleasure on fast B roads, in fact comfy and predictable enough that I’ve done 600 mile days touring Europe and still want more.
Could your fumes issue by an oil catch can mounted on the engine side of the front bulkhead? That’s a common cause of bad gases in the cockpit.
Also maybe you need a proper chassis setup to suit your intended use, small changes can make a big difference to how the car behaves.
There’s always the possibility though that Caterhams simply aren’t for you, it does happen.
bosshog said:
So first day of owning a R400 and I think I have bought the wrong car !
Coming from an Exige V6
Two possibilities IMO,Coming from an Exige V6
1. Just move it on.
2. Get straight down to some serious modifications.
Maybe I'm just a wuss, but I'd be looking at Option 1. Principally because Exige V6 is/was a real car and I'm not sure a Caterham R400 would ever get near to that experience on the road.
I've often wondered why people buy the track versions for use on the road while road versions exist. I'm sure it must be some 'I can just tough it out unlike those other wimps' mentality, but given the state of most of our roads I think you'd need to be a masochist to run something like that on the road regularly.
I get the impression that most Caterham owners do not become so by accident and are usually well informed about the different specs and setups - what made you choose this one?
(also a former Exige owner and occasional Caterham day-dreamer).
I get the impression that most Caterham owners do not become so by accident and are usually well informed about the different specs and setups - what made you choose this one?
(also a former Exige owner and occasional Caterham day-dreamer).
V7SLR said:
There s always the possibility though that Caterhams simply aren t for you, it does happen.
Possibly this...Have you driven any other Caterhams?
Mine's a Roadsport on the wide track "superlight" suspension with Bilsteins, and if you're not on smooth tarmac, you will get thrown around. They're just like that to be honest...
I would go to a Caterham specialist and as them to drive the car.
I bought my TVR Griffith and after a while found myself asking the 'is it suppose to be like this' question.
There was nothing wrong, but my frame of reference was 'off' as I had driven them but never lived with one.
My local specialist had it in for some work, and I asked them to take it for an extended road test, they came back with 'that's a really nice one'.
Which has worked wonders when my mind starts doing that thing car people's brains do.
The point I'm (badly) making is, if someone who knows them has a long run in it they can either suggest areas of improvement, assuage your concerns, or tell you that it is indeed the finest Caterham on the planet, and they just aren't your bag.
In that case you can sell it with a clear conscience, and move on without wondering 'what if'.
I bought my TVR Griffith and after a while found myself asking the 'is it suppose to be like this' question.
There was nothing wrong, but my frame of reference was 'off' as I had driven them but never lived with one.
My local specialist had it in for some work, and I asked them to take it for an extended road test, they came back with 'that's a really nice one'.
Which has worked wonders when my mind starts doing that thing car people's brains do.
The point I'm (badly) making is, if someone who knows them has a long run in it they can either suggest areas of improvement, assuage your concerns, or tell you that it is indeed the finest Caterham on the planet, and they just aren't your bag.
In that case you can sell it with a clear conscience, and move on without wondering 'what if'.
Before I forget, with regards to the diff.
They're all a bit noisy, but there noise and NOISE.
When I was last up in Millwood getting my car services, Eric was on a call to someone about their R400 diff. When he finished he said he often had people say their diff was noisy, but this R400 was ridiculous and he'd never heared anything like it. So I'd echo Stick Legs comment about getting a specialist to drive it and see what they say.
They're all a bit noisy, but there noise and NOISE.
When I was last up in Millwood getting my car services, Eric was on a call to someone about their R400 diff. When he finished he said he often had people say their diff was noisy, but this R400 was ridiculous and he'd never heared anything like it. So I'd echo Stick Legs comment about getting a specialist to drive it and see what they say.
V7SLR said:
I have a K-Series VHPD Superlight R, the predecessor to the R400, similarly running Nitron NTR1s, dry sump and ground clearance set to 79mm.
I suspect that s where the similarity ends, definitely no exhaust fumes in the cabin and it s a pleasure on fast B roads, in fact comfy and predictable enough that I ve done 600 mile days touring Europe and still want more.
Could your fumes issue by an oil catch can mounted on the engine side of the front bulkhead? That s a common cause of bad gases in the cockpit.
Also maybe you need a proper chassis setup to suit your intended use, small changes can make a big difference to how the car behaves.
There s always the possibility though that Caterhams simply aren t for you, it does happen.
Think Nessiemac had the exact same issue with a catch can causing fumes. He found a solution:I suspect that s where the similarity ends, definitely no exhaust fumes in the cabin and it s a pleasure on fast B roads, in fact comfy and predictable enough that I ve done 600 mile days touring Europe and still want more.
Could your fumes issue by an oil catch can mounted on the engine side of the front bulkhead? That s a common cause of bad gases in the cockpit.
Also maybe you need a proper chassis setup to suit your intended use, small changes can make a big difference to how the car behaves.
There s always the possibility though that Caterhams simply aren t for you, it does happen.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Thanks all,
I think I will try and join a local 7s club and get some more opinions - I have no reference point on these.
I did find this video around noises and its pretty much what I'm hearing https://youtu.be/XrCBSfvoe5o?si=Nxo6XnDZkOv2wbAA
As to to the ride - this could be sorted I'm sure with a softer set of dampers/springs and getting some original seats (it has Tillett).
