caterham advise
Discussion
hi, firstly what a great site this is, i am glad to have found the forum aspect of this site also, i have spend alot of time drooling over the caterhams on here (not to the delight of the other half). me and my brother are in the fact finding stages of buying a caterham with a look to buy one as soon as the right one appears. i have been reading back through this site for relevant information to help us. The car will be used for sunday drives with occasional trackdays and possibly a tour to the ring and spar thrown in next year for my 30th birthday.
the budget is 30k at the most.
i have always wanted a superlight as they look the business in my eyes (with maybe comfortable seats for the longer drives instead of these pieces of plastic they come with.
in the ideal world i would have a csr 200 as the 260 maybe a little to much for us and our ability. my brother would say other wise and say get the csr 260 or r500 (hes a figures man)
the plan is to visit caterham midlands to see what size chassis we are after. im 6"2 and 14 stone so either could suit us from what i have read on this site. what do you think?
i cant grasp the pricing structure of these cars at all, so many different specs......
after a quick search i have found these and wonder what your thoughts are on the cars specs and prices
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4240881.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4221745.htm - this looks stunning but the gearbox is all to hard core for us i think
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4178959.htm - this looks good to me ( should i worry about the vhpd or with our budget should
we be focusing on the duratec engines?)
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4176098.htm which would you rather have this one or the vhpd above?
we will be having some tuition on how to drive them right as although we like to think of are selves as good drivers we know that these motors are no toys!
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4164642.htm - this seems cheap although i understand it is not registered.
if you were to purchase one of these cars for what we have in mind which would you pick and why?
thankyou in advance for the replys.
mike
the budget is 30k at the most.
i have always wanted a superlight as they look the business in my eyes (with maybe comfortable seats for the longer drives instead of these pieces of plastic they come with.
in the ideal world i would have a csr 200 as the 260 maybe a little to much for us and our ability. my brother would say other wise and say get the csr 260 or r500 (hes a figures man)
the plan is to visit caterham midlands to see what size chassis we are after. im 6"2 and 14 stone so either could suit us from what i have read on this site. what do you think?
i cant grasp the pricing structure of these cars at all, so many different specs......
after a quick search i have found these and wonder what your thoughts are on the cars specs and prices
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4240881.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4221745.htm - this looks stunning but the gearbox is all to hard core for us i think
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4178959.htm - this looks good to me ( should i worry about the vhpd or with our budget should
we be focusing on the duratec engines?)
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4176098.htm which would you rather have this one or the vhpd above?
we will be having some tuition on how to drive them right as although we like to think of are selves as good drivers we know that these motors are no toys!
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4164642.htm - this seems cheap although i understand it is not registered.
if you were to purchase one of these cars for what we have in mind which would you pick and why?
thankyou in advance for the replys.
mike
Having just bought a CSR 260 I'd certainly suggest an SV / CSR car. The R500 looks good but wrong gearbox... and lower value as not original Caterham. First off find out what size chassis you want, although for road use I'd definitely suggest SV width.
I'd also say the CSR does travel well on the road and deals with my bumpy B roads very competently. However I can't drive the swoopy dash ones so had to find a traditional dash...This will be converted to a digi dash this winter.
Have fun.
I'd also say the CSR does travel well on the road and deals with my bumpy B roads very competently. However I can't drive the swoopy dash ones so had to find a traditional dash...This will be converted to a digi dash this winter.
Have fun.
Remember the CSR (200, 260), the S3 (Superlights) and the SV are all totally different chassis, each with their own merits.
At 6'2" and 14 stone you would fit in an S3 car fine, although there's nothing wrong with getting an SV for practical reasons.
With your budget I'd be buying an R300 Duratec as a great all-rounder, bonkers performance, reasonable running costs, easy to live with day-to-day etc etc. The duratec is a tough old nail, fantastic power delivery and in an R300 it is near-standard, which means cheap consumables. I was a Caterham racing driver in a lower series and I struggled to get to grips with the performance even an R300 offers on track (it was wet Rockingham, mind, which is notoriously slippery).
As you suggest, invest in a load of driver training, road and track. Even with an R300 you will be 'in at the deep end' somewhat.
Don't underestimate the potetial of even the lower powered models.
At 6'2" and 14 stone you would fit in an S3 car fine, although there's nothing wrong with getting an SV for practical reasons.
With your budget I'd be buying an R300 Duratec as a great all-rounder, bonkers performance, reasonable running costs, easy to live with day-to-day etc etc. The duratec is a tough old nail, fantastic power delivery and in an R300 it is near-standard, which means cheap consumables. I was a Caterham racing driver in a lower series and I struggled to get to grips with the performance even an R300 offers on track (it was wet Rockingham, mind, which is notoriously slippery).
As you suggest, invest in a load of driver training, road and track. Even with an R300 you will be 'in at the deep end' somewhat.
Don't underestimate the potetial of even the lower powered models.
That's my R300 at the top of the list. Buy mine, buy mine.. I jest. 
If you have £30k to spend I would recommend the orange R400D. It's fairly rare to see new VHPD's these days. Also you WANT one with a 6spd box.
With your height, you might want to consider one with lowered floors. (I'm honestly not plugging my car)
If you have £30k to spend I would recommend the orange R400D. It's fairly rare to see new VHPD's these days. Also you WANT one with a 6spd box.
With your height, you might want to consider one with lowered floors. (I'm honestly not plugging my car)
Manchestergas said:
..with maybe comfortable seats for the longer drives instead of these pieces of plastic they come with.
Like most things in the Caterham world, people will either like them or hate them, fit in them or not, but IME the Tillett seats you refer are actually very comfortable and supporting especially combined with the OTC seat covers. Don't dismiss them until you've tried them. I'm quite happy to spend all day in one when touring.The R400D you have linked to I know very well : http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4176098.htm
This car is immaculate and Chris is a really decent chap with a very high attention to detail. The spec of the car is higher than it reads in his ad and is worth a call. If you get to meet him, ask about his work and the stuff he produces for his customers!
T
This car is immaculate and Chris is a really decent chap with a very high attention to detail. The spec of the car is higher than it reads in his ad and is worth a call. If you get to meet him, ask about his work and the stuff he produces for his customers!
T
"I'd also say the CSR does travel well on the road and deals with my bumpy B roads very competently. However I can't drive the swoopy dash ones so had to find a traditional dash...This will be converted to a digi dash this winter."
-So how does the dash type make a difference then mate?
"Having just bought a CSR 260 I'd certainly suggest an SV / CSR car. The R500 looks good but wrong gearbox... and lower value as not original "
. - I think the csr's are maybe out of our budget are they not? If the r500 engined sv had a more timmid gearbox I would have been viewing that bad boy! I understand it ain't an original r500 but that a side would you be worried about it. Can't see the person buying that loosing out at resale that much?
How much approx to change that gearbox for one more suitable? Also How much would you get for that box once out the car?
I don't think we will ever find the perfect car with out some compromises!
Any one had one re- painted and at what cost? ( my brother is fussy on colour)
I see past all that.
"Even with an R300 you will be 'in at the deep end' somewhat.Don't underestimate the potetial of even the lower powered models." - I think the r300 is the one in my opinion. My brother on the other hand has r500 on the brain which I have manage to change to r400.
He did get me thinking though as did this chap who obviously wanted more power after ownership for a given amount of time. ( note what he will part ex for)
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4048403.htm
A few guys have posted comments along these lines also on here.
"That's my R300 at the top of the list. Buy mine, buy mine.. I jest."
- nice motor mate
" fairly rare to see new VHPD's these days. Also you WANT one with a 6spd box."
Yep I think 6 speed is the way forward from what I've read.
If rover had not gone bump do you think it would still be all k series or would the duratec have taken over anyway?
( the ex girlfriend had an mg zf and although the engine was prone to problems so people say, god did it sing when it was up there in the revs ( almost as if it begged you to have it off the limiter.
"Don't dismiss them until you've tried them. I'm quite happy to spend all day in one when touring."
- very good point, they have not been dismissed however cc midlands Will fall out with me with all the info I need to acquire.
I feel like bloody johny 5 reading his books, input input! Lol
"The R400D you have linked to I know very well :"
- Very nice motor that, where abouts in the country is that?
When it comes to storage of these motors can anyone see a gated car port (roofed) being out the question if i was to purchase a cover for it also.
I don't have a garage for it But would however want to keep it in top condition.
Thanks for all the replying guys!
-So how does the dash type make a difference then mate?
"Having just bought a CSR 260 I'd certainly suggest an SV / CSR car. The R500 looks good but wrong gearbox... and lower value as not original "
. - I think the csr's are maybe out of our budget are they not? If the r500 engined sv had a more timmid gearbox I would have been viewing that bad boy! I understand it ain't an original r500 but that a side would you be worried about it. Can't see the person buying that loosing out at resale that much?
How much approx to change that gearbox for one more suitable? Also How much would you get for that box once out the car?
I don't think we will ever find the perfect car with out some compromises!
Any one had one re- painted and at what cost? ( my brother is fussy on colour)
I see past all that.
"Even with an R300 you will be 'in at the deep end' somewhat.Don't underestimate the potetial of even the lower powered models." - I think the r300 is the one in my opinion. My brother on the other hand has r500 on the brain which I have manage to change to r400.
He did get me thinking though as did this chap who obviously wanted more power after ownership for a given amount of time. ( note what he will part ex for)
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/4048403.htm
A few guys have posted comments along these lines also on here.
"That's my R300 at the top of the list. Buy mine, buy mine.. I jest."
- nice motor mate
" fairly rare to see new VHPD's these days. Also you WANT one with a 6spd box."
Yep I think 6 speed is the way forward from what I've read.
If rover had not gone bump do you think it would still be all k series or would the duratec have taken over anyway?
( the ex girlfriend had an mg zf and although the engine was prone to problems so people say, god did it sing when it was up there in the revs ( almost as if it begged you to have it off the limiter.
"Don't dismiss them until you've tried them. I'm quite happy to spend all day in one when touring."
- very good point, they have not been dismissed however cc midlands Will fall out with me with all the info I need to acquire.
I feel like bloody johny 5 reading his books, input input! Lol
"The R400D you have linked to I know very well :"
- Very nice motor that, where abouts in the country is that?
When it comes to storage of these motors can anyone see a gated car port (roofed) being out the question if i was to purchase a cover for it also.
I don't have a garage for it But would however want to keep it in top condition.
Thanks for all the replying guys!
CSR have two types of Dash either the modern swoopy dash which most were made with and is an optional extra, or alternately they can be bought with a normal SV dash either digi stack or analogue.
I personally don't like the look of the swoopy dash and my left knee catches the tube making it harder to get in and less easier to drive.
I therefore wanted a trad dash. There are very few digi CSRs out there so I bought a trad dash one, in itself quite rare and I'll change to the digi dash over winter. I might then have a rev counter that can keep up with the engine as the analogue one is pants....!
I personally don't like the look of the swoopy dash and my left knee catches the tube making it harder to get in and less easier to drive.
I therefore wanted a trad dash. There are very few digi CSRs out there so I bought a trad dash one, in itself quite rare and I'll change to the digi dash over winter. I might then have a rev counter that can keep up with the engine as the analogue one is pants....!
although not yet up for sale I have been seriously questioning myself if i really need my car .
Its a 12 plated R400 D superlight duratec in frozen white with carbon nose,carbon arches,carbon tillets,carbon dash,carbon aeroscreen,windscreen full weather gear, has Raceco 2.0 duratec 210bhp engine, with direct to head ITBS ,full Raceo exhaust system, 6 speed box, Lsd, 4 pots all the right bits and more, it is my dream spec car! Ive managed a pitiful 1,400 miles since it was registered in April this year, as you can imagine its still like new but have a few things going on at mo hence questioning if I need this at at the mo.
If I was to sell It would cost you top end of your budget of £30k to own it but I dont think you could buy one like this anywhere else for your money .
Ps. Ive owned a 300bhp duratec, and a 175bhp duratec and a Csr260 and this car to me is as good as it gets as a balance between a track and road car .
give me a shout if you interested 07976 401888
Its a 12 plated R400 D superlight duratec in frozen white with carbon nose,carbon arches,carbon tillets,carbon dash,carbon aeroscreen,windscreen full weather gear, has Raceco 2.0 duratec 210bhp engine, with direct to head ITBS ,full Raceo exhaust system, 6 speed box, Lsd, 4 pots all the right bits and more, it is my dream spec car! Ive managed a pitiful 1,400 miles since it was registered in April this year, as you can imagine its still like new but have a few things going on at mo hence questioning if I need this at at the mo.
If I was to sell It would cost you top end of your budget of £30k to own it but I dont think you could buy one like this anywhere else for your money .
Ps. Ive owned a 300bhp duratec, and a 175bhp duratec and a Csr260 and this car to me is as good as it gets as a balance between a track and road car .
give me a shout if you interested 07976 401888
Edited by JeffC on Tuesday 18th September 13:36
Just a few comments, I have a 2 year old Roadsport 150 - a model in the lower part of the Caterham food chain. I use it only on road due to a lack of track talent. All I would say is do not go too high a performance as a first car.
I drive a Mazda3 MPS day to day, this is supposed to be one of the higher power hatches (260+ bhp). Compared to the lowly Cat it seems like a wallowy, bimbling shopping trolley. It is not the top speed that impresses but the pin sharp handling, lightness & acceleration. Personally I find I have only just started to explore the envelope of mine. It may well be that going straight to the hairy chest reaches of the range may prove frustrating as the track may well be the only place you can fully utilise the performance safely (for you & other road users).
I'd concur that the sweet spot for road use is probably the 300 (175 Duratec etc), the 150 is a bit tempremental - there is a long thread on Blatchat about it. Also remember that comfort is a very relative concept in a Cat. Even with the comfy seats I need to be winched out after a few hours.
I drive a Mazda3 MPS day to day, this is supposed to be one of the higher power hatches (260+ bhp). Compared to the lowly Cat it seems like a wallowy, bimbling shopping trolley. It is not the top speed that impresses but the pin sharp handling, lightness & acceleration. Personally I find I have only just started to explore the envelope of mine. It may well be that going straight to the hairy chest reaches of the range may prove frustrating as the track may well be the only place you can fully utilise the performance safely (for you & other road users).
I'd concur that the sweet spot for road use is probably the 300 (175 Duratec etc), the 150 is a bit tempremental - there is a long thread on Blatchat about it. Also remember that comfort is a very relative concept in a Cat. Even with the comfy seats I need to be winched out after a few hours.
My first Caterham (back in 2000) was a 1997 1.6ss. After 10 years of happy motoring, I was looking for something with a bit more poke for trackdays. To be honest 140bhp was enough on the roads .. a nice level of power to weight and not getting into hyper speeds too quickly meant that after a few years the car felt part of me....and I could drive it fairly safely but swifly on the roads and on the "very edge" on track (well..if it was dry !). As someone else has said, don't underestimate the fun factor of lower powered cars, especially if this is your first foray into all things "7".
In 2010 I eventually sold my first love...and was in the same dilemma as you with similar budget.
R300 or similar ... would I be wishing for more....
R400 R or D ? would it be too much for me ?
R500 R : Really ?
I eventually went for an R400D (in Orange just like the one you have linked to). It is absolutely fantastic. To be honest, on the roads its way too easy to get into deep trouble in terms of speeds...but for the track it's ideal. The R500 was just too track oriented for me and I was concerned about reliability (see other threads). The R400D seems rock solid and I haven't had a problem with it since I bought it (it was 2 years old at the time).
Ref Seat comfort...I did Le Mans Track day this year and drove there and back...total of close to 1000 miles in 3 days, with Tillets. The only thing I needed to make it comfortable is a small cushion for the curve of my back, otherwise no problems at all (note I have lowered drivers side...I'm 6'1" and just over 14 stone.) Good luck !
The best option .... go and see as many as you can (club meets are good), sit in as many as you can, blag rides in as many as you can...then choose your spec and wait for the right car to turn up.....if you do go for R400D, that orange one looks very good.
In 2010 I eventually sold my first love...and was in the same dilemma as you with similar budget.
R300 or similar ... would I be wishing for more....
R400 R or D ? would it be too much for me ?
R500 R : Really ?
I eventually went for an R400D (in Orange just like the one you have linked to). It is absolutely fantastic. To be honest, on the roads its way too easy to get into deep trouble in terms of speeds...but for the track it's ideal. The R500 was just too track oriented for me and I was concerned about reliability (see other threads). The R400D seems rock solid and I haven't had a problem with it since I bought it (it was 2 years old at the time).
Ref Seat comfort...I did Le Mans Track day this year and drove there and back...total of close to 1000 miles in 3 days, with Tillets. The only thing I needed to make it comfortable is a small cushion for the curve of my back, otherwise no problems at all (note I have lowered drivers side...I'm 6'1" and just over 14 stone.) Good luck !
The best option .... go and see as many as you can (club meets are good), sit in as many as you can, blag rides in as many as you can...then choose your spec and wait for the right car to turn up.....if you do go for R400D, that orange one looks very good.
Thank you all for your replys, much appreciated! I can go have a chat with my brother now and show him all the posts.
Chris your motor is gorgeous I will show it to my brother as I'm away in Italy with him as of tomorrow for ten days.
Bone- I here what you are saying loud and clear my friend I think we are going to have to go drive a couple as I understand power is not what the caterham thrill is all about.
My bro on the other hand is power mad and 0-60 times are a biv thing to him, however i understand that It can be lethal in these cars when some body does not have the talent!
Thanks all.
Chris your motor is gorgeous I will show it to my brother as I'm away in Italy with him as of tomorrow for ten days.
Bone- I here what you are saying loud and clear my friend I think we are going to have to go drive a couple as I understand power is not what the caterham thrill is all about.
My bro on the other hand is power mad and 0-60 times are a biv thing to him, however i understand that It can be lethal in these cars when some body does not have the talent!
Thanks all.
Manchestergas said:
My bro on the other hand is power mad and 0-60 times are a biv thing to him, however i understand that It can be lethal in these cars when some body does not have the talent!
Thanks all.
Sounds a bit like my dad Thanks all.
He thinks a 1.6 Roadsport would be too slow for him. He's had Impreza's for years and doesn't seem to understand that 0-60 doesn't mean a lot for these cars! It's all about my feeling you get from them!
Agreed. And it's not really surprising how many people enter Caterham ownership with a car that essentially is too powerful and don't learn to exploit the merits of the car fully - then quickly sell them and move on. Start with a sensible power level, eg. 160bhp max but preferably a little lower, and learn to drive it! When was the last time you drove a 500kg rear wheel drive car with your bum less than 6" from the road? I started with 140bhp and I'm glad I did! I upgraded and eventually swapped for a faster car with 244bhp .... my conclusion is that for a road/occasional track car 200bhp is perfect, forget any other stats such as acceleration, top speed etc because they're irrelevant.
"Manchestergas" and a location of Cheshire suggests you're fairly close to a few of us .. I'm in Culcheth. It's unfortunate you're away - the MADS area of the L7C will be meeting in Daresbury village next Wednesday, again on 31st Oct if you want to join us for some tire kicking .... and a beer/grub of course!
Don't rush into ownership, the weather's hardly getting better so you have time to consider your choices and get a few rides out.
"Manchestergas" and a location of Cheshire suggests you're fairly close to a few of us .. I'm in Culcheth. It's unfortunate you're away - the MADS area of the L7C will be meeting in Daresbury village next Wednesday, again on 31st Oct if you want to join us for some tire kicking .... and a beer/grub of course!
Don't rush into ownership, the weather's hardly getting better so you have time to consider your choices and get a few rides out.
My road car (and also former track car) is a Megane 250 Cup. 250 BHP FWD, very easy to predict and relaxing/easy to drive, even on track.
I'm genuinely scared about tracking the Caterham for the first time as I'm not sure what to expect! I've got a few little jobs to do before it's ready (namely, throttle cable replacement, and possible pedal replacement as the cable attachment looks a little odd and modified).
Still, scary prospect since I'm new to RWD.
I'm genuinely scared about tracking the Caterham for the first time as I'm not sure what to expect! I've got a few little jobs to do before it's ready (namely, throttle cable replacement, and possible pedal replacement as the cable attachment looks a little odd and modified).
Still, scary prospect since I'm new to RWD.
Manchestergas - I have a CSR with flat dash as, at 6'5"', I sit with my knees raised and the swoopy dash gets in the way. It is not an issue in an SV as the pedals can be moved further away and my legs were straighter.
FramerateUK - don't be too worried on your first trackday. Just don't push it too hard early on, get some tuition (even getting someone in as a passenger for a few laps can help) and build speed through the day. If it is a club meeting all the cars will have similar speeds and are well behaved. If it is a mixed car day you will find there are plenty of cars faster than you on he straights, but you will catch them up in he corners. Before long you will find that you are one of the faster cars out there.
Oh, and remember to enjoy it, have a cooling down lap (for you and the car) and DON'T PUT THE HANDBRAKE ON when you get back to the paddock.
Steve
FramerateUK - don't be too worried on your first trackday. Just don't push it too hard early on, get some tuition (even getting someone in as a passenger for a few laps can help) and build speed through the day. If it is a club meeting all the cars will have similar speeds and are well behaved. If it is a mixed car day you will find there are plenty of cars faster than you on he straights, but you will catch them up in he corners. Before long you will find that you are one of the faster cars out there.
Oh, and remember to enjoy it, have a cooling down lap (for you and the car) and DON'T PUT THE HANDBRAKE ON when you get back to the paddock.
Steve
Actually, if you have £30k to spend. I really don't understand why this hasn't sold.
http://pistonheads.com/sales/3936663.htm
http://pistonheads.com/sales/3936663.htm
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