It also has full cage, which after reading some threads last night seems like a bad idea without a helmet, so I'd need to also change that.
I did speak to the chap I got the car off this morning, and had a discussion about the fumes - he and his wife never once though it was 'fumy' but did say the clothes smelled a bit after being out and for them (over 20 years with it) thought its just part of having a Caterham given the design. Make of that what you will, as again I have no reference point to know if normal or not. Its not like I'm constantly smelling fumes, but I get a whaft ever now and then on overrun/decceleration , and its enough for me to notice it and make the cloths smell like I've been using a 2 stroke strimmer.
All of this is totally doable to sort really, however its a R400 which really is more track focused and seems silly of me to spend money making it a road car. I feel I'm probably better of just selling and getting the right car.
Why did I buy ? (it was in my budget <20K), it was well loved/looked after, performance was great, it was local, and I'm not patient!!!.
I think I will try and join a local 7s club and get some more opinions - I have no reference point on these.
I did find this video around noises and its pretty much what I'm hearing https://youtu.be/XrCBSfvoe5o?si=Nxo6XnDZkOv2wbAA
As to to the ride - this could be sorted I'm sure with a softer set of dampers/springs and getting some original seats (it has Tillett).
It also has full cage, which after reading some threads last night seems like a bad idea without a helmet, so I'd need to also change that.
I did speak to the chap I got the car off this morning, and had a discussion about the fumes - he and his wife never once though it was 'fumy' but did say the clothes smelled a bit after being out and for them (over 20 years with it) thought its just part of having a Caterham given the design. Make of that what you will, as again I have no reference point to know if normal or not. Its not like I'm constantly smelling fumes, but I get a whaft ever now and then on overrun/decceleration , and its enough for me to notice it and make the cloths smell like I've been using a 2 stroke strimmer.
All of this is totally doable to sort really, however its a R400 which really is more track focused and seems silly of me to spend money making it a road car. I feel I'm probably better of just selling and getting the right car.
Why did I buy ? (it was in my budget <20K), it was well loved/looked after, performance was great, it was local, and I'm not patient!!!.
John D. said:
Think Nessiemac had the exact same issue with a catch can causing fumes. He found a solution:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I already have one of those alu catch tanks so don't think its that BTW.https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
bosshog said:
I already have one of those alu catch tanks so don't think its that BTW.
I originally had one of those mounted on the engine bulkhead and it stunk! The cap is designed to vent excess fumes but keep the oil inside the tank, it does exactly what it says and the vented fumes can get into the cabin area.I've now fitted a sealed catch tank (from CBS) that has two hose connections, one for the gases/oil going in and the other piped underneath to the rear of the car to vent the gases, no issues now.
Ok! With some help from some very friendly local 7 owners I now know a more about my car!
Firstly the fumes:
Can t believe I missed it! You can feel it pulsing out just on tick over. You can see it’s turning blue . Bracket needs fixing somehow .
Apparently I have a Sierra lsd - I am told they are noisy.
Either way I m a lot more happy knowing the fumes is not a TADTS. The rest is sortable if I so wish. I m going to give it the rest of the summer and see how I feel but I suspect I will be keeping it :-)
Firstly the fumes:
Can t believe I missed it! You can feel it pulsing out just on tick over. You can see it’s turning blue . Bracket needs fixing somehow .
Apparently I have a Sierra lsd - I am told they are noisy.
Either way I m a lot more happy knowing the fumes is not a TADTS. The rest is sortable if I so wish. I m going to give it the rest of the summer and see how I feel but I suspect I will be keeping it :-)
Edited by bosshog on Monday 3rd August 22:49
Regarding the Tillet's, providing you are not so small that you are rattling around in the seat, then they are probably the most comfortable seat going for a 7. I had Tillet copies in my Westfield and everyone said and they not horrific, and I always described as like lying in the bath. Tweaking the suspension will be much more fruitful endeavor.
I do find the Tillets comfortable once I'm in, but its a right faff getting in and sorting the 5 point harness , as I end up sitting on at least one of the buckles every time. I wonder if the standard seats would be more easy to live with and better for my back in terms of getting jarred over the bumpy b roads.
Car doesn't have a cat so will smell more for sure.
Re the diff: talking to the owners last night the general soundtrack was all cars are different, I could go to a specialist and get one of them to come for a ride to get their take on it. Ideally I would like to get some rides in other peoples cars to understand but last night there was no opportunity. Its much better with ear plugs TBH. I notice that when in 6th gear it was much quieter, but then suffer a little for judders on trail throttle. Lower the gear the more noisy it seems - the car does have a lighten fly wheel which I read does not help.
Car doesn't have a cat so will smell more for sure.
Re the diff: talking to the owners last night the general soundtrack was all cars are different, I could go to a specialist and get one of them to come for a ride to get their take on it. Ideally I would like to get some rides in other peoples cars to understand but last night there was no opportunity. Its much better with ear plugs TBH. I notice that when in 6th gear it was much quieter, but then suffer a little for judders on trail throttle. Lower the gear the more noisy it seems - the car does have a lighten fly wheel which I read does not help.
Gassing Station | Caterham | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